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Taller buildings? Queens? BRING IT ON! Either you're growing or you're dying. That's economics. That is capitalism. There are PLENTY of LIRR downtown/main street areas that can handle EXPLOSIVE density growth and turn LI's economy around without making a dent in the mythical "unique suburban character" we cling to that is actually dying on the vine. Industry? Schools? All decline without ECONOMIC GROWTH. Weed choked former world class facilites and the disappearance of pro sports and industry is NOT GROWTH. It's death. The Nimby's can't croak or move on fast enough.
Sorry, but I couldn't disagree more.
Actually, I'm not so sorry. There's no place less prepared for high-density development than Long Island. Just left as it is, the infrastructure is vastly insufficient for the populace. Between crumbling roads and a commuter rail system that hasn't changed in a major positive manner for the last 50 years, this island is literally crumbling under it's own weight.
And there are no plans to revamp the bulk of the infrastructure. No fibbing politicians promising better roads, better commutes, better facilities. Because there's no money to made in maintenance.
The high and ultra-high density projects planned for LI are the last frontier for developers. And it's a major payday for the legions of crooked politicians, zoning board members, planning depts and zoning lawyers.
What I find so strange is that the average schmoe, such as yourself, doesn't see through the greed and run-away development. The obvious patronage and corruption.
Hopefully many of LI's retiring teachers and cops will choose to stay here and spend their millions on LI. Lord knows the rest of us will flee.
The long time problem with industry on Long Island is getting raw materials on and getting finished product off. Then there is the cost of land and electricity and you have a really tough time making a profit. Sadly Long Island's industrial days are behind it and it's time to look for new business opportunities.
I agree with much of what you've said here. If anyone here grew up in Nassau County, it's likely you knew someone or are someone who previously worked at Grumman. LI's business model included the interconnected industries involved. The newer LI business model? It would be nice to have one.
Quote:
For much of the Cold War period Grumman was the largest corporate employer on Long Island.[citation needed] Grumman's products were considered so reliable and ruggedly built that the company was often referred to as the "Grumman Iron Works".[4]
As the company grew, it moved to Valley Stream, New York, then Farmingdale, New York, finally to Bethpage, New York, with the testing and final assembly at the 6,000-acre (24 km2) Naval Weapons Station in Calverton, New York, all located on Long Island. At its peak in 1986 it employed 23,000 people on Long Island[5] and occupied 6,000,000 square feet (560,000 m2) in structures on 105 acres (0.42 km2) it leased from the U.S. Navy in Bethpage.[6]
The end of the Cold War at the beginning of the 1990s reduced defense spending and led to a wave of mergers as aerospace companies shrank in number; in 1994 Northrop bought Grumman for $2.1 billion to form Northrop Grumman,[6] after Northrop topped a $1.9 billion offer from Martin Marietta.[7]
The new company closed almost all of its facilities on Long Island and converted the Bethpage plant to a residential and office complex ...
Just left as it is, the infrastructure is vastly insufficient for the populace. Between crumbling roads and a commuter rail system that hasn't changed in a major positive manner for the last 50 years, this island is literally crumbling under it's own weight.
And there are no plans to revamp the bulk of the infrastructure. No fibbing politicians promising better roads, better commutes, better facilities. Because there's no money to made in maintenance.
The high and ultra-high density projects planned for LI are the last frontier for developers. And it's a major payday for the legions of crooked politicians, zoning board members, planning depts and zoning lawyers.
What I find so strange is that the average schmoe, such as yourself, doesn't see through the greed and run-away development. The obvious patronage and corruption.
Hopefully many of LI's retiring teachers and cops will choose to stay here and spend their millions on LI. Lord knows the rest of us will flee.
Pretty magnanimous and condescending for someone who endlessly contradicts themself. Classic Nimby head to toe. Vote against your interests and blame the govt. Vote against development and wonder where to get money for infrastructure. Fear change and wonder why all your pols and developers are corrupt. Cling to 1950's values and wonder why other places have explosive growth while the "bedroom community of the center of the cosmopolitan universe with nice beaches and all" slowly declines economically. The FACT is the ultra high developers (and new industry) run screaming from the permit process on LI because the Nimby's make every opportunity a living hell. Then there are the high costs. To get jobs we have to bribe businesses to hang around and eat their portion of the taxes. Brilliant. Bye bye Islanders, Coliseum, roads, LIRR, schools. Yet let taxes, ponzi pensions, speed cams, illegal dumping, strip malls, video slots and CVS proliferate. That is what happens when there is no plan for growth. That's a sound plan ya got there. Guess it takes an average shmoe to see past the Kate Murray stranglehold you hold dear. Yeah, decent downtown apartment developments would surely destroy the unique character of Sunrise Highway. Puh-leeze. Get out of the way and let the grown ups inject some life into this place. Maybe go read some of the illegal apartment threads to get you fired up for some development. Me, I'll take some nice 2 and 3 bedroom developments and siphon some of that Manhattan money again. Let me give you a clue...young professionals don't want Levitt homes with $13,000 taxes and can't afford a $5m Manhattan condo. They want nice clean new condo apartments near the train, decent schools and a manageable skip and jump to a Target. Where might they find something like that? Hmmmm?! I know: "development = greed, people = insufficient infrastructure for the populace." Same old tired Nimby cliches. If "it's crumbling under it's own weight"...why don't you want to fix it?! Are those problems being addressed now? Are infrastructure projects on the burner at all? Is magic pixie Mangano going to find some bag of money somewhere or is it more likely we redevelop here and there to attract some money from areas that are thriving?! A dozen more Huntington's, especially in Nassau would be a massive shot of adrenaline if done right. But you "classic Nimby's" would complain that in cleaning up the toxic waste, an elementary school might close and shift 175 kids 3 blocks away and that would inconvenience you and the teacher's union. BTW, those cops and teachers you're banking on are opening small businesses in Charlotte with their NY pension money. Wake up and smell their coffee shop. Or "NY Style" pizza place.
