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Old 06-09-2019, 10:18 PM
 
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As an analogical story to what the OP brought up in his opening post (about Long Island-- actually Suffolk County --originally being part of Connecticut):

Parts of the U.S. state of OHIO (northeastern Ohio, including Cleveland and the surrounding region along Lake Erie (with that land area being referred to as the "Western Reserve" or the "Connecticut Western Reserve") belonged to the then Colony of Connecticut. Hence, a major prominent university in northest Ohio is, to this day, named "Case Western Reserve University" (in Cleveland, Ohio), It was a merger of Case Institute of Technolgy and Western Reserve University. Can you believe this (i.e., Connecticut owning part of the state of Ohio back then in colonial times)?


From Wikipedia: "The Connecticut Western Reserve" was a portion of land claimed by the Colony of Connecticut in what is now mostly the northeastern region of Ohio. The Reserve had been granted to the Colony under the terms of its charter by King Charles II. Connecticut relinquished claim to some of iits western lands (i.e., areas west of Connecticut) to the United States in 1786 following the American Revolutionary War and preceding the 1787 establshment of the Northwest Territory. Despite ceding sovereignty to the Unted States, Connecticut retained ownership of the eastern portion of its cession, south of Lake Erie. It sold much of this "Western Reserve" to a group of speculators who operated as the Connecticut Land Company; they sold it in portions for development by new settlers. The phrase "western Reserve" is preserved in numerous institutional names in Ohio, such as Western Reserve Academy, Case Western Reserve Univeristy, and Western Reserve Hospital."
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Old 06-10-2019, 09:43 PM
 
Location: Inis Fada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LINative View Post
I have family in Connecticut. So there is some connection for me. Plus we go there once in a while for short trips, probably more then we visit New Jersey. Mostly Mystic Seaport or the casinos. The ferry makes it easier.

However, overall I think most Long Islanders hail from the Brooklyn or Queens route. We think west-east and not as much north-south.

Anyway, its interesting to note that Suffolk means "Southern Folk" and at the same time 2 out of the 10 ten towns have "south" in the name, Southold and Southampton. I don't think it is an accident that the settlers in the 1600s choose names that emphasize that they were in the southern fringe of New England.
An interesting coincidence, however they chose the name Suffolk for the county because many of them were from Suffolk, England. Southampton was named for the Earl of Southampton; Southold may be a bastardization of Southwold. Names had nothing to do with these eastern LI colonies being on the southern portion of the New England colonies.

Did you know that the north fork colonies belonged to the New Haven colonies while the south fork colonies were part of Hartford-based colonies?
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Old 06-11-2019, 09:11 AM
 
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For anyone who'd like to learn a little bit of East-end history, while also reading a fantastic and funny novel, check out Plum Island by Nelson DeMille.
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Old 06-11-2019, 03:56 PM
 
Location: On the Great South Bay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave View Post
An interesting coincidence, however they chose the name Suffolk for the county because many of them were from Suffolk, England. Southampton was named for the Earl of Southampton; Southold may be a bastardization of Southwold. Names had nothing to do with these eastern LI colonies being on the southern portion of the New England colonies.

Did you know that the north fork colonies belonged to the New Haven colonies while the south fork colonies were part of Hartford-based colonies?
Actually I am not sure the names are coincidence at all. Over the years, I read similar reasons to what you mention, that the settlers choose names from where they were originally from back in England. However, the question is if that is truly accurate or whether some future local historian in the 19th century assumed that was the reason.

The problem is that the 1600s settlers came from different parts of England, so why did they just happen to pick a name with the word "South" in it? I don't believe it was just a coincidence. Instead I believe these early English settlers knew what they doing and that they deliberately picked Suffolk for instance, because it was the southernmost county.
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Old 06-11-2019, 05:11 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LINative View Post
Actually I am not sure the names are coincidence at all. Over the years, I read similar reasons to what you mention, that the settlers choose names from where they were originally from back in England. However, the question is if that is truly accurate or whether some future local historian in the 19th century assumed that was the reason.

