Are the police on Long Island overpaid? (New York, Glen Cove: relocating, property taxes)

[NY62]

Originally Posted by ClarkStreetKid

Everything has to be on the table, especially education if it makes up such a large amount of the taxes. People have to ask if they are really getting the value for their dollar and how much each extra percentage point in a schools GPA is really worth. LIers are so afraid of reducing any service even if it means they'll go broke paying for it. Look at anything that is not basic education and do triage. Sports, special ed, religious schools, BOCES, any extra that is not core to the majority of students hits the butcher block for trimming.

most of our taxes are school you are correct. Why trim the activities for the kids? almost every other state that has lower taxes have these activities yet there taxes are lower , why? the problem lies somewhere else. Why is it always we take from the kids? is that not what school is supposed to be about? Yes not everyone is involved in the extra activities but that is there choice. If my kids were not involved, I would not want it taken from the kids that are. Those activities help those kids stay out of trouble and focus on school for the most part, alot of kids that are not involved are hanging on the streets after school. and I am not saying all but alot are. colleges want well rounded students that are involved in these activities. Should we deny our kids when the rest of the country does not? We have always prided ourselves with the education our kids recieve here. Should we lesson that? The money is being wasted in other places. Have you ever seen a high school football stadium in other states? Ours are a joke compared to them. this is not where our money is going. This is what greedy people have done to our home and it is to late to go back and change it now, we either deal with it or move , no one ever gives back after they have gotten it, they may manipulate to make it look that way, but they never really give back.

[Jrprofess]

I am completely in limbo regarding this topic as to what is and is not overpaid for a person willing to put their life on the line, but there are a couple of things from this argument that bother me. For all of the cops and cop defenders who scream out "take the test!" as their defense, that is completely irrational unless you would like to guarantee that any person who applies and meets the basic qualifications is hired. Second, let's stop confusing non-tax supported jobs with tax supported positions. Two separate arguments. And third, the argument that if we paid even a nickel less our streets would somehow be much less safe. Nice areas in long island seem to be driven by the schools more than having a heavily armed police force patrolling for undesirables. Can anyone honestly say that even at the SAME pay rate as the city people would not flock to Long Island jobs in law enforcement compared to doing the same gig in nyc? Again, I am not sure how you put a price on this type of position, but since there already is one and we have the current comparisons of the city and our local economy as a context, I think long island could still get plenty of qualfied applicants for these positions if the pay was cut back to the levels in the city. Whether or not it is the right level of pay given the risk is another discussion.

[clamboy]

Originally Posted by Jrprofess

I am completely in limbo regarding this topic as to what is and is not overpaid for a person willing to put their life on the line, but there are a couple of things from this argument that bother me. For all of the cops and cop defenders who scream out "take the test!" as their defense, that is completely irrational unless you would like to guarantee that any person who applies and meets the basic qualifications is hired. Second, let's stop confusing non-tax supported jobs with tax supported positions. Two separate arguments. And third, the argument that if we paid even a nickel less our streets would somehow be much less safe. Nice areas in long island seem to be driven by the schools more than having a heavily armed police force patrolling for undesirables. Can anyone honestly say that even at the SAME pay rate as the city people would not flock to Long Island jobs in law enforcement compared to doing the same gig in nyc? Again, I am not sure how you put a price on this type of position, but since there already is one and we have the current comparisons of the city and our local economy as a context, I think long island could still get plenty of qualfied applicants for these positions if the pay was cut back to the levels in the city. Whether or not it is the right level of pay given the risk is another discussion.

Thank you.


Thats all I've been trying to say.



C

[Jrprofess]

Originally Posted by clamboy

Thank you.


Thats all I've been trying to say.



C

Why didn't you just say so...

[clamboy]

Originally Posted by Jrprofess

Why didn't you just say so...

I thought I did, apparently not.

I was starting to lose my mind with all the distortions and flawed logic of this board.

No one was getting what I was saying.

I was mereley questioning free market capitalism in regards to our local law enforcement(Not the value of a human life or the payscale of a Mechanic).

I asked two simple questions.

Are we being wasteful and overly generous with our tax dollars?
Could we attract comparable talent for less without compromising safety?

I think we are.
I know we can.

I also think that if we are to support this type of insanity we relinquish the right to bitc4 about high taxes.


Thank you VERY much Jrp.

C

[NY62]

Originally Posted by Jrprofess

I am completely in limbo regarding this topic as to what is and is not overpaid for a person willing to put their life on the line, but there are a couple of things from this argument that bother me. For all of the cops and cop defenders who scream out "take the test!" as their defense, that is completely irrational unless you would like to guarantee that any person who applies and meets the basic qualifications is hired. Second, let's stop confusing non-tax supported jobs with tax supported positions. Two separate arguments. And third, the argument that if we paid even a nickel less our streets would somehow be much less safe. Nice areas in long island seem to be driven by the schools more than having a heavily armed police force patrolling for undesirables. Can anyone honestly say that even at the SAME pay rate as the city people would not flock to Long Island jobs in law enforcement compared to doing the same gig in nyc? Again, I am not sure how you put a price on this type of position, but since there already is one and we have the current comparisons of the city and our local economy as a context, I think long island could still get plenty of qualfied applicants for these positions if the pay was cut back to the levels in the city. Whether or not it is the right level of pay given the risk is another discussion.

