Working vs Middle vs Upper Middle Class??? (New York, Hempstead: credit card, mobile home)

[nbres]

These areas are safely Upper Class:
Muttontown, Garden City, Upper Brookville, Sands Point, Brookville, Cold Spring Harbor, Lloyd Neck, Lloyd Harbor, Asharoken, Eatons Neck, Nissequogue, Old Westbury, Kings Point, Matinecock, Centre Island, Lattingtown, Oyster Bay Cove, Mill Neck, Laurel Hallow, Head of the Harbor, and Old Field.

Upper Middle Class: Munsey Park, North Hills, East Hills, West Hills, Dix Hills, Manhasset Hills, Manhasset, East Williston, Roslyn Heights, a lot of Great Neck, Jericho, a lot of Syosset, Woodbury, Huntinton Bay, Great River, parts of Stony Brook and Setauket, parts of Northport and perhaps some of East Northport, Centerport, Rockville Center, and Port Jefferson.

These areas can go in different ways depending on how selective the rating criteria, but are for the most part Middle Class: Plainview, Commack, Hauppauge, Smithtown, Half Hollow Hills, East Northport, Albertson, Lynbrook,
parts of Syosset, and Manorville?

Here is a list of what are definitely working class areas:
Levittown, Deer Park, West Babylon, Lindenhurst, North Babylon, most of West Islip North of 27A, Hicksville, Bethpage for the most part, Franklin Square, Selden, Centereach, Lake Grove, Port Jefferson Station, Coram, Ridge, Shirley, Medford, East Patchogue, parts of South Huntington, Mastic, Rocky Point, Sound Beach, Ronkonkoma, Lake Ronkonkoma, Bohemia, Islip Terrace, East Islip north of 27A, Islip north of 27A, Islandia, Holtsville, Farmingville, Holbrook for the most part, Patchogue, North Wantagh, North Bellmore, Massapequa Park, East Meadow, Valley Stream, Long Beach, parts of Mineola, parts of New Hyde Park, Carle Place, East Rockaway, Baldwin, West Hempstead, Farmingdale, parts of East North Port and even parts of Huntington, parts of Manorville, parts of Kings Park.

These areas are very low in class status: Elmont, Hempstead, Uniondale, New Cassel (sp.), Freeport, parts of Glen Cove, East Masssapequa, North Amityville, Copiague, Brentwood, Central Islip, North Bayshore, Huntington Station, Gordon Heights, North Bellport, Roosevelt and Wyandanch at the very bottom.

I know I left out many places so feel free to comment and debate.

[Rachael84]

Those towns you listed as middle class are probably considered upper-middle class. I know that when I told people I was from Smithtown, they thought I was rich.

[clamboy]

I agree on Smithtown....same with Stony Brook....Id also add Miller Place and Shoreham.

Rocky Point/Sound Beach are are now 1M plus on the water.
Still working class but the Land Rovers have recently arrived.
(There goes the neighborhood)

Basically anything North of 25a or South of Montauk is Money with very few exceptions.Theres also a few wealth enclaves up the middle Garden City/Dix Hills/Manorville come to mind.

If I were a betting man....

Smart money would buy the shores.

C

[birdrgal]

How do you know if you are part of the working class?
1. Look out your window, do you or any of your neighbors drive a pick-up, work-van or work-truck.
2. Are there any boats parked in front of any of the homes in your neighborhood. Do people work on their cars in their driveways or worse, in the street.
3. Do you or your neighbors smoke cigarettes in front of the house or worse, they smoke Parliaments. Filterless Chesterfields at least harken to the struggles of the World War II generation.
4. Do you have tatoos on your arms where others could see.
5. Can you wear a t-shirt, jeans, a baseball cap and boots to work or worse, do you have to wear a uniform to work. Perhaps a name tag.
6. Do you own a muscle car, motorcycle, or lower still a big rig 4x4.
7. Do you like Nascar, WWF, Bowling. Is there a bowling alley near you?
8. You have a glass cabinet in your house full of Disney collectibles, or Precious Moments Collectibles or some other mass produced collectible that you think will be worth money in the future.
9. Are you fat or I guess the politically correct term would be size challenged.
10. You wear legible clothing - as a walking free advertisement for the NY Yankees, Disney, Coke, etc...

