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Old 02-26-2014, 04:45 PM
 
Location: Nassau
315 posts, read 437,410 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2011littlehouse View Post
Seems the killer is obsessed with prostitutes...
I doubt that the killer is obsessed with prostitutes. Prostitutes are often the victims of violent crimes because of the way they operate. They are solo, at night and trying to fly under the radar of law enforcement. The same conditions make them ideal targets for murder.

The number one factor in evading the police is time. The greater the window between time of occurrence and time of detection, the greater your chances of getting away with the crime.

If the serial killer was picking off soccer moms in populated areas, he would get caught right away.

As long as he keeps picking up pros and dumping them in rural areas he will continue to elude the police.
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Old 02-26-2014, 05:20 PM
 
Location: Planet Earth
1,474 posts, read 2,399,793 times
Reputation: 1466
Quote:
Originally Posted by GMalo View Post
I doubt that the killer is obsessed with prostitutes. Prostitutes are often the victims of violent crimes because of the way they operate. They are solo, at night and trying to fly under the radar of law enforcement. The same conditions make them ideal targets for murder.

The number one factor in evading the police is time. The greater the window between time of occurrence and time of detection, the greater your chances of getting away with the crime.

If the serial killer was picking off soccer moms in populated areas, he would get caught right away.

As long as he keeps picking up pros and dumping them in rural areas he will continue to elude the police.
You seem to know an awful lot about killing and getting away with it.
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Old 02-26-2014, 06:01 PM
 
2,268 posts, read 2,210,935 times
Reputation: 2637
The "modus operandi" (or at least what appears to be the "modus operandi" or the mode, manner, or method of operation) of the perpetrator(s) of these crimes seems to be just like that of serial killer Joel Rifkin (New York State's most prolific serial killer to-date), who only seemed to prey upon prostitutes or others who can be called "sex workers" . . . but we can't say for sure that he didn't prey upon any others as well. He is known to have killed at least 17 women between 1989 and 1993 (apparently or seemingly all prostitutes) in New York City and Long Island. Though he was apprehended on June 28, 1993 and sentenced in 1994 to 203 years to life in prison.

But I bring him up here because it says that some remains found are over a decade old and there may be others already found or to-be-found that will be determined to be even older (from the time of my typing of this text that you are reading now, it is 21 years now since he was apprehended and therefore had his life pursuit of killing ended). Can the authorities say with reasonable certitude that they know of ALL his murders committed during his history of crime? It says online (in Wikipedia) about Joel Rifkin:
Also, he is suspected by some to be responsible for some of the Long Island Prostitute Murders whose remains were found in March and April 2011, as four of his [known] victims' bodies were never found. In an April 2011 prison interview with Newsday, Rifkin denied having anything to do with recently discovered remains. Experts and victims' rights advocates, however, believe that Rifkin's recent statements have no value. Although Rifkin often hired prostitutes in Brooklyn and Manhattan, he lived in East Meadow, a suburban town on Long Island. <--- NOTE: I MYSELF INSERTED THE EXTRA WORD "KNOWN" IN THIS PARAGRAPH, AS IT IS POSSIBLE THAT ALL OF RIFKIN'S MURDER VICTIMS MAY NOT BE KNOWN OF (AT PRESENT).
Or it might (or might not) be the case that one or more of those found bodies are Rifkin's victims and then the others aren't . . . meaning the others not attributable to Rifkin may be wholly independent of Rifkin or they may be "copycat killings" (i.e., inspired by him, to whatever degree).


By the way, I happen to have known the woman who Rifkin himself says (and authorities tend to state as well) was his very first murder victim. She was killed by Joel Rifkin in 1989. I knew her in 1980 and apparently in the years after I had known her, she had become (unbeknownst to me) a hard-core drug addict and a street prostitute. Rifkin is said to have picked her up in the Lower East Side of Manhattan, drove her back to his mother's home in East Meadow, LI, NY, murdered her there, and then dismembered her and scattered her various body parts around downstate NY and then New Jersey. The remains of her head were found stuffed into a paint can in the woods of a southern New Jersey gold course in 1989 (the day after he left it there), her legs were left 80 miles north in New Jersey and found shortly after and matched by DNA to the head found in southern New Jersey, and her arms and torso were said to have been dumped in the East River around New York City (but never recovered). Yet the identification of her head (matched through DNA to the separately-found legs) wasn't positively identified and given a name until April 2013 (24 years after its initial finding).
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Old 02-26-2014, 06:23 PM
 
1,589 posts, read 2,053,008 times
Reputation: 1656
You guys will never catch me!

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA
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Old 02-27-2014, 01:24 AM
 
1,320 posts, read 1,515,940 times
Reputation: 1423
Quote:
Originally Posted by UsAll View Post
The "modus operandi" (or at least what appears to be the "modus operandi" or the mode, manner, or method of operation) of the perpetrator(s) of these crimes seems to be just like that of serial killer Joel Rifkin (New York State's most prolific serial killer to-date), who only seemed to prey upon prostitutes or others who can be called "sex workers" . . . but we can't say for sure that he didn't prey upon any others as well. He is known to have killed at least 17 women between 1989 and 1993 (apparently or seemingly all prostitutes) in New York City and Long Island. Though he was apprehended on June 28, 1993 and sentenced in 1994 to 203 years to life in prison.

