Time to Consolidate Long Island Districts (Huntington, Smithtown: homes, preschool, vouchers)

[fopt65]

Originally Posted by rockypointny

We have a ton of family in Virginia and recently our close friends moved to Chesterfield County. Just so everyone knows, they researched the schools in Midlothian and found they were far superior to many Long Island districts. This just goes to show that the idea of Long Island having the best education system could very well just be ignorance.

And inferior to how many districts? No one on this forum to my knowledge has claimed LI has the "best" system. Proponents of the current system are merely happy with the system as it stands and before radical changes are made to the system would like some more info on the realities of making a change this monumental.

[ClarkStreetKid]

Does LI really have a school "system"?

[watamensch]

A FEW POINTS:

1. Long Island has a Catch 22.... whether you're a superintendent of schools or a janitor, it costs more to live here then virtually anywhere else in the US, so you need to be paid more money... because you're paid more money then counterparts elsewhere in the US, taxes are higher... which makes it more expensive to live here, and so on and so on.

2. An issue raised here is the disruption of classes by kids who do not behave or kids who are below average learners. How would consolidation cure this issue?

3. Superintendents run a "business" with thousands of customers, employees and a large budget. An EFFECTIVE management team at any large company would make several hundred thousand dollars, plus a car and other perks. In a competitive world, we should pay effective management teams and teachers well, but on the other hand schools should end tenure.

4. Is it clear that this will save money or level the playing field? Is there an example of a group of small districts that were consolidated? Was money saved, and more important... did scores improve?

5. What is the initial cost of the consolidation?

I am not sure if this is the right move, and I don't think anyone here can answer these questions.

[ClarkStreetKid]

Originally Posted by watamensch

A FEW POINTS:

1. Long Island has a Catch 22.... whether you're a superintendent of schools or a janitor, it costs more to live here then virtually anywhere else in the US, so you need to be paid more money... because you're paid more money then counterparts elsewhere in the US, taxes are higher... which makes it more expensive to live here, and so on and so on.

I was thinking about that too and how would turning teachers into state employees take care of that. Not good to get the salaries down but not have teachers afford to live there.

2. An issue raised here is the disruption of classes by kids who do not behave or kids who are below average learners. How would consolidation cure this issue?

No, but maybe enacting zero-tolerance policies for students who violate the school system’s code of conduct would fix that. As far as kids who are below average learners, almost half of all students are below average learners.

3. Superintendents run a "business" with thousands of customers, employees and a large budget. An EFFECTIVE management team at any large company would make several hundred thousand dollars, plus a car and other perks. In a competitive world, we should pay effective management teams and teachers well, but on the other hand schools should end tenure.

I think there has been some experimentation with this idea, but I'm not sure how it worked. If a business isn't doing well in an area they close the store in that area, you can't really do that with schools without effecting another school.

4. Is it clear that this will save money or level the playing field? Is there an example of a group of small districts that were consolidated? Was money saved, and more important... did scores improve?

I don't think a level playing field is possible because of local economic and social reasons, but the the goal could be to 1) save money and bring the poorer district's schools to being functional. I believe those goals are achievable over the long term with the right administrators.

5. What is the initial cost of the consolidation?

I am not sure if this is the right move, and I don't think anyone here can answer these questions.

But we can try can't we?

[LIMA]

Originally Posted by fopt65

Ever go down to 110 Livingston street in Brooklyn, headquaters of the BOE? You'll see more adminstrators than in all of LI. You'll see teachers getting paid to read newspapers because that is what happens when you lose local control over your school system.

Again...

My entire family is still in NYC, i pay more property tax then there property, state, and city tax combined...

So even with there BOE in place they still have money to let teachers sit and do nothing..... However do not think there is no teacher sitting doing nothing today..subs and other asst's, the same thing happens here except it's in each and every school and not at 1 admin building you can walk into and see, but they pay less for it...

I still think consolidate and go to pay roll also...

[fopt65]

Why don't we try consolidating our garbage districts first as sort of a dry run. Let's see how many, if any,employees are let go, how much money is really saved, and what we think of the change. I'd rather experiment on my garbage than on my kids!

[ClarkStreetKid]

Our garbage pickup is private. Heck we're so crazy down here sometimes we just take it once a week to the dump ourselves.

[TristansMommy]

Originally Posted by fopt65

Why don't we try consolidating our garbage districts first as sort of a dry run. Let's see how many, if any,employees are let go, how much money is really saved, and what we think of the change. I'd rather experiment on my garbage than on my kids!

Funny you should say that .. SPITZER. is working on that and there was an article on Newday today about this proposal he is working on with the budget that would eliminate special districts.

[nancy thereader]

Ever go down to 110 Livingston street in Brooklyn, headquaters of the BOE? You'll see more adminstrators than in all of LI. You'll see teachers getting paid to read newspapers because that is what happens when you lose local control over your school system.

Totally agree & if you can find anyone who is willing to break away from their conversations to actually speak with you, it would be a miracle. I say this as a city teacher who is retiring in June after 28 years !!!!! The kids are great, but everything else .....

[TeaJay]

Originally Posted by nancy thereader

Ever go down to 110 Livingston street in Brooklyn, headquaters of the BOE? You'll see more adminstrators than in all of LI. You'll see teachers getting paid to read newspapers because that is what happens when you lose local control over your school system.

Totally agree & if you can find anyone who is willing to break away from their conversations to actually speak with you, it would be a miracle. I say this as a city teacher who is retiring in June after 28 years !!!!! The kids are great, but everything else .....

Livingston St is a total mess! I sometimes think it's amazing that I ever got hired, as most of the people there didn't know what they were talking about (unless being sent from wrong office to wrong office was part of the secret initiation rite that they used after they made sure you had vital signs )

Regardless of how this consolidation thing goes, I know that NYC should not be used as any sort of model. They are re-organizing like mad, and the fiscal mismanagement is mind-blowing.

I still don't know exactly where I stand on this, but maybe the logical place to try this, instead of county-wide, would be by town (all the districts in the Town of Oyster Bay, for example.)