I will probably get blasted for saying so, but IMHO nbres's checklist is dead-on accurate except for #9 (the weight issue). I can see some logic in the theory that middle/upper middle class people who might otherwise be overweight, have more disposable income to invest in health club membership, better diet, etc in order to get or keep to a healthier weight.... but I haven't heard of any studies saying that there is a higher percentage of overweight people in what's considered the working class versus the middle or upper-middle class (socioeconomically speaking). Not saying there aren't any such studies, only that I've never heard of any.

But as for the rest of the list... pretty darn accurate, I'd say. I wouldn't go into as much detail about the cigarettes, but from my days living in a working-class neighborhood I would be constantly irked at the people who thought there was nothing wrong with flicking cigarette butts all over front yards, sidewalks, driveways, streets... their own AND everyone else's. I once seriously considered putting up a sign saying "I don't use your yard as a toilet; please don't use mine as an ashtray" but realized that would probably only invite more problems!

[birdrgal]

nbres's town list is very very VERY accurate! Great work, really!

clamboy is 1001% right about the best neighborhoods being concentrated south of 27A and north of 25A. With the exception of places like Garden City, Woodbury, Old Westbury, and Dix Hills it's a challenge to find consistently upper-class neighborhoods toward the center of the Island (but who really wants to be within earshot of the LIE anyway?)

I didn't see Wading River on the list, but would classify it as middle to upper-middle depending on the neighborhood.

Poquott should definitely be added to the Upper Class list.

Water Mill, though I haven't been there in years, IMHO is upper-middle to upper (probably upper by now).

St. James is at least middle class, with many areas being upper middle.

Village of the Branch, which is part of Smithtown, definitely middle to upper middle (homes 750K-900K and taxes 15K and up).

Brightwaters south of 27A is upper middle around the lake, middle class elsewhere (but Brightwaters Farms is working class).

[VillageOfWestbury]

Originally Posted by nbres

These areas are safely Upper Class:
Muttontown, Garden City, Upper Brookville, Sands Point, Brookville, Cold Spring Harbor, Lloyd Neck, Lloyd Harbor, Asharoken, Eatons Neck, Nissequogue, Old Westbury, Kings Point, Matinecock, Centre Island, Lattingtown, Oyster Bay Cove, Mill Neck, Laurel Hallow, Head of the Harbor, and Old Field.

Upper Middle Class: Munsey Park, North Hills, East Hills, West Hills, Dix Hills, Manhasset Hills, Manhasset, East Williston, Roslyn Heights, a lot of Great Neck, Jericho, a lot of Syosset, Woodbury, Huntinton Bay, Great River, parts of Stony Brook and Setauket, parts of Northport and perhaps some of East Northport, Centerport, Rockville Center, and Port Jefferson.

These areas can go in different ways depending on how selective the rating criteria, but are for the most part Middle Class: Plainview, Commack, Hauppauge, Smithtown, Half Hollow Hills, East Northport, Albertson, Lynbrook,
parts of Syosset, and Manorville?

Here is a list of what are definitely working class areas:
Levittown, Deer Park, West Babylon, Lindenhurst, North Babylon, most of West Islip North of 27A, Hicksville, Bethpage for the most part, Franklin Square, Selden, Centereach, Lake Grove, Port Jefferson Station, Coram, Ridge, Shirley, Medford, East Patchogue, parts of South Huntington, Mastic, Rocky Point, Sound Beach, Ronkonkoma, Lake Ronkonkoma, Bohemia, Islip Terrace, East Islip north of 27A, Islip north of 27A, Islandia, Holtsville, Farmingville, Holbrook for the most part, Patchogue, North Wantagh, North Bellmore, Massapequa Park, East Meadow, Valley Stream, Long Beach, parts of Mineola, parts of New Hyde Park, Carle Place, East Rockaway, Baldwin, West Hempstead, Farmingdale, parts of East North Port and even parts of Huntington, parts of Manorville, parts of Kings Park.

