Bail Out Failed (Clinton, Accord, Hope: mortgages, credit card, loans)

[At1WithNature]

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs." Thomas Jefferson, our 3rd President

"They may pass a law to issue paper money, but twenty laws will not make the people receive it. Paper money is founded upon fraud and knavery." George Mason in a letter to George Washington.

"The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either." Benjamin Franklin.

"For the love of money is the root for all kinds of evil.: 1 Timothy 6:10A

[Jrprofess]

Originally Posted by dman72

Even if I got that money right now, all that I'd do is pay down my mortgage with it. So, I'd be paying down debt and many people would just go out and buy a bunch of junk. This isn't about economic stimulus in the simplistic terms, it's about the economy functioning.

My comment was meant in some jest, but, this same government okayed money thrown from a helicopter earlier this year so in some ways giving every adult 85k would not be much different.

...To your point regarding you would pay down debt, others would buy junk...is it so crazy to disburse the money with pre-determined use? Say you must apply it only to certain financial vehicles initially: an IRA, consumer credit debt and/or mortgage related debt, 529 program, certain treasury/bond vehicles that lock you in for a defined period of time, or downpayment on a home purchase. Regulating this would be a bear, and again, I do not necessarily think this is practical, but one could argue it is no crazier than letting Paulson apply an awfully large checkbook at his whim. It would also allow the market to still work itself out, and we could put the regulatory oversight needed in place at the same time. There are a million reasons it would not work, but it might not be any crazie than what they have proposed.

[rocafeller05]

Thats exaclty how I look at it Jrprofess!!
Lets help out the little guy once in a while. Its always the big guy who gets bailed out.

[ClarkStreetKid]

Heck, the little guy (aka Mr. Main Street) is as much at fault as the Wall Streeters. People (rich and poor) have been living like there's no tomorrow, running up credit, buying houses they can't afford, living paycheck to paycheck. Let the stupid greedy people live with the chains they forged in their lives.

[nancy thereader]

But, some of us played by the rules, went without luxuries & saved a large % of our salaries in now decimated 401 Ks , paid off our mortgages early by scrimping ; we are all going to have to bail out those who didn't. I know it seems selfish, but I just wish there were another way.

[rocafeller05]

Here is the email :

I'M AGAINST THE $85,000,000,000.00 BAILOUT OF AIG!
Instead, I’m in favor of giving $85,000,000,000 to America in a “WE DESERVE IT DIVIDEND.”

To make the math simple, let’s assume there are 200,000,000 bonafide U.S. Citizens 18+.

Our population is about 301,000,000 +/- counting every man, woman and child. So 200,000,000 might be a fair stab at adults 18 and up..

So divide 200 million adults 18+ into $85 billion; that equals $425,000.00.

My plan is to give $425,000 to every person 18+ as a

“WE DESERVE IT DIVIDEND.”


Of course, it would NOT be tax free.
So let’s assume a tax rate of 30%.
Every individual 18+ has to pay $127,500.00 in taxes.
That sends $25,500,000,000 right back to Uncle Sam.
But it means that every adult 18+ has $297,500.00 in their pocket.

A husband and wife has $595,000.00.

What would YOU do with $297,500.00 to $595,000.00 in your family?

- PAY OFF YOUR MORTGAGE – housing crisis solved.

- REPAY COLLEGE LOANS – what a great boost to new grads!

- PUT AWAY MONEY FOR COLLEGE – it’ll be there.

- SAVE IN A BANK – create money to loan to entrepreneurs.

- BUY A NEW CAR – create jobs.

- INVEST IN THE MARKET – capital drives growth.

- PAY FOR YOUR PARENTS' MEDICAL INSURANCE – health care improves.

- ENABLE DEADBEAT DADS20TO COME CLEAN – or else!

Remember this is for every adult U S Citizen 18+, including the folks who lost their jobs at Lehman Brothers and every other company that is cutting back. And of course, for those serving in our Armed Forces.

If we’re going to re-distribute wealth let’s really do it, instead of trickling out a puny $1000.00 ( “vote buy” ) economic incentive that is being proposed by one of our candidates for President.

If we’re going to do an $85 billion bailout, let’s bail out every adult U S Citizen 18+!


As=2 0for AIG – liquidate it!

Sell off its parts.

Let American General go back to being American General.
Sell off the real estate.
Let the private sector bargain hunters cut it up and clean it up.


HERE'S MY RATIONALE: WE DESERVE IT AND AIG DOESN'T.


Sure it’s a crazy idea that can “never work.”
But can you imagine the Coast-To-Coast Block Party?


HOW DO YOU SPELL "ECONOMIC BOOM?"


I trust my fellow adult Americans to know how to use the $85 Billion "WE DESERVE IT DIVIDEND" more than I do the geniuses at AIG or in Washington DC.

And remember, the Birk plan only really costs $5 9.5 Billion because $25.5 Billion is returned instantly in taxes to Uncle Sam.

Ahhh... I feel so much better getting that off my chest.

[ClarkStreetKid]

Originally Posted by nancy thereader

But, some of us played by the rules, went without luxuries & saved a large % of our salaries in now decimated 401 Ks , paid off our mortgages early by scrimping ; we are all going to have to bail out those who didn't. I know it seems selfish, but I just wish there were another way.

Right Nancy. I'm one of those who is scrambling to make sure the money that we've saved is still mostly there at the end of the day. Right now my money is in three banks, one of which is Wachovia. After living comfortably, but well within my take home pay, it makes my blood boil when I hear that some idiot in DC wants to "bail out" some other idiot who ran up his credit cards, bought a fancy car and/or bought a house way beyond his means. Let them swing in the wind.