You have some valid points. But city people would not flock to the island for the same pay, because they cant. If they could flock they would be doing it now. You state private is different then tax supported why? People get up and go to work the same no matter who pays them. Should they be paid less because it is tax supported just because our tax dollar pays them? Every job is the same , we pay more for groceries because of the union jobs, we pay more for our cars , we pay more for everything because of peoples pay , we just tend to **** and moan because it makes are taxes higher. Do you think the price of groceries are rediculous? I do. what about just about anything else the prices are insane. We pay for all of those things, do we say the butcher is over paid? You all have no idea what the cops are doing on the streets in your nieghborhoods , undercover that you never hear about , that make it safe for you to sleep at night. Drugs would be far far worse then they are, and with drug addicts comes crime. You all just see the guy giving tickets. Would it be any different if they got paid less ? probably not. But they get what they get. You can not take it back. How would any of you feel if one day you went to work and your boss said, your pay is getting cut by a third, so we can give back to the customer? Be honest , you would tell him shove it. The question of this thread was are they over paid , not can they do the job for less, any job can be done for less ,labor wise . but can the people afford to do it for less is the question. 60k does not get you very far on the island. I am 100% with everyone on city cops pay, they are under paid, but that really has nothing to do with nassau and suffolk now does it? If we get everyone and I mean everyone to take a third pay cut then maybe we can get them to do it also, but then we really are not saveing because we will be making less. And what about the take the test theory? we all could have, no? of course we all would not get the job, just like any other type of employement, the five guys going for one spot , all are not getting it even if they all qualify. There are no guarentees in life , that is the way it is.
Starting pay is not all that high for suffolk cops, just so you know, there money comes the longer they are there just like any other job. One more thing those nice areas you talk about have more police presense then you think. Those areas have more then there share of drugs,and if you all think not, you have your head in the sand. You cant put a price on a job where you go out every day with a bulls eye on your back. And I am sure they fear for there families safety when they go undercover to stop the rampant drug problems. Think about it all before we want to pay them on the cheap.100k with over time is not to much. We forget they pay taxes to.

[clamboy]

Originally Posted by NY62

You have some valid points. But city people would not flock to the island for the same pay, because they cant. If they could flock they would be doing it now. You state private is different then tax supported why? People get up and go to work the same no matter who pays them. Should they be paid less because it is tax supported just because our tax dollar pays them? Every job is the same , we pay more for groceries because of the union jobs, we pay more for our cars , we pay more for everything because of peoples pay , we just tend to **** and moan because it makes are taxes higher. Do you think the price of groceries are rediculous? I do. what about just about anything else the prices are insane. We pay for all of those things, do we say the butcher is over paid? You all have no idea what the cops are doing on the streets in your nieghborhoods , undercover that you never hear about , that make it safe for you to sleep at night. Drugs would be far far worse then they are, and with drug addicts comes crime. You all just see the guy giving tickets. Would it be any different if they got paid less ? probably not. But they get what they get. You can not take it back. How would any of you feel if one day you went to work and your boss said, your pay is getting cut by a third, so we can give back to the customer? Be honest , you would tell him shove it. The question of this thread was are they over paid , not can they do the job for less, any job can be done for less ,labor wise . but can the people afford to do it for less is the question. 60k does not get you very far on the island. I am 100% with everyone on city cops pay, they are under paid, but that really has nothing to do with nassau and suffolk now does it? If we get everyone and I mean everyone to take a third pay cut then maybe we can get them to do it also, but then we really are not saveing because we will be making less. And what about the take the test theory? we all could have, no? of course we all would not get the job, just like any other type of employement, the five guys going for one spot , all are not getting it even if they all qualify. There are no guarentees in life , that is the way it is.
Starting pay is not all that high for suffolk cops, just so you know, there money comes the longer they are there just like any other job. One more thing those nice areas you talk about have more police presense then you think. Those areas have more then there share of drugs,and if you all think not, you have your head in the sand. You cant put a price on a job where you go out every day with a bulls eye on your back. And I am sure they fear for there families safety when they go undercover to stop the rampant drug problems. Think about it all before we want to pay them on the cheap.100k with over time is not to much. We forget they pay taxes to.

62 Youre missing the point (again).

Let me clarify one more time for the cheap seats.

Its not about buying power, the value of a human life or what a mechanic(or now a butcher) gets paid.

Its about what the market will bear.


C

[NY62]

whatttt??????? the question was are they over paid. No? Your missing the point. Your saying the market cant bear a cops salary , correct? I was saying why not if we can bear everything else? answer that if you can. You are singleing out one group , when there are alot more. Why? Just answer that . We will go back to teachers can they do the jobs for one third less? I am sure they could . could all people in our school districts do there jobs for one third less? I am sure they could and I am sure there would be plenty of people wanting to scoff those jobs up for one third less.But the question is could they afford to get paid less? I dont think so.really school taxes are the majority of taxes so saveing a third of that would help more then a third of a cops salary, their salaries do not make up the rest of are taxes, it is a very small part.So if we are talking what the market can bear, the market can bear the cops salaries, they cant bear the school tax burden though.

[clamboy]

62

Sorry I can get through to you on this one.

Its not worth dancing in circles with you on it.

Peace


C

[NY62]

We cant agree on all. That is what makes the world interesting.
peace to you.