Pretty magnanimous and condescending for someone who endlessly contradicts themself. Classic Nimby head to toe. Vote against your interests and blame the govt. Vote against development and wonder where to get money for infrastructure. Fear change and wonder why all your pols and developers are corrupt. Cling to 1950's values and wonder why other places have explosive growth while the "bedroom community of the center of the cosmopolitan universe with nice beaches and all" slowly declines economically. The FACT is the ultra high developers (and new industry) run screaming from the permit process on LI because the Nimby's make every opportunity a living hell. Then there are the high costs. To get jobs we have to bribe businesses to hang around and eat their portion of the taxes. Brilliant. Bye bye Islanders, Coliseum, roads, LIRR, schools. Yet let taxes, ponzi pensions, speed cams, illegal dumping, strip malls, video slots and CVS proliferate. That is what happens when there is no plan for growth. That's a sound plan ya got there. Guess it takes an average shmoe to see past the Kate Murray stranglehold you hold dear. Yeah, decent downtown apartment developments would surely destroy the unique character of Sunrise Highway. Puh-leeze. Get out of the way and let the grown ups inject some life into this place. Maybe go read some of the illegal apartment threads to get you fired up for some development. Me, I'll take some nice 2 and 3 bedroom developments and siphon some of that Manhattan money again. Let me give you a clue...young professionals don't want Levitt homes with $13,000 taxes and can't afford a $5m Manhattan condo. They want nice clean new condo apartments near the train, decent schools and a manageable skip and jump to a Target. Where might they find something like that? Hmmmm?! I know: "development = greed, people = insufficient infrastructure for the populace." Same old tired Nimby cliches. If "it's crumbling under it's own weight"...why don't you want to fix it?! Are those problems being addressed now? Are infrastructure projects on the burner at all? Is magic pixie Mangano going to find some bag of money somewhere or is it more likely we redevelop here and there to attract some money from areas that are thriving?! A dozen more Huntington's, especially in Nassau would be a massive shot of adrenaline if done right. But you "classic Nimby's" would complain that in cleaning up the toxic waste, an elementary school might close and shift 175 kids 3 blocks away and that would inconvenience you and the teacher's union. BTW, those cops and teachers you're banking on are opening small businesses in Charlotte with their NY pension money. Wake up and smell their coffee shop. Or "NY Style" pizza place.
Bravo! Thanks & respect marigold! & this reminds me, does anyone remember Grumman's motto?
I can tell you one thing for sure. Those people who opposed Wal Mart from entering their communities did the right thing.
Wal Mart doesn't give two hooves about fair pay. And would have delivered a big hit to the lives, prosperity and ambitions of the East End town residents who would've gotten the superstore.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pholtor
I can tell you one thing for sure. Those people who opposed Wal Mart from entering their communities did the right thing.
Wal Mart doesn't give two hooves about fair pay. And would have delivered a big hit to the lives, prosperity and ambitions of the East End town residents who would've gotten the superstore.
Don't be so sure, NY State rules and regs will apply when it comes to hiring and salary practices. Will they bring living wages, that is doubtful because that type of work does not pay like teachers & public positions do; but no retail position pays much.
One thing I have observed at the Wal-Mart where I work is how they provide employment opportunities to a lot of people who wouldn't find employment at other stores. We have also seen where the store supports a lot of local charities including schools, food pantries and other community events.
To me Wal-Mart is just another store to go to on my lunch hour but when you look around how many stores like it are still around? Woolworths, Kmart, korvettes, Grandway are all pretty much gone or going. Local stores are fine if you can find parking, if their near where you work, if their price is worth it.
The town I work in fought Wal-Mart coming in but the biggest ones complaining was a local supermarket who had been around 90+ years and was afraid of the competition. I wonder did they fight every time a supermarket came to town there were two others when Wal-Mart entered the scene. They are still in business because the people who shopped thee always did and always will shop there, no businesses has gone out because of the new neighbor and it has been over 5 years now.
How long is that ride to the beach from Kansas? How long will it take to get to a Broadway show from Utah? If the things mentioned don't matter to you, fine. Friends and family aren't moving with you either.
Funny you should ask.
Broadway productions also tour. My good friend is in southern Utah and lives minutes away from an amazing natural amphitheater, Tuacahn. (Think along the line of Red Rocks, but more intimate.) There are museums, and other cultural amenities as well. For those of us who don't like the beach, being 7 hours away is not an issue. Her house is nestled at the foot of a butte; she has snow in the winters, an amazing waterfall in the spring and rain showers, and dry, hot summers. I love it out there and it is a consideration. Another of our friends put his home up for sale and is retiring to the same area, too.
Taller buildings? Queens? BRING IT ON! Either you're growing or you're dying. That's economics. That is capitalism. There are PLENTY of LIRR downtown/main street areas that can handle EXPLOSIVE density growth and turn LI's economy around without making a dent in the mythical "unique suburban character" we cling to that is actually dying on the vine. Industry? Schools? All decline without ECONOMIC GROWTH. Weed choked former world class facilites and the disappearance of pro sports and industry is NOT GROWTH. It's death. The Nimby's can't croak or move on fast enough.
We need the industry for people to work in to fill the taller buildings. Which is the horse and which one the cart? If we build it, will good paying jobs come?
The large developers are seeking tax abatements and other deals from local IDA's thereby spreading the liability further on the residents. How many carrots can we afford to dangle?
We need the bridge to CT more than anything. We need to be able to circumvent NYC in order to get raw materials onto the Island and products off.
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Grumman
Or "NY Style" pizza place. 
