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Old 11-21-2011, 02:48 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,416 posts, read 27,935,383 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pequaman View Post
What would be the motivation for this? It's definitely going to cost a lot more because you'd have to pay NCPD pay rates. The same goes for teachers. One way this would make sense is if you completely dissolve the NCPD and start from scratch at reasonable pay-scales. Otherwise go look at village taxes in villages that have their own PD (Malverne, Garden City, Lynbrook, Hempstead) ... it's like $3500-$5000 for village taxes in those villages. (compare to ~$500 village taxes in Massapequa Park which doesn't have its own PD).
I couldn't have said it better myself. If the Village I live in decided to create its own rinky-dink police force (with bloated compensation matching NCPD of course) I'd move. NCPD, Auxiliary Police, Public Safety, Code Enforcement, and the Civilian Patrol are doing fine. Why add super-expensive mouths to feed at the expense of only the Village residents? No way.
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Old 11-21-2011, 07:36 PM
 
Location: Long Island
29,547 posts, read 12,355,783 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pequaman View Post
No, I don't think it will make much of a difference in cost. There's definitely some waste, maybe a few too many admin and supts, but even cutting those few positions would not make much of a difference. Consolidating into county-wide districts will most likely worsen the majority of districts. It's not much cheaper in the biggest consolidated dysfunctional district (NYC), than it is in our larger LI districts> Spending per pupil in NY state districts | rocdocs.democratandchronicle.com





Local water & sanitation compared to most areas in the country, including NYC. According to this article New York City Water Rates Expected to Rise 11.5 Percent - New York Times, the average annual residential water bill for NYC was $699 in 2007 nonetheless. I pay a lot less than that through Massapequa Water District (probably half that in 2011)..most of it being on my property tax bill with 2 small semi-annual bills. Average water use.. and it's more of a 'use it or lose it' type deal.

NYPD's latest budget is around $4.2-$4.3 Billion. That's about 7 times the size of the budget dedicated to NCPD. Granted NYPD does have 15 TIMES as many officers ~35k vs 2.4k and 10x as many precincts... But it only serves 6 times as many people in NYC (8.2M) vs 1.3M in Nassau. Theyre pretty close actually in cost. NYC & NCPD (SCPD too) are all on the top 20 list of most expensive PDs. I don't know where the villages fall in but isn't the pay generally based on what the county going rate is for an officer?

I'm not sure on sanitation, but I can't imagine NYC provides as good service nor is as cheap as our local sanitation district. Aren't they like garbage nazis in NYC?? shaking bags and fining everyone that has metal or plastic in their bags... ?? Con Ed definitely surprised me too, but the point is that consolidating things doesn't make it cheaper; especially when you're dealing with UNIONS in NY and people milking taxpayers. I think it depends on the service as well. If you could find some concrete budget numbers to prove Fire is cheaper (I'm sure it is cheaper in NYC as we have Fire McMansions & Fire Escalades on LI) or any of the other services, that would be interesting to look at.
You can't compare NYC PD's budget to Nassau, the issues in a city are much different than places like the 5 towns, look at what is transpiring now with OWS, united nations visits, presidential visits, parades, terrorism. Secondly they do a fair job of controlling salaries compared to NCPD to say the least, imagine NCPD addressing those issues.

Relative to water districts, Long Island gets it's water from the ground, NYC on the other hand has an enormous reservoir system that extends up into Rockland County (there was an article in the paper last week about one of their reservoirs flooding a community), they have huge tunnels they need to maintain not to mention the system under the city, pipe breaks, etc. No comparison, same for sanitation. LI better be cheaper.

Truth is no one really knows what goes on in the districts, I recall the Great Neck Water Commissioner making $160K and hiring his son to replace him, how complicated can it be to run a water district in Nassau.

I keep hear from people all the time how great it is to have local control, problem is they don't pay attention, don't vote or attend meetings, in reality they couldn't even tell you what sanitation district they reside.
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Old 11-21-2011, 07:46 PM
 
Location: Long Island
29,547 posts, read 12,355,783 times
Reputation: 6111
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
I couldn't have said it better myself. If the Village I live in decided to create its own rinky-dink police force (with bloated compensation matching NCPD of course) I'd move. NCPD, Auxiliary Police, Public Safety, Code Enforcement, and the Civilian Patrol are doing fine. Why add super-expensive mouths to feed at the expense of only the Village residents? No way.
I'm not sure how the others are but Rockville Centre has around 20 police and fire over $160K and they have to pay taxes to NCPD central, one as high as $187K.
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Old 11-21-2011, 07:48 PM
 
1,935 posts, read 3,525,582 times
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I like the idea of the original post and I would like it taken further, I would like to see my street have it's own police force.
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Old 11-22-2011, 06:31 AM
 
2,748 posts, read 3,012,671 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
Yet another reason public sector unions have no place in the 21st century.
What are the other reasons?
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:03 AM
 
Location: Wallens Ridge
3,131 posts, read 4,116,341 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
Easy. The political connectedness and power of the unions.