But I bring him up here because it says that some remains found are over a decade old and there may be others already found or to-be-found that will be determined to be even older (from the time of my typing of this text that you are reading now, it is 21 years now since he was apprehended and therefore had his life pursuit of killing ended). Can the authorities say with reasonable certitude that they know of ALL his murders committed during his history of crime? It says online (in Wikipedia) about Joel Rifkin:
Also, he is suspected by some to be responsible for some of the Long Island Prostitute Murders whose remains were found in March and April 2011, as four of his [known] victims' bodies were never found. In an April 2011 prison interview with Newsday, Rifkin denied having anything to do with recently discovered remains. Experts and victims' rights advocates, however, believe that Rifkin's recent statements have no value. Although Rifkin often hired prostitutes in Brooklyn and Manhattan, he lived in East Meadow, a suburban town on Long Island. <--- NOTE: I MYSELF INSERTED THE EXTRA WORD "KNOWN" IN THIS PARAGRAPH, AS IT IS POSSIBLE THAT ALL OF RIFKIN'S MURDER VICTIMS MAY NOT BE KNOWN OF (AT PRESENT).
Or it might (or might not) be the case that one or more of those found bodies are Rifkin's victims and then the others aren't . . . meaning the others not attributable to Rifkin may be wholly independent of Rifkin or they may be "copycat killings" (i.e., inspired by him, to whatever degree).


By the way, I happen to have known the woman who Rifkin himself says (and authorities tend to state as well) was his very first murder victim. She was killed by Joel Rifkin in 1989. I knew her in 1980 and apparently in the years after I had known her, she had become (unbeknownst to me) a hard-core drug addict and a street prostitute. Rifkin is said to have picked her up in the Lower East Side of Manhattan, drove her back to his mother's home in East Meadow, LI, NY, murdered her there, and then dismembered her and scattered her various body parts around downstate NY and then New Jersey. The remains of her head were found stuffed into a paint can in the woods of a southern New Jersey gold course in 1989 (the day after he left it there), her legs were left 80 miles north in New Jersey and found shortly after and matched by DNA to the head found in southern New Jersey, and her arms and torso were said to have been dumped in the East River around New York City (but never recovered). Yet the identification of her head (matched through DNA to the separately-found legs) wasn't positively identified and given a name until April 2013 (24 years after its initial finding).
I understand what you're saying, but I have to disagree for a moment. Joel Rifkin's MO really isn't anything special. It's basically common sense...you prey on hookers because they fly below the radar and they're usually willing to take that chance to meet someone alone, etc. As for dumping the bodies, it's only natural to dump them in a desolate place like Gilgo beach. I would not be surprised at all to find out this was a separate serial killer.
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Old 02-27-2014, 05:16 AM
 
Location: Not where I want to be
4,827 posts, read 6,928,029 times
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If Joel Rifkin committed any of these murders, he would 'fess up to them. First, serial killers love to brag about all their kills after they are caught. Second, he has absolutely nothing to lose. He's never getting out of prison and he knows it.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:48 AM
 
2,268 posts, read 2,210,935 times
Reputation: 2637
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amisi View Post
If Joel Rifkin committed any of these murders, he would 'fess up to them. First, serial killers love to brag about all their kills after they are caught. Second, he has absolutely nothing to lose. He's never getting out of prison and he knows it.
Likely true. But then can we say we categorically understand the mind of a serial killer? They are not all the same. For instance, expert forensic profilers would interview Ted Bundy trying to find out about ALL his actual victims and he'd be, at times, playing with their minds and evasive (instead of simply coming clean and testifying to all that he could recall). And other serial killers have (at least at times) been similarly evasive . . . even while they were in prison and either on death row or committed for life and therefore never ever getting out).
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Old 02-27-2014, 12:00 PM
 
2,268 posts, read 2,210,935 times
Reputation: 2637
Quote:
Originally Posted by TransplantedFloridian View Post
I understand what you're saying, but I have to disagree for a moment. Joel Rifkin's MO really isn't anything special. It's basically common sense...you prey on hookers because they fly below the radar and they're usually willing to take that chance to meet someone alone, etc. As for dumping the bodies, it's only natural to dump them in a desolate place like Gilgo beach. I would not be surprised at all to find out this was a separate serial killer.
My thinking of Joel Rifkin was mostly focused on the fact that ALL the bodily remains discovered thus far were all found along remote areas along the south shore of Long Island (more importantly than the fact that they were seemingly all involved in the sex trade), which was Joel Rifkin's back yard. And then couple that with the fact that they were all (or nearly all) seemingly involved in the sex trade. I wasn't set in my mind on it being Joel Rifkin but thought it was rather suggestive of his M.O. -- although the disposal of said bodies did seem rather less methodical than his other bodily remains' disposals (i.e., with the others he disposed of, he pretty much took the time to scatter the body parts over varied distant locations or else he'd place the entire remains in a sealed barrel and dump it at sea or in a dump site . . . but then, near the end of his crime reign, he did just leave some remains intact but simply out in a field or woods somewhere, such as one whose whole deceased body was simply left on the ground under a discarded mattress). So maybe towards the end, he got looser and less fastidious in covering his tracks.

But, as you surmise, it does seem more probable that he is not responsible for them (or not all of them) simply because of the great passage of time since he was caught and permanently imprisoned.
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Old 06-27-2014, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
14 posts, read 29,542 times
Reputation: 25
Regardless of what anyone says, prostitutes have always been an ideal victim in terms of victimology. Here in Canada, Robert Pickton killed 49 prostitutes.

Prostitutes are typically estranged from their families, are not missed immediately, are often transient, and their nighttime operations put them at risk of being picked up by violent, sexual predators.
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Old 06-27-2014, 01:29 PM
 
1,589 posts, read 2,053,008 times
Reputation: 1656
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antonia1961 View Post
Regardless of what anyone says, prostitutes have always been an ideal victim in terms of victimology. Here in Canada, Robert Pickton killed 49 prostitutes.

Prostitutes are typically estranged from their families, are not missed immediately, are often transient, and their nighttime operations put them at risk of being picked up by violent, sexual predators.
Thanks for the fun facts.
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