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If it bothers you go start a thread. This is the "pick on teachers" thread.
Did you have a bad experience with a teacher at some point? Perhaps a reading issue? This thread is: Anyone here know the starting salary for a teacher in L.I?
Did you have a bad experience with a teacher at some point? Perhaps a reading issue? This thread is: Anyone here know the starting salary for a teacher in L.I?
Yes, I don't really care. It's a pittance of what I pay in taxes and if it brings revenue to the school (which it does by attracting out of state students and private program sponsors) then it's partially a wash and congratulations to him for working out that contract. JUST LIKE congratulations to the local teacher unions who worked out sweet contracts.
Gee I didn't know Binghamton was the champions of college basketball and that all the players made it to the NBA after..NOT. SUNY hardly attracts any students from out of state, especially for undergrad. Sorry to break it to you but a $700K basketball coach salary isn't bringing any outside revenue to the school and certainly not helping the city of Binghamton becoming prosperous again, more like a waste in taxes whether its 0.0001% or 60%. I find it hard to believe that people would think a SUNY basketball coach is worth 7x more than AP biology or special education teacher. But hey, in the U.S. we value sports and revenue more than school, no wonder why our education systems sucks compared to Europe and Japan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mongoose65
Ha! Like a teacher looking for a bump is going to study finance or medicine. That's hysterical. IF they chose those courses in the climate of the last 10 years it probably would have been approved. But why would they do that? That takes much more work than online secondary education courses designed to feed this system of pay and benefit enhancement. You're pretty naïve.
You're changing the subject. You said LI school districts will fund any masters or PhD education whether it's *relevant or not*, and I just pointed out that that is not true you are wrong. School districts only fund masters/PhDs related to education. School districts never have, presently don't, and never will fund masters/PhD outside the field of education or that teacher's speciality. FYI- the only public agencies that can fund medical research PhDs are the CDC, NIH, EPA, and FDA, certainly not LI school districts as you were indicating..but nice try though.
Speaking of changing the subject, such arrogance and rudeness to put down the education field and say that finance and medicine is more work. I work in healthcare and I can easily go around saying how other fields of work are easier, or how it's not fair that some of my CPA friends make more money than my friend who is a pediatrician (and yes, accounting is an easier field than medicine). But what's the point of that other than just being condescending and negative for the sake of it. Good for my CPA friends, I'm glad they're doing well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mongoose65
Mostly anecdotal but search all day long. Where do we rank nationally? Better than middle. Cost per student? In the top 3 or 5 (not going to waste my time providing you links, it's clear what you're on about and no proof real or anecdotal argument will change your mind). For the record, my district has zero drama or music until 5th grade and even that is extremely limited. Not nearly as robust as our schools in Brooklyn at much lower per-student costs. Why? Budget austerity EXCEPT FOR SALARY INCREASES AND PENSION OBLIGATIONS. Ask a taxpayer if the KG teacher should make $121k for 180 days per year or we should have music, drama and art. Let me know how the poll works out. Maybe do one right here on CD forum.
I didn't deny that some teachers make $121K, everyone in NY knows that. I wanted to know where are you getting the information that like 80% of the school budget goes to teacher salaries and pensions other than maybe negative Newsday. I'm not going to believe anecdotal and hearsay information from strangers on an internet forum, especially something that quantitative like that. I prefer 100% credible information from like the from the NYS government or a document from the school board itself. I've got standards when it comes to information.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mongoose65
Never compared the two in any way. Just another blind leap of irrationality on your part. I said our teacher's compensation is contributing to families leaving LI, benefitting new southern suburbs (some of which have schools ranked HIGHER nationally than LI schools at less than HALF the per pupil costs). Again, you hear what you want. Logic isn't important. Everything is an attack. "but CEO's get a gazillion dollars....yadda yadda yadda."
