Rail Passenger Service (Bethlehem, Denver: homes, neighborhood, purchase)

[pman]

Originally Posted by PacoMartin

The planned extension above Lansdale was shortened to only 8 miles and would stop Pennridge in summer 2011 because of low ridership potential. In other words it clearly won't get federal funding, so they are not even applying.

the extension needs to be bethlehem or bust. pennridge isn't a place, it's not a good place to terminate train service, and I'd imagine lots of people would still simply drive to lansdale. really, bethlehem should be a sort of baby bullet service (like CA's) or Keystone corridor type service that is hybrid intercity/commuter. only penndot or the lehigh valley can fund a study thanks to complicated federal rules. that leaves bucks looking at options for small extensions that don't make sense. according to the article I posted, a change in the planning commission is leading some to hope that restoration of lehigh valley service will be studied.

http://lansdale.patch.com/groups/aro...aker4d3c345483

Originally Posted by PacoMartin

The most populated area to have no passenger rail is Las Vegas, NV. In addition the passenger rail to Phoenix was discontinued and now stops in Maricopa, AZ (a 35 mile drive to Phoenix).

depends on how you define it, some people claim its columbus, OH. certainly columbus is much further from rail service than 35 miles. the claim here is that the LV is the most populous in the northeast without rail service.

[PacoMartin]

Originally Posted by pman

... the claim here is that the LV is the most populous in the northeast without rail service.

Well the original statement said "the country". As for Northeast USA, I would certainly agree with that statement. ABE is the 10th most populous urban area in the northeast, and the only one without rail service. Harrisburg is a smaller urban area, and has much better rail service.

18,351,295 New York--Newark, NY—NJ--CT
5,441,567 Philadelphia, PA—NJ--DE—MD
4,181,019 Boston, MA—NH--RI
1,733,853 Pittsburgh, PA
1,190,956 Providence, RI—MA
935,906 Buffalo, NY
924,859 Hartford, CT
923,311 Bridgeport--Stamford, CT—NY
720,572 Rochester, NY
664,651 Allentown, PA—NJ
...
444,474 Harrisburg, PA

There are estimates to extend the Raritan Valley line to West Trenton where it would connect to the West Trenton SEPTA station in NJ. See Alignment Map. Those estimates are as low as $215 million, which is a fraction of the estimates to extend the Raritan line from Clinton to Phillipsburg.

Both the West Trenton line, and the Phillipsburg line were operating up until the early 1980's.

Which project do you think NJ Transit will do first?

[pman]

Originally Posted by PacoMartin

Well the original statement said "the country". As for Northeast USA, I would certainly agree with that statement. ABE is the 10th most populous urban area in the northeast, and the only one without rail service. Harrisburg is a smaller urban area, and has much beter rail service

There are estimates to extend the Raritan Valley line to West Trenton where it would connect to the only SEPTA station in NJ. See Alignment Map. Those estimates are as low as $215 million, which is a fraction of the estimates to extend the Raritan line from Clinton to Phillipsburg.

Both the West Trenton line, and the Phillipsburg line were operating up until the early 1980's.

Which project do you think NJ Transit will do first?

actually i did say northeast but lets not quibble. perhaps the two agencies can manage to run the west trenton line through from ny. the dual modes open up new possibilities. theres no reason a dual mode hauled train from lehigh to philadelphia couldnt operate. an njt train terminating at wayne jct or powelton yard via west trenton would make a lot of sense. it once service was in place it wouldnt be terribly expensive to run lehigh to trenton service via jtown

[pman]

Originally Posted by BPP1999

Check out this link: Zoo tower

I know what Zoo interlocking is. It fascinates me.

I know this had nothing to due with the Reading Railroad. I am a huge supporter of SEPTA and would like nothing more to see increased funding, so there's no need for you to nitpick all of my posts. I keep adding disclaimers that I am not a rail expert for a reason.