The problem is that the 1600s settlers came from different parts of England, so why did they just happen to pick a name with the word "South" in it? I don't believe it was just a coincidence. Instead I believe these early English settlers knew what they doing and that they deliberately picked Suffolk for instance, because it was the southernmost county.
Suffolk means basically people of the south in the language of the Angles (an ancient form of English) when they first arrived in England. This was several centuries prior to the naming of Suffolk County on LI. By the time Suffolk County was named, the English settlers would not have been using the word "suffolk" to denote people of the south. Instead, if this was their intent, they would have called it "southland county" or "southton county" or maybe just "south county". For this reason, it was most likely a copying of Suffolk in England.

Last edited by 987ABC; 06-11-2019 at 05:49 PM..
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Old 06-11-2019, 06:50 PM
 
Location: The Twilight Zone
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Up until 50 years ago, there were still people on the east end speaking with a New England accent. There may be a handful left now. I know of one lady in her mid 90's who still retains some of the accent. Yahd. Cah. Etc...
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Old 06-11-2019, 08:01 PM
 
Location: Inis Fada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LINative View Post
Actually I am not sure the names are coincidence at all. Over the years, I read similar reasons to what you mention, that the settlers choose names from where they were originally from back in England. However, the question is if that is truly accurate or whether some future local historian in the 19th century assumed that was the reason.

The problem is that the 1600s settlers came from different parts of England, so why did they just happen to pick a name with the word "South" in it? I don't believe it was just a coincidence. Instead I believe these early English settlers knew what they doing and that they deliberately picked Suffolk for instance, because it was the southernmost county.
Griffin's Journal
https://archive.org/details/griffins...ifrich/page/16

Quote:
As they had now formed themselves into a society, it was deemed proper to give a name to the place chosen for their residence. The majority were for naming it "Southold:" and so it was set down, and so it yet remains...

There is a place in England -- about 100 miles form London -- called Southwold, and it is thought that some of these families came from that village or town...
Curiously enough, Southwold is in Suffolk County, England. It was also home to a number of Puritans who left England for the Massachusetts Bay Colony under Reverend Youngs in 1637/1638. Rev Youngs remained in the MBC until 1640, when his family along with 13 others, set sail for Long Island. Going back to the quote above, it would appear that yes, the original settlers, some of whom were from Southwold, England, gave that name to their settlement on Long Island.

Southampton's name does not appear to have any verifiable tales.

Quite a few names from early British colonial NYS were taken from British place names or were in honor of a nobleman or woman. One might believe they were currying favor.

Originally, the area we know of as Suffolk County was East Riding in York Shire -- which was formed in 1664. (West Riding was Staten Island and Brooklyn, North Riding was Queens, New York, Westchester.) It would be 40 years after Southold and Southampton were settled before the name Suffolk was given to the County.

Counties were not named until November 1, 1683 when the first colonial legislature abolished York Shire and the Ridings; York Shire was then divided into 12 counties -- the Province of New York. (Two of which are no longer part of NYS -- Dukes, which was some of the out islands off of MA, and became part of MA, along with Cornwall, which went to MA and later became part of Maine.)

The ten remaining counties within the Province of New York were:
  • Suffolk - was named after county of Suffolk in England.
  • New York - was named after King James II of England, who was Duke of York and Albany before he ascended the throne of England.
  • Kings - was named for King George the Third of England
  • Richmond - was named after Charles Lennox, First Duke of Richmond.
  • Queens - Named in honor of Catherine of Braganza, Queen of England.
  • Westchester - Thomas Pell settled there and called it West Chester. It was the westernmost camp of the New Haven Colony. The name "Chester" is derived from the Latin castrum, "camp."
  • Duchess [sic] -was named for Lady Anne Hyde, Duchess of York and wife of King James II of England.
  • Orange - was named for William of Orange, the king when county lines were drawn.
  • Ulster - was named after the Irish province of Ulster.
  • Albany - was named for the Duke of York and of Albany, who became James II of England.



And for giggles:
NASSAU:
In 1693, the Colonial Assembly named Long Island the Island of Nassau. Once Brooklyn and Queens joined NYC, the name was resurrected for the newy formed county.