Most people leave LI because housing prices are outrageous for what you get, competition for well-paying jobs has become extremely competitve in NYC, traffic and congestion, lack of land, and general rat-race mentality according to all the ex-NYers I've met including some of my family members. And when did I say anything about CEOs getting "a gazillion dollars"?
Blind leap of irrationality? I'm sorry but Texas is not good for education, but neither is New York (only 34 out of 50 which means more than 50% of the states are better for education than New York). I mean you only need like a 20% to pass the biology and math regents in NYS, standards are terrible. Long Island probably has the best education in NYS, but that's not saying much since the standards are so low in NYS. So I have to live in NYS, I'll pay extra in taxes to get a better education.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mongoose65
Good for you. I know three personally. Again so naïve. With any state teaching certification it is extremely easy to get reciprocal certification in another state. A job? Not as easy, but certification. Piece of cake. Even NY which is the red tapiest [sic] of all. I know 1 in Florida, 1 in Texas and one in SC. One was an admin making $191k at retirement. Has a 6 figure pension. Now teaches nusic down in Florida. To third graders. My school doesn't even HAVE music for 3rd graders anymore. Fantastic, but I don't want to compare of course.
I shared my experience and you shared yours, ok fine. But you're making it sound like every LI teacher is retiring at age 50 with a $200K pension and easily getting a job in Florida the next year, yeah no. Lets be real here, most people retire from teaching at age ~60 and give up teaching for good.
Sorry that your school cut music, but NEWS FLASH schools throughout the U.S. have cut on arts and music, not just LI. And my nieces and nephews school still teaches music to 3rd graders, so you're experience with elementary music isn't generalizable to every school district on Long Island
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmrlongisland If it bothers you go start a thread. This is the "pick on teachers" thread.
Did you have a bad experience with a teacher at some point? Perhaps a reading issue? This thread is: Anyone here know the starting salary for a teacher in L.I?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmrlongisland
Did you have your funny bone removed?
AAAAhhh, I thought you were joking with your wild anti-teacher facts. Free medical, etc etc. Just takes me a while to catch on. Good ones.
Gee I didn't know Binghamton was the champions of college basketball and that all the players made it to the NBA after..NOT. SUNY hardly attracts any students from out of state, especially for undergrad. Sorry to break it to you but a $700K basketball coach salary isn't bringing any outside revenue to the school and certainly not helping the city of Binghamton becoming prosperous again, more like a waste in taxes whether its 0.0001% or 60%. I find it hard to believe that people would think a SUNY basketball coach is worth 7x more than AP biology or special education teacher. But hey, in the U.S. we value sports and revenue more than school, no wonder why our education systems sucks compared to Europe and Japan.
You're changing the subject. You said LI school districts will fund any masters or PhD education whether it's *relevant or not*, and I just pointed out that that is not true you are wrong. School districts only fund masters/PhDs related to education. School districts never have, presently don't, and never will fund masters/PhD outside the field of education or that teacher's speciality. FYI- the only public agencies that can fund medical research PhDs are the CDC, NIH, EPA, and FDA, certainly not LI school districts as you were indicating..but nice try though.
Speaking of changing the subject, such arrogance and rudeness to put down the education field and say that finance and medicine is more work. I work in healthcare and I can easily go around saying how other fields of work are easier, or how it's not fair that some of my CPA friends make more money than my friend who is a pediatrician (and yes, accounting is an easier field than medicine). But what's the point of that other than just being condescending and negative for the sake of it. Good for my CPA friends, I'm glad they're doing well.
I didn't deny that some teachers make $121K, everyone in NY knows that. I wanted to know where are you getting the information that like 80% of the school budget goes to teacher salaries and pensions other than maybe negative Newsday. I'm not going to believe anecdotal and hearsay information from strangers on an internet forum, especially something that quantitative like that. I prefer 100% credible information from like the from the NYS government or a document from the school board itself. I've got standards when it comes to information.
Most people leave LI because housing prices are outrageous for what you get, competition for well-paying jobs has become extremely competitve in NYC, traffic and congestion, lack of land, and general rat-race mentality according to all the ex-NYers I've met including some of my family members. And when did I say anything about CEOs getting "a gazillion dollars"?
