Sorry, teachers, I just did the math and... (Hempstead, Oyster Bay: sale, bankrupt)

[BigMike50]

Originally Posted by Goodnight

The top pay of teachers in NY is well above 1.5X, average worker salary is around 50K and top teachers are well over $100K, over 2X. Yes LI is more expensive but the civil service salaries are greater multiples beyond the median salaries compared to places like Virginia.

Teachers should be above the median but not beyond the household income.

First of all top pay for teachers in NY aren't over 100k. I know teachers in New Paltz making 40k a year. Try Buffalo or South Hill or any where upstate and see what they are making.

The point is numbers can be manipulated. Like you could say NY per capita is 50k but isn't that including all of NY state not just L.I. Trust me there are a lot of lower income neighborhoods in the state of NY.

Ok being L.I. specific the teachers at top pay are at 100k again people are going to say the Per Capita Personal Income for people on the the island is 50k. But again you also have to take into account areas not so desirable and all the people on welfare and what not. It really brings down the average.

Lets use Garden City as an example...They list as the average per capita income as 53 k a year...so what you are saying is that a teacher making 100k doubles the per capita income of Garden City should have absolutely no problems living there on just that one salary alone? I call B.S.

I know some teachers on L.I. Most live modestly in 3 or 4 bedroom homes like most of the people I know on the Island even with their "huge" civil servant salaries.

[SilverBulletZ06]

Originally Posted by BigMike50

Well here where I live teachers make 60 k at top pay. In 2010,Virginia’s per capita income was $44,76. That's almost 1.5x Same goes for some of my friends out of state. For example in Delaware I know a teacher that made close to 70k and the per capita income is around 39 almost but not quite double. Like I said in-line Bottom line L.I. is an expensive place to live they(teachers) should be the top or near the top when it comes to salary. Ok making 100k here wouldn't be justified, do you understand?

You use all of Va 1 second, then the next post say that you need to use more area-centric figures.

According to the US Census suffolks median houshold income was 85K in 2008, teachers are pulling around 80K average themselves. Plus a benefit package that is 50% higher then average on top of that. Using Alexandra, VA (since i need to go there today) making average houshold income of 82K, but teachers in the area make on average 58K. Hmm....

[BigMike50]

Originally Posted by SilverBulletZ06

You use all of Va 1 second, then the next post say that you need to use more area-centric figures.

According to the US Census suffolks median houshold income was 85K in 2008, teachers are pulling around 80K average themselves. Plus a benefit package that is 50% higher then average on top of that. Using Alexandra, VA (since i need to go there today) making average houshold income of 82K, but teachers in the area make on average 58K. Hmm....

Originally Posted by BigMike50

Lets use Garden City as an example...They list as the average per capita income as 53 k a year...so what you are saying is that a teacher making 100k doubles the per capita income of Garden City should have absolutely no problems living there on just that one salary alone? I call B.S.

I know some teachers on L.I. Most live modestly in 3 or 4 bedroom homes like most of the people I know on the Island even with their "huge" civil servant salaries.

I guess you can't understand this, so I'll try it another way


Using Alexandra doesn't make sense in this case......Alexandra is a very wealthy suburb outside of D.C. not many teachers live there. Yes 58K you could pretty good in most of V.A. but not there, some places the per capita is 28k so the teacher's are double and living good.

It's like me saying the teachers on L.I. are making 110k and the per capita income in Hewlett Bay Park or Cove Neck is 110k(which it is) so shouldn't a teacher with their one salary alone afford to live there? Just like not many if any teacher live there ...the same goes for Alexandra........do you understand ?

According what you guys are saying by the numbers Household income/ per capita income a L.I. teacher on their salary alone should have no problem whatsoever living in any North Shore town such as Oyster Bay Cove(103K) North Hills(100K) Sands Point(95K) Centre Island (96k) Plandome (95K) but for some reason the teachers I know live in Valley Stream, Lynbrook, Oceanside, Baldwin, Wantagh, Framingdale far from the millionaire lifestyle this board portrays. Teachers can't afford z06's like you...that alone I wouldn't be complaining

You guy are too hung up on numbers....as you could see number don't tell the full story

[NYEconomist]

Originally Posted by BigMike50

I guess you can't understand this, so I'll try it another way


Using Alexandra doesn't make sense in this case......Alexandra is a very wealthy suburb outside of D.C. not many teachers live there. Yes 58K you could pretty good in most of V.A. but not there, some places the per capita is 28k so the teacher's are double and living good.