Something I want to see in any bill coming out of DC is getting rid of ARMs, Pick-A-Pays and any other mortgage that isn't straight up. If you can't afford to buy a house on what you make, you don't get to buy it anyway.

Who will bail the middle class out? -- Newsday.com

I've highlighted what concerned me in the article linked in below. Makes you wonder how many others around the country are living in a distressed household.
Study: More than a quarter of LI homes 'distressed' -- Newsday.com

The study analyzed the U.S. Census Bureau's 2006 American Community Survey data, focusing on families paying more than 30 percent of their income on monthly housing costs, such as rent and utilities, or mortgage, property taxes, insurance and utilities. It excluded highly paid professionals who "choose to be 'house poor' to live in upscale surroundings ... We narrow our focus to those families who live beyond the 30 percent standard by necessity rather than choice," the study said.

[nancy thereader]

I just thought of a perfect solution :

DEAR UNITED STATES of AMERICA ,

URGENT AND CONFIDENTIAL BUSINESS PROPOSAL

I AM MARIAM ABACHA, WIDOW OF THE LATE NIGERIAN HEAD OF STATE, GEN. SANI ABACHA. AFTER HE DEATH OF MY HUSBAND WHO DIED MYSTERIOUSLY AS A RESULT OF CARDIAC ARREST, I WAS INFORMED BY OUR LAWYER, BELLO GAMBARI THAT, MY HUSBAND WHO AT THAT TIME WAS THE PRESIDENT OF NIGERIA, CALLED HIM AND CONDUCTED HIM ROUND HIS APARTMENT AND SHOWED HIM FOUR METAL BOXES CONTAINING MONEY ALL IN FOREIGN EXCHANGE AND HE EQUALLY MADE HIM BELIEVE THAT THOSE BOXES ARE FOR ONWARD TRANSFER TO HIS OVERSEAS COUNTERPART FOR PERSONAL INVESTMENT.

ALONG THE LINE, MY HUSBAND DIED AND SINCE THEN THE NIGERIAN GOVERNMENT HAS BEEN AFTER US, MOLESTING, POLICING AND FREEZING OUR BANK ACCOUNTS AND EVEN MY ELDEST SON RIGHT NOW IS IN DETENTION. MY FAMILY ACCOUNT IN SWITZERLAND WORTH US$22,000,000.00 AND 120,000,000.00 DUTCH MARK HAS BEEN CONFISCATED BY THE GOVERNMENT. THE GOVERNMENT IS INTERROGATING HIM (MY SON MOHAMMED) ABOUT OUR ASSET AND SOME VITAL DOCUMENTS. IT WAS IN THE COURSE OF THESE, AFTER THE BURIAL RITE AND CUSTOMS, THAT OUR LAWYER SAW YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FROM THE PUBLICATION OF THE NIGERIAN BUSINESS PROMOTION AGENCY. THIS IS WHY I AM USING THIS OPPORTUNITY TO SOLICIT FOR YOUR CO-OPERATION AND ASSISTANCE TO HELP ME AS A VERY SINCERE RESPONSIBLE PERSON. I HAVE ALL THE TRUST IN YOU AND I KNOW THAT YOU WILL NOT SIT ON THIS MONEY.

I HAVE SUCCEEDED IN CARRYING THE FOUR METAL BOXES OUT OF THE COUNTRY, WITH THE AID OF SOME TOP GOVERNMENT OFFICIAL, WHO STILL SHOW SYMPATHY TO MY FAMILY, TO A NEIGHBOURING COUNTRY (ACCRA-GHANA) TO BE PRECISE. I PRAY YOU WOULD HELP US IN GETTING THIS MONEY TRANSFERRED OVER TO YOUR COUNTRY. EACH OF THESE METAL BOXES CONTAINS US$5,000,000.00 (FIVE MILLION UNITED STATES DOLLARS ONLY) AND TOGETHER THESE FOUR BOXES CONTAIN US20,000,000.00(TWENTY MILLION UNITED STATESDOLLARS ONLY). THIS IS ACTUALLY WHAT WE HAVE MOVED TO GHANA.

THEREFORE, I NEED AN URGENT HELP FROM YOU AS A MAN OF GOD TO HELP GET THIS MONEY IN ACCRA GHANA TO YOUR COUNTRY. THIS MONEY, AFTER GETTING TO YOUR COUNTRY, WOULD BE SHARED ACCORDING TO THE PERCENTAGE AGREED BY BOTH OF US.PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS MATTER IS STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL AS THE GOVERNMENT WHICH MY LATE HUSBAND WAS PART OF IS STILL UNDER SURVAILLANCE TO PROBE US.

YOU CAN CONTACT ME THROUGH MY FAMILY LAWYER AS INDICATED ABOVE AND ALSO TO LIAISE WITH HIM TOWARDS THE EFFECTIVE COMPLETION OF THIS TRANSACTION ON TEL/FAX N0:xxx-x-xxxxxxx AS HE HAS THE MANDATE OF THE FAMILY TO HANDLE THIS TRANSACTION.

THANKS AND BEST REGARD

MRS. MARIAM ABACHA

[dman72]

Originally Posted by ClarkStreetKid

Right Nancy. I'm one of those who is scrambling to make sure the money that we've saved is still mostly there at the end of the day. Right now my money is in three banks, one of which is Wachovia. After living comfortably, but well within my take home pay, it makes my blood boil when I hear that some idiot in DC wants to "bail out" some other idiot who ran up his credit cards, bought a fancy car and/or bought a house way beyond his means. Let them swing in the wind.

Do you really think that's what this is about?

[Jrprofess]

Originally Posted by dman72

Do you really think that's what this is about?

As it relates to the "mark to market" issue it is...as it relates to what we need to do to solidify things, maybe not. Pump up the FDIC instead.