Here's an 1804 map of the fairly new State of New York. You'' see both Nassau and Long Island as the Island's name.
https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/ser...-New-York---By
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Old 06-11-2019, 09:22 PM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
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Originally Posted by hotkarl View Post
Up until 50 years ago, there were still people on the east end speaking with a New England accent. There may be a handful left now. I know of one lady in her mid 90's who still retains some of the accent. Yahd. Cah. Etc...
That's impressive.
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Old 06-11-2019, 10:41 PM
 
Location: On the Great South Bay
7,492 posts, read 10,696,911 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave View Post
Griffin's Journal
https://archive.org/details/griffins...ifrich/page/16



Curiously enough, Southwold is in Suffolk County, England. It was also home to a number of Puritans who left England for the Massachusetts Bay Colony under Reverend Youngs in 1637/1638. Rev Youngs remained in the MBC until 1640, when his family along with 13 others, set sail for Long Island. Going back to the quote above, it would appear that yes, the original settlers, some of whom were from Southwold, England, gave that name to their settlement on Long Island.

Southampton's name does not appear to have any verifiable tales.

Quite a few names from early British colonial NYS were taken from British place names or were in honor of a nobleman or woman. One might believe they were currying favor.

Originally, the area we know of as Suffolk County was East Riding in York Shire -- which was formed in 1664. (West Riding was Staten Island and Brooklyn, North Riding was Queens, New York, Westchester.) It would be 40 years after Southold and Southampton were settled before the name Suffolk was given to the County.

Counties were not named until November 1, 1683 when the first colonial legislature abolished York Shire and the Ridings; York Shire was then divided into 12 counties -- the Province of New York. (Two of which are no longer part of NYS -- Dukes, which was some of the out islands off of MA, and became part of MA, along with Cornwall, which went to MA and later became part of Maine.)

The ten remaining counties within the Province of New York were:
  • Suffolk - was named after county of Suffolk in England.
  • New York - was named after King James II of England, who was Duke of York and Albany before he ascended the throne of England.
  • Kings - was named for King George the Third of England
  • Richmond - was named after Charles Lennox, First Duke of Richmond.
  • Queens - Named in honor of Catherine of Braganza, Queen of England.
  • Westchester - Thomas Pell settled there and called it West Chester. It was the westernmost camp of the New Haven Colony. The name "Chester" is derived from the Latin castrum, "camp."
  • Duchess [sic] -was named for Lady Anne Hyde, Duchess of York and wife of King James II of England.
  • Orange - was named for William of Orange, the king when county lines were drawn.
  • Ulster - was named after the Irish province of Ulster.
  • Albany - was named for the Duke of York and of Albany, who became James II of England.



And for giggles:
NASSAU:
In 1693, the Colonial Assembly named Long Island the Island of Nassau. Once Brooklyn and Queens joined NYC, the name was resurrected for the newy formed county.

Here's an 1804 map of the fairly new State of New York. You'' see both Nassau and Long Island as the Island's name.
https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/ser...-New-York---By

Suffolk - was named after county of Suffolk in England

Which leads back to what I am saying....

There are 48 ceremonial counties in England. But Suffolk is the ONLY county of the first 12 in New York named after one of these 48 traditional English counties. And the name chosen just happened to be a county which means "South" in Old English.

So Suffolk is the only county in New York named after an English county that just happened to be settled by English settlers from New England and that is directly south of New England? I say again, I do not think this is coincidence. I think it meant something to the people back then and was not just an accidental naming coincidence.

As for this Southold being a misspelling of Southwold, I am skeptical. These Puritan settlers you mention did not name their settlements in New England "Southwold" but wait until they get to Long Island? But even if Southold has been misspelled for the last 400 years (again I am skeptical), what proof do we have that the settlers simply did not pick the name because the word South is in it - whether Southold or Southwold? It just makes sense given the geographical position.
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Old 06-12-2019, 05:49 PM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
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I must say, the contributions on this thread have been quite interesting to read. Thank you to all who have participated so far.
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