These areas are very low in class status: Elmont, Hempstead, Uniondale, New Cassel (sp.), Freeport, parts of Glen Cove, East Masssapequa, North Amityville, Copiague, Brentwood, Central Islip, North Bayshore, Huntington Station, Gordon Heights, North Bellport, Roosevelt and Wyandanch at the very bottom.

I know I left out many places so feel free to comment and debate.

I think your list is directionally correct but has some issues. In my mind, many of these area straddle these "so-called" class lines. Garden City, for example to me, should straddle Upper-Class and upper-middle class. I could buy a small/modest home in Garden City for $550-$600K. You can't do that in Old Westbury...see the difference. Some towns have been lumped together, (in my opinion) unfairly. For example, Baldwin in general is middle class. Baldwin-Harbor probably straddles middle to upper-middle class. Many of the areas listed in working class might have been in it's original design only. However, if you buy and afford $450K or $500K home would you consider that working-class?

Some areas staddle several brackets depending on where you live in the area. The greater Westbury area is a perfect example of this. New Cassel (unicorporated section using Westbury zip) could be considered lower-class. The smaller homes in the west-village and just off Old Country road could be considered working-class. Areas north of the northern state (Wheatley Villa, The Hedges, Birchwood Knolls, Westbury Hills, Jericho Gardens, Campo Villa) comfortably fall into Middle and Upper-Middle class (home values between $500 and just over $1M).

How do I know...I live there. My immediate next door neighbors include an M.D. , Two self-employed business people....and myself a graduate degreed finance professional.

[nbres]

I did generalize with some areas. I agree, there are places that "straddle several" class "brackets depending on where you live in an area." Also, there are definitely examples everywhere of people living in neighborhoods that are either above or below their class. I suppose given enough time and input an entire guide to class and neighborhoods could be constructed for Long Issland.

The group that is hardest to pinpoint is the Middle Class. The Upper Class and Upper Middle Class is relatively easy to point out as are the working class
groups. I'm not sure about the following areas:

1. Manorville. New McMansions in the middle of nowhere far away from the urban cultural core of New York City certainly lowers its class status to just Middle Class and if we were to find out how people afford those McMansions, I would bet, that we would find a large number are plumbers, contractors, etc..Who are really part of the working class, but pretending to be upper class. Manorville - elite blue collar.

2. Garden City is definitely a classy area. It has the right WASP elements even if the area is not as WASPY as it once was. The Episcopalian Cathedral definitely left a lifelong impression on me - when I was a kid my WASP neighbor would bring me there every once in a while. Garden City does not descend any lower than Upper Middle Class.

3. Shoreham. Hmmm...Decommissioned Nuclear Power Plant. Homer Simpson must live close by. Mr. Burns is living far away in Jackson Hole, WY with money safely tucked away in the Cayman Islands. No need for Mr. Burns to worry about a radiation spill.

Any place that has the following within its zip code suffers in its class standing: Nuclear Power Plants or any other type of power plant, psychiatric hospitals, military bases, fundamentalist religious organizations of any kind, bowling alleys, drag racing tracks, OTBs, junk yards, and if you see pawn shops, well...

Of course the class standing goes up in any area if the following are present: horses, bridal paths, and stone walls. If the area is close to salt water - LI Sound being of higher class than the South Shore. Mainly because the North Shore is on a higher elevation. Thus, the principle of height and class comes into play. Upper Class people like to be able to look down on those below them - hence the upper middle class goes out of its way to emphasize they live in the North Hills, Dix Hills, etc...The upper class likes to seclude itself away in places with names unfamiliar to most of us.