Blind leap of irrationality? I'm sorry but Texas is not good for education, but neither is New York (only 34 out of 50 which means more than 50% of the states are better for education than New York). I mean you only need like a 20% to pass the biology and math regents in NYS, standards are terrible. Long Island probably has the best education in NYS, but that's not saying much since the standards are so low in NYS. So I have to live in NYS, I'll pay extra in taxes to get a better education.
I shared my experience and you shared yours, ok fine. But you're making it sound like every LI teacher is retiring at age 50 with a $200K pension and easily getting a job in Florida the next year, yeah no. Lets be real here, most people retire from teaching at age ~60 and give up teaching for good.
Sorry that your school cut music, but NEWS FLASH schools throughout the U.S. have cut on arts and music, not just LI. And my nieces and nephews school still teaches music to 3rd graders, so you're experience with elementary music isn't generalizable to every school district on Long Island
Fair enough. Some points you put too many words in my mouth I did not say.
1. Not sure why you insist on comparing SUNY to LI school districts. Egregious contracts are egregiopus contracts. Same problem.
2. I never implied 80% of budgets are salaries and pension (although it's pretty close). I said almost 100% of tax levy increases are for contractual raises and pension obligations. That is why taxes go up even with declining enrollments and reduced services.
3. Secondary education courses would in fact be more impressive than the bunk districts are paying for to pad teacher's grad credit portfolio. Newsday reported on it but it's hardly news. It's not condescending to call less than professional people out on their efforts to game a system to squeeze extra pay without really furthering their professional credentials. Of course it's not everyone, but it's not ME who is embarrassing their profession...it's their own colleagues. How LI teachers benefit from unusual raise system
4. What you say about home prices is completely accurate and relevant. Cost of teacher compensation directly affects that though as their contracts are based on "cost of living" for a family, even though a teacher is not "a family" but one salary. A loophole the union exploits at the taxpayers expense.
5. I pay for the better education too. I don't feel I'm getting the desired result for the outlay of cash and without being condescending I have not been particularly impressed with the level of professionalism from my kid's teachers particularly in light of their compensation. I consistently correct handouts and find mistakes on math and english assignments and have to apologize to my kid on the school's behalf. It's annoying and frankly a little embarrassing.
6. I realize programs are being cut in many places. But generally those places aren't shelling out $30k per student.
I am not attacking teachers...UNLESS they come on here and play "woe is me victim" despite being compensated wildly above market rates. They need to be professional, do a good job and suck up the compensation criticism. It's a good gig and supposedly a "profession they love." So take the cushy deal and humble up. It's not even about teachers. It's just another uber-powerful NY union digging in their heels and crying "unfairness" despite the pendulum having swung heavily in their favor.
For the record, our discussion has been civil and you make very valid points. I respect and appreciate your opinions. It's just an unsustainable mess that frustrates me and as you admit, we are not getting the desired results we deserve.
Last edited by mongoose65; 06-05-2013 at 08:18 PM..
Fair enough. Some points you put too many words in my mouth I did not say.
1. Not sure why you insist on comparing SUNY to LI school districts. Egregious contracts are egregiopus contracts. Same problem.
2. I never implied 80% of budgets are salaries and pension (although it's pretty close). I said almost 100% of tax levy increases are for contractual raises and pension obligations. That is why taxes go up even with declining enrollments and reduced services.
3. Secondary education courses would in fact be more impressive than the bunk districts are paying for to pad teacher's grad credit portfolio. Newsday reported on it but it's hardly news. It's not condescending to call less than professional people out on their efforts to game a system to squeeze extra pay without really furthering their professional credentials. Of course it's not everyone, but it's not ME who is embarrassing their profession...it's their own colleagues. How LI teachers benefit from unusual raise system
4. What you say about home prices is completely accurate and relevant. Cost of teacher compensation directly affects that though as their contracts are based on "cost of living" for a family, even though a teacher is not "a family" but one salary. A loophole the union exploits at the taxpayers expense.