It's like me saying the teachers on L.I. are making 110k and the per capita income in Hewlett Bay Park or Cove Neck is 110k(which it is) so shouldn't a teacher with their one salary alone afford to live there? Just like not many if any teacher live there ...the same goes for Alexandra........do you understand ?

According what you guys are saying by the numbers Household income/ per capita income a L.I. teacher on their salary alone should have no problem whatsoever living in any North Shore town such as Oyster Bay Cove(103K) North Hills(100K) Sands Point(95K) Centre Island (96k) Plandome (95K) but for some reason the teachers I know live in Valley Stream, Lynbrook, Oceanside, Baldwin, Wantagh, Framingdale far from the millionaire lifestyle this board portrays. Teachers can't afford z06's like you...that alone I wouldn't be complaining

You guy are too hung up on numbers....as you could see number don't tell the full story

LOL...I know a teacher who has a ZO6. The problem is not really the teacher's salaries as I see it. They could do with a haircut, but they aren't as ridiculously out of whack like police salaries are. The problems are:

1. Pension costs are out of control. I don't mind the employer throwing in some money for retirement, but guaranteeing returns? c'mon.

2. Healthcare costs. These costs have gone up 3 fold in the past 10-15 years and they pay little to none of it.

3. Part time jobs. Less than 2000 hours a year is considered part time. The taxpayers pay a full time salary, but only get a part time worker.

4. No accountability. The teachers scream bloody murder the minute anyone mentions any type of quantitative measurement system.

[formyblog]

If you look up by school district and then sort by descending compensation you will see salaries above 100K. I checked Three Village few weeks back.

[AndreaII]

Originally Posted by BigMike50

First of all top pay for teachers in NY aren't over 100k. I know teachers in New Paltz making 40k a year. Try Buffalo or South Hill or any where upstate and see what they are making.

This is a Long Island forum, it's not for upstate NY. We live on LI, not in upstate NY. What we are concerned with here on Long Island is teachers' pay and benefits and how it affects our RE taxes - not the pay for upstate NY teachers where the cost of living is much lower than LI. Do YOU understand?

My husband and I are tired of having to save roughly $13,000 every year to pay our RE taxes, and $8400 of that goes into the teachers' salaries and pensions. We are tired of supporting them. Soon we won't be supporting them because we're planning on moving away to some place that won't be robbing us every year. That $8400/year would go a long way for us personally for our own retirement instead of our seeing it go to the teachers. After 10 years if we didn't have to pay out that $8400/year, we would have an easy $84K saved for ourselves for our own retirement.

On Long Island top pay for teachers easily exceeds $100K. In fact, $100K for a long-time veteran teacher on LI is laughable in 2011. Way too low. Just Google LI teachers' salaries per school district and you'll see their salaries for yourself.

I have personal friends who teach music on LI. Charlotte Johnson teaches chorus at Comsewogue HS - she teaches 4 classes a day, 180 days/year. That's 3/4 of a year's work. Right now she's making roughly $130K (plus benefits for her family) after teaching for 16 years. Her husband Paul, has been teaching in the same district at the elementary level for the past 7 years - Charlotte got him his job; he was a late bloomer at the age of 50 (he used to be a landscaper until he went to school and majored in elementary school education) - and he makes just under $100K, plus health benefits as well - their insurance benefits overlap. Obviously they pull in about $230K this year between them, and of course next year they will get their raises and will be making roughly $246K next school year. Charlotte complained to me last year they didn't have enough money to install a back door on their house. Yeah, right. God only knows what their pensions will be when they retire - and when those pensions are multiplied by the number of years they live, they're easily in the multiple millions. This of course doesn't include social security they will receive besides.

I don't know about you, but my husband and I will be lucky if we end up with a few hundred thousand saved up in our 401K for our retirement, and that has to last us the rest of our lives. Of course we will get social security too, just like the Johnsons, but we won't have their millions to retire with.

Another friend, Linda Contino, chorus teacher at Three Village's Ward Melville HS is making roughly $121k/year plus benefits - she's been teaching for around 18 years and teaches a full day, 8 classes/day. Her pension will be worth millions when she retires.

Amy Rosenthal, elementary school music teacher at Sachem SD at Hawkins Elementary School, teacher of 7 years, around 32 years old, teaches a full load per day now in excess of $100K plus benefits. Another up and coming wealthy teacher who has complained to me she doesn't make enough money.

These salaries of these people can all be looked up on line - the names are real. They are all still teaching on LI.