4. Wading River. See #1. Same conditions different location.

5. Smithtown is for the most part Middle Class and Upper Middle Class, but I do know a Puerto Rican guy who drives a semitruck who lives there. Great guy, but he doesn't fit in - he wonders why his kids are doing poorly in school. So there probably is a fair amount of working class folk about in the greater Smithtown area.

What I write here is not meant to be prejudicial at all towards the Working Class. They are the heart and soul of this country and are good people. In this country to be designated Working Class is almost an insult, but in fact most Americans are working class and they do lead productive and worthy lives. The Working Class neighborhoods I listed on an earlier post are some of the best possible places to grow-up in and later raise kids in. Here are the Americans - flags flying out front, block parties, and kids catching fireflys on a humid summer night.

[clamboy]

I think youre right about the elite Blue Collar on LI.
We have our fair share of it too.


Contractors preying on the dual income (all hands on deck)households and reporting pennies to the IRS.

Sending their kids to College on Finacial Aid while stuffing a cool 100k+ under the mattress.

I hate those sons of bitches,they are equally to blame.(You can thank them for our current migrant worker fiasco)

You know the guy, the one with the Mullet, plumbers crack and The 60k Hummer with the dangling balls hanging from the tow hitch.

Class.

I'm no forensic accountant but wouldnt it be a safe bet that the Landscaper reporting 40k a year in income most likely wouldnt be living in a 900k home in Setauket.

Cant we just all pay our fair share?

Ya gotta love the S-corp....all the money you can hide.

Its like the IRS couldnt possibly cross reference Zipcodes with earnings. You'd think they'd have a copy of MS EXCEL kickin around with all that bean countin' going on. (I know they dont miss a cent of my money.)

I got news for you IRS ....They cant live in Mastic either on 40k.
Wake up.


It's complete BS.


C

[NickL28]

$80,000 is the minimum for one person anywhere in the NYC metro region is the minimum these days. Even paying $850 for an apartment in Flushing plus all the other expenses (no car payment even) was a struggle on $75,000 a year (at least I fell under rent stabilization). Plus, you see all these recent grads 'too cool for school' types with their many pair of $120 sneakers & $300 jeans.

On Long Island, $60,000 median income?? Are you nuts?? Who can live on that these days?? For a household with children you need at least $250,000 or more to be middle class unless you want to live in a tiny basement apartment.

And home prices are not falling but still rising by double digits and forget renting unless you can pay $1,500 a month for a tiny apartment.

[fopt65]

Originally Posted by clamboy

I think youre right about the elite Blue Collar on LI.
We have our fair share of it too.


Contractors preying on the dual income (all hands on deck)households and reporting pennies to the IRS.

Sending their kids to College on Finacial Aid while stuffing a cool 100k+ under the mattress.

I hate those sons of bitches,they are equally to blame.(You can thank them for our current migrant worker fiasco)

You know the guy, the one with the Mullet, plumbers crack and The 60k Hummer with the dangling balls hanging from the tow hitch.

Class.

I'm no forensic accountant but wouldnt it be a safe bet that the Landscaper reporting 40k a year in income most likely wouldnt be living in a 900k home in Setauket.

Cant we just all pay our fair share?

Ya gotta love the S-corp....all the money you can hide.

Its like the IRS couldnt possibly cross reference Zipcodes with earnings. You'd think they'd have a copy of MS EXCEL kickin around with all that bean countin' going on. (I know they dont miss a cent of my money.)

I got news for you IRS ....They cant live in Mastic either on 40k.
Wake up.


It's complete BS.


C

Don't forget, with their underreported income they can now sign up for Children's Health Plus, paid for by NYS via medicaid. Healthcare for the "poor" in Muttontown claiming 40K a year income.