Note how every single job EXCEPT public school teacher and police officer pays MORE in New York City than on Long Island. Considerably more.

Now why are these two professions' compensation flipped so that the ones working on Long Island are paid considerably more than the ones working in NYC?

The public sector unions in NYC are not as politically connected and powerful as the ones on LI. Therefore the members in NYC are not earning the "windfall" those on LI are.

Yet another reason public sector unions have no place in the 21st century.
There's a huge difference between "pays more" then "cost more" It cost the City of New York more than Nassau County per P.O. a huge amount more.

You have to look at the big picture not just that yearly article the runs in the Newsday that list the 50 highest paid county P.O.'s.

Lets put it this way so even the people on this board will understand, if the NCPD was run like the NYPD your taxes would be tripled.
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:06 AM
 
Location: Fifth moon from Nebula
160 posts, read 270,666 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMike50 View Post
There's a huge difference between "pays more" then "cost more" It cost the City of New York more than Nassau County per P.O. a huge amount more.

Could you explain this a little please?
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:08 AM
 
2,748 posts, read 3,012,671 times
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The NYPD pays much lower salaries and yet it still costs far more to operate. Guess paying people crap isn't necessarily the money saver people think it is.
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:08 AM
 
Location: Massapequa Park
3,173 posts, read 5,668,359 times
Reputation: 1349
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
I couldn't have said it better myself. If the Village I live in decided to create its own rinky-dink police force (with bloated compensation matching NCPD of course) I'd move. NCPD, Auxiliary Police, Public Safety, Code Enforcement, and the Civilian Patrol are doing fine. Why add super-expensive mouths to feed at the expense of only the Village residents? No way.
It's certainly a luxury to have your own village PD. If the village has the money and the residents want it, then more power to them. TBH though, the village pds on Long Island are no joke. They do not mess around and respond to calls amazingly fast, know most of the residents, know the areas like the back of their hands, love to generate revenue from non-village residents.. I see the appeal of it. It's just too expensive because of the NCPD-like-salaries.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
You can't compare NYC PD's budget to Nassau, the issues in a city are much different than places like the 5 towns, look at what is transpiring now with OWS, united nations visits, presidential visits, parades, terrorism. Secondly they do a fair job of controlling salaries compared to NCPD to say the least, imagine NCPD addressing those issues.

Relative to water districts, Long Island gets it's water from the ground, NYC on the other hand has an enormous reservoir system that extends up into Rockland County (there was an article in the paper last week about one of their reservoirs flooding a community), they have huge tunnels they need to maintain not to mention the system under the city, pipe breaks, etc. No comparison, same for sanitation. LI better be cheaper.

Truth is no one really knows what goes on in the districts, I recall the Great Neck Water Commissioner making $160K and hiring his son to replace him, how complicated can it be to run a water district in Nassau.

I keep hear from people all the time how great it is to have local control, problem is they don't pay attention, don't vote or attend meetings, in reality they couldn't even tell you what sanitation district they reside.
I know it's a little tricky comparing cities to suburbs and service to service, but you could make the argument that they cover almost the same amount of land area (NYC 468 sq mi vs Nassau 453 sq mi). So NYPD should cost a lot less per capita than NCPD (which it doesn't). Everything is expensive in NYC as it is on Long Island; a lot of people forget about the NYC income tax. Bottom line is while consolidating services looks great on paper and should theoretically save money through economies of scale, it just creates bigger bureaucracies, bigger, stronger unions, less accountability, more waste, etc. (eg- MTA, LIPA, NCPD, SCPD, NYCDOE) - in reality, greed takes over and services get worse.
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:10 AM
 
Location: Wallens Ridge
3,131 posts, read 4,116,341 times
Reputation: 17254
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon_Byrne View Post
Could you explain this a little please?
Sure why not I only done it a dozen or so other times! What's one more I'm a little busy put will give you the info in a little Gordo
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