My point re: redundance was that in some places 2 for-profit railroads competed with each other, while not we can't even get 1 publicly-funded agency to restore service due to funding constraints. It's sad.

ah i misunderstood your point. government is often highly dysfunctional and we all suffer from it.

[PacoMartin]

Originally Posted by pman

actually i did say northeast but lets not quibble. perhaps the two agencies can manage to run the west trenton line through from ny. the dual modes open up new possibilities. theres no reason a dual mode hauled train from lehigh to philadelphia couldnt operate. an njt train terminating at wayne jct or powelton yard via west trenton would make a lot of sense. it once service was in place it wouldnt be terribly expensive to run lehigh to trenton service via jtown

An AMTRAK train on Northeast corridor makes the following stops
PHILADELPHIA
TRENTON TRANSIT CENTER (mostly)
Metropark (sometimes)
Newark Intl. Air. (sometimes)
NEWARK PENN STATION (always)
NEW YORK PENN STATION

A NJ TRANSIT train on the Northeast corridor can make the following stops
TRENTON TRANSIT CENTER
Hamilton
Jersey Avenue
New Brunswick
Edison
Metuchen
Metropark (AMTRAK)
Rahway
Linden
Elizabeth
North Elizabeth
Newark Int’l Airport (AMTRAK)
NEWARK PENN STATION
Secaucus Junction
NEW YORK PENN STATION


My guess is that the hope is that some of the local traffic would migrate to the West Trenton line, and free up the Northeast Corridor for more trains with faster service and fewer stops.

[PacoMartin]

Public image (government website)

This map shows it better. The money to build the extension this way (to West Trenton) will serve far more NJ taxpaying citizens than an extension for more money to Phillipsburg. The Phillipsburg extension will mostly serve people in Pennsylvania, plus it will cost more.

The Phillipsburg extension is not even posted as a proposed project on the NJTransit website. But this extension to West Trenton.

So, if something happens to the line, it will be this extension.

[gwillyfromphilly]

Originally Posted by PacoMartin

Public image (government website)

This map shows it better. The money to build the extension this way (to West Trenton) will serve far more NJ taxpaying citizens than an extension for more money to Phillipsburg. The Phillipsburg extension will mostly serve people in Pennsylvania, plus it will cost more.

The Phillipsburg extension is not even posted as a proposed project on the NJTransit website. But this extension to West Trenton.

So, if something happens to the line, it will be this extension.

Is there any chance that SEPTA could run or at least share the tracks with NJT? The most similar example I can think of would be how NJT and Metro North share the same commuter rail line.

NJ TRANSIT Rail Lines Map

[PacoMartin]

Originally Posted by gwillyfromphilly

Is there any chance that SEPTA could run or at least share the tracks with NJT?

I would hope so. If they build the West Trenton extension in NJ, it would be crazy to have to change trains at the state border.

It would help to move the West Trenton station about a 1.5 miles to Scotch Road, and then it could service the Trenton Mercer Airport as well. I know they want to build a station somewhere there, but it might make sense to simply move the one that is already there.

People from Bucks County want to get to NJ all the time. If you have to disembark on the state border, and buy another ticket from another rail line, it wouldn't make sense.

[PacoMartin]

The first of 26 dual mode locomotives was finally deliver to NJ Transit. The authorities have agreed to try the trains for off peak hours on the Raritan Valley line.

It probably won't come as far as the Western stations, but it doesn't say for sure.

[2nd trick op]

Probably the greatest single obstacle here is that the public is far less connected with the realities, possibilities. and limitations of rail transportation than was the case a generation or two ago. Since 1945, rail employment has dropped by nearly 90%, and this effect is compounded by the point that the media have to tailor their message that includes far more women, teenagers, retirees and people raised in other cultures; also, the painful fact that when multiple states are involved, the politicians from both will invariably put their own agenda at the top of the list.

This is the result of circumstances beyond our control and I don't have a problem with it, but it makes it that much more important that when public input is sought, those of us who understand the difference between "pie in the sky and what the economy and technology can actually sustain make our voices heard.