What's so great about these teachers? Why do they deserve their bloated salaries and pensions - guaranteed, no less? Why do the rest of us have to fork over our hard-earned money to support them and turn them into millionaires? This situation on LI sucks. I don't blame young people who aren't overpaid teachers and aren't other overpaid public employees for wanting to leave LI and live somewhere else where they don't have to support the public sector.

My husband in comparison to the above music teachers has been in the private sector in the IT industry for 31 years. He's been in middle management for the last 20 years. He works 50 weeks/year, makes roughly $110K/year, we pay $495/month for group insurance, and he has no pension. He does have a 401K and it certainly doesn't contain any where near the requisite $1.6 million is would take to match a teacher's guaranteed pension. My husband is typical of the pay scale for LI's private sector. At this point in time his compensation is quite a bit lower than a teacher's, plus there's no job security either. How is that in line with teachers' compensation here on LI? It's not. At all.

Teachers are paid way more than the private sector. Years ago it used to be the other way around - teachers were way underpaid. Then it evened out. Now teachers are the true wealthy with their guaranteed jobs, guaranteed 7% raises increasing exponentially, guaranteed pensions worth about $2 million at this point in time.

This is the situation on LI, not in upstate NY. Please don't confuse the two.

[SilverBulletZ06]

Originally Posted by BigMike50

I guess you can't understand this, so I'll try it another way


Using Alexandra doesn't make sense in this case......Alexandra is a very wealthy suburb outside of D.C. not many teachers live there. Yes 58K you could pretty good in most of V.A. but not there, some places the per capita is 28k so the teacher's are double and living good.

It's like me saying the teachers on L.I. are making 110k and the per capita income in Hewlett Bay Park or Cove Neck is 110k(which it is) so shouldn't a teacher with their one salary alone afford to live there? Just like not many if any teacher live there ...the same goes for Alexandra........do you understand ?

According what you guys are saying by the numbers Household income/ per capita income a L.I. teacher on their salary alone should have no problem whatsoever living in any North Shore town such as Oyster Bay Cove(103K) North Hills(100K) Sands Point(95K) Centre Island (96k) Plandome (95K) but for some reason the teachers I know live in Valley Stream, Lynbrook, Oceanside, Baldwin, Wantagh, Framingdale far from the millionaire lifestyle this board portrays. Teachers can't afford z06 like you...that alone I wouldn't be complaining

You guy are too hung up on numbers....as you could see number don't tell the full story

The entirety of your arguement is that teachers don't live in Alexandria... pray tell what magical palace are they living in? A town or two over, those are still in the DC area, still expensive COL, and still have reasonable teachers salaries.

Its funny you mention teachers living arangments. I am a medical professional, as is my wife. Our friend couples are NP/System manager, electrician/asst professor, corporate middle management/insurance saleswoman, and Public school teacher/Public school teacher. Now guess who bought the new 500K+ home in Smithtown and everyone else who bought fixer-uppers.

As for teachers inability to get a Z06, tell you what. We'll switch. I'll make their 80K/yr and they can make my smaller salary. Then they can work on average an extra 12.5 hour day every other week for 2 years to buy one too. Of course, that would mean holidays, weekends, nights, and summers. Dear god, not summers!

[BigMike50]

Andrea,

I lived on L.I. for almost 40 years. I paid almost twice ( two houses at one time) as much as you do in taxes. I didn't like either I moved and now save over 17k a year alone just in taxes. Complaining on here is going to get you absolutely nowhere . The same people blog the same stuff everyday for years and guess what ...the same will be happening years down the line.

You actually look up what your friends are making? Do they do the same for you? ..........Jealousy... is a mental cancer

I have friends that do well, very well......I say good for them..more power to them

[poletop1]

It is amazing how lowly Americans place the responsibility of nurturing the intellect of young Americans. Yes, pay them minimum wage! After all, we all had that one meanie teacher in high school, it is revenge time!

[SouthBound3]

AndreaII - You make some valid points and I could not agree with you more. The system is run by the same people who are economically benefiting from the legal and systematic raping of homeowners - via the confiscation of the money they earn from the sweat of their brow. The sad fact is that not a damn thing is EVER going to change on Long Island regarding education or the cost there of.
SO - the ULTIMATE vote - is with your feet. BigMike50 has it right! It's a large country we live in - and in spite of those that post here that would have you believe that Long Island is the only place worth living in the entire country - do some investigation of your own and move - that's what we are planning on doing.
Best of luck to you.