5. I pay for the better education too. I don't feel I'm getting the desired result for the outlay of cash and without being condescending I have not been particularly impressed with the level of professionalism from my kid's teachers particularly in light of their compensation. I consistently correct handouts and find mistakes on math and english assignments and have to apologize to my kid on the school's behalf. It's annoying and frankly a little embarrassing.
6. I realize programs are being cut in many places. But generally those places aren't shelling out $30k per student.
I am not attacking teachers...UNLESS they come on here and play "woe is me victim" despite being compensated wildly about market rates. They need to be professional, do a good job and suck up the compensation criticism. It's a good gig and supposedly a "profession they love." So take the cushy deal and humble up. It's not even about teachers. It's just another uber-powerful NY union digging in their heels and crying "unfairness" despite the pendulum having swung heavily in their favor.
For the record, our discussion has been civil and you make very valid points. I respect and appreciate your opinions. It's just an unsustainable mess that frustrates me and as you admit, we are not getting the desired results we deserve.
Unfortunately, that has what NYS has become- a public sector economy (minus NYC). The public sector in NY is very powerful and only seem to care if NYC does well for business while the rest of the state can just screw themselves. Believe me I'm not happy to see public sector as the largest employer on Long Island, it's a disgrace that the largest employer in Buffalo is the public sector and the region continues to hurt for a good private sector market, that the COL on Long Island is amongst the highest and the median income is only $70-$80 while the SF Bay area has just as high COL and the average salary is $100K, the terrible micromanaging of local policy throughout the state, high taxes in dumpy cities that are doing nothing for the bette (ahem Hempstead, Troy, NY), high taxes everywhere you go with not much good in return..the list can go on as you know.
To me teachers are a dime in a dozen when it comes to what happens with NYS public sector workers. As for LI teachers, honestly I try to look at it both ways from both the general public and teachers themselves. I've never been a teacher, so I don't think I'm one to judge how challenging their profession is or not. I'm genuinely sorry your children's teachers are not good and I understand your frustration. I wouldn't look too much into it..like I said NY aka Tax York state really isn't that good for education and like everything else here the taxes are probably going to be high for it.
As for the OPs original question, I think the starting salary is like $60K for teachers on LI but I know it's difficult to get a teaching job on LI the last few years.
Last edited by ThinkingElsewhere; 06-05-2013 at 08:10 PM..
The starting salary of a teacher on Long Island is too high! That's why property taxes are so high in places like my hometown, and that's why middle-class people like myself can no longer afford to live there.
And then there's the teachers' pensions! God, will it ever end?
Pensions, not salary, are what are driving taxes up astronomically. In terms of what has been done over the last several years, the transition from Tier 4(3% contributions for 10 yrs, retire at 30yrs or 55) to Tier 6(6% contributions for entire career, retire at 30yrs or 62) will make the system more sustainable in the long term. Unfortunately, the only thing that can be done in the near term is contract negotiation on benefits(most contracts are now requiring significant medical contributions) and eventually offering a package to make teachers in tier 4 or lower retire earlier. Other than a complete revamp of the pension system(transition to a 401k plan or no retirement benefits) I don't see anything that can be done to reduce school taxes.
And can someone explain why police are exempt from Tier 6?
It's my observation that Long Island school districts are unlikely to hire a teacher with more than 3 to 5 years' experience. The reason is that state laws/union rules require the district to place them on the salary step they are on according to the number of years of experience they have, and this is a lot more expensive than hiring a new grad with an entry level salary.
If the Long Island and NYS educational system is supposedly so much better than its modern day counterparts in the Carolinas, Texas and Florida, then why is business and the economy declining here in the northeast and rising in the newly developing areas of the South? Surely large, multinational corps would not be moving to the south if the area lacked a well-qualified workforce.
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