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Old 03-18-2009, 07:39 AM
 
13,506 posts, read 16,960,844 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djdairyp View Post
===

Why does everyone think the details are secret and hidden. The details are public knowledge, you just have to know how to look. All you have to know is how long they have been teaching for and their level of education, assume its at least a masters, which it is if they have been there more than 3 years, and you will have a good ball park figure. Here are the numbers for every district on long island at every level.

nassau - http://www.lischooltax.com/06-7NasSal.pdf
suffolk - http://www.lischooltax.com/06-7SufSal.pdf
No, they want names so they can camp out in front of their houses!!
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Old 03-18-2009, 07:48 AM
 
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Originally Posted by tomonlineli View Post
You, deserve a raise and an applause. I feel for you, because teachers on Long Island will cite your situation and justify their grossly bloated salaries on account of experiences like yours.





I agree that teachers should live a comfortable life, but they shouldn't make double what the average salary for Suffolk County.



I don't see why a teacher should have a safety net that no one else in a capitalistic society has? Yes, they would end up being terminated when their production compared to their salary was no longer efficient for the taxpayers. I'm sorry, but this is a harsh part of the real world. If you don't produce comparative to your salary then you get fired! Why are teachers special?

That is definitely a disadvantage that hurts good teachers that are in demand. A High School Calculus teacher should not earn the same raise/salary as a 2nd grade teacher. That is where the real problem lies in the LI School District Model. The job market for a 1st grade teacher is fierce because it is an easy job and takes very little ability, which is illustrated by the throngs of 22 year olds who apply en masse to every opening for an elementary teacher. On the other hand, a HS science or math teacher are in high demand. Why should both jobs pay the same?
The second high lighted point is a good one.

The first is a joke. You're comparing what someone with no education makes compared to someone with a masters..how about comparing what other people with masters degrees are getting paid on LI to teachers? Here's a hint: it's not half.

Secondly, the average teachers on LI is a starting in the low 40s, within 10 years is making 65-80K, in 20 is making 100K and basically maxing out there. A very tiny percentage go higher because they have doctorates in high paying districts. A person with a 4 year accounting degree will progress further and higher than that if they are any good at all, and a CPA will do much better. CPA's in their late 20's are making 120K in many instances.

On the other hand, a cops base pay starts in the high 50's, and after 5 years is 98K, that's without a spec of overtime, no education requirement, and most average well over 100K after 5 years. Anyone flipping out over teachers salaries should be aware of this. If you want to pay teachers less, you should remove the masters degree requirement, and I'd agree it's ridiculous in most areas for it to be required.
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Old 03-18-2009, 09:55 AM
 
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While these are all valid arguments, let us not forget that these salaries are coming out of our tax dollars. Our school taxes are now over $8K a year. So when the teachers are looking for 5% raises, it's very frustrating because where is that money going to come from? Our taxes will be raised yet again. I'll also throw in that in this economy, most of us in the private sector are happy to have a job with or without a raise this year.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:01 AM
 
13,506 posts, read 16,960,844 times
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Originally Posted by NYTiz View Post
While these are all valid arguments, let us not forget that these salaries are coming out of our tax dollars. Our school taxes are now over $8K a year. So when the teachers are looking for 5% raises, it's very frustrating because where is that money going to come from? Our taxes will be raised yet again. I'll also throw in that in this economy, most of us in the private sector are happy to have a job with or without a raise this year.
I'm married to a teacher.

There should be no raises, I think most teachers realize this. In all fairness, many of my wifes co-workers have had their spouses lose jobs. Teachers usually do not live in one-income families.

Even without raises, taxes are going up, and many teachers have already gotten pink slips, and more will.

Police salaries come from the taxpayer and they are expecting a raise also, with no givebacks on healthcare.

MTA and LIRR salaries come from the commuter/taxpayer also.

People on LI are angry, and they find easy scapegoats in the teachers because the schools make up 60+% of the tax bill. Even if you laid off 5% of the teachers and froze all pay, you might STILL see a tax increase because of the states budget issues.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:29 AM
 
852 posts, read 2,011,767 times
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Default This is silly

Quote:
Originally Posted by nbres View Post
Long Island teachers want to keep it a secret.

They don't want the public to know how much they make.

If the public did know, there would be hell to pay.
Are you suggesting a conspiracy? How these people are paid is set in stone, and their contracts, which are public, lists how steps and lanes are accrued, and the dollar value for each.

Do a little research before spouting. It isn't that difficult. This doesn't even approach populist outrage. Populists come prepared to describe injustice; they don't just suppose the injustice is there.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:32 AM
 
852 posts, read 2,011,767 times
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Default Link pay to median incomes

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYTiz View Post
While these are all valid arguments, let us not forget that these salaries are coming out of our tax dollars. Our school taxes are now over $8K a year. So when the teachers are looking for 5% raises, it's very frustrating because where is that money going to come from? Our taxes will be raised yet again. I'll also throw in that in this economy, most of us in the private sector are happy to have a job with or without a raise this year.
Contracts should link pay to median incomes in the district. Give them a 5% raise, but when salaries stagnate - as they have since the 70s in real dollars - their pay increase would default to the lower percentage.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:35 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYTiz View Post
While these are all valid arguments, let us not forget that these salaries are coming out of our tax dollars. Our school taxes are now over $8K a year. So when the teachers are looking for 5% raises, it's very frustrating because where is that money going to come from? Our taxes will be raised yet again. I'll also throw in that in this economy, most of us in the private sector are happy to have a job with or without a raise this year.
I do agree that tax dollars do pay teacher's salaries, however, great quality teachers lead to a better education reputation. A better reputation with test scores to prove it make your home and area worth more money. There is a correlation. If you want a great school system, you need to have a competetive salary for people with a Master's Degree.

I am a teacher. I do think that the handful of school districts with contracts up this year should go a little lighter on the raise. Keep in mind that many people in the private sector are still getting raises, even with this economy. Teacher's aren't making so much money that they are not affected too.

Keep in mind, most teachers are not getting a 5% raise this year (or ever in a year) and that teachers need to work 20+ years and take numerous additional college classes to get to the high end of the payroll.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:37 AM
 
4,690 posts, read 8,714,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadPool1998 View Post
Contracts should link pay to median incomes in the district. Give them a 5% raise, but when salaries stagnate - as they have since the 70s in real dollars - their pay increase would default to the lower percentage.
It's hard enough finding competent teachers willing to work in low income districts. This would only make it more difficult.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:41 AM
 
659 posts, read 2,507,935 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadPool1998 View Post
Contracts should link pay to median incomes in the district. Give them a 5% raise, but when salaries stagnate - as they have since the 70s in real dollars - their pay increase would default to the lower percentage.
Although an interesting idea, I think education in middle to lower middle class areas would suffer greatly and many teachers would leave for higher paying areas. This would create total inequality in education and completely divide the island between rich and poor. Also, many working class towns have large amounts of salary off the books and illegal renters. It would be disastrous...but maybe it could be reworked. I just can't see a fair way of doing it.

The Jericho's and Roslyns would by far have superior teachers and your middle class districts to poor district couldn't keep up. Already there is some pay inequity, but not as much as this would cause.
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Old 03-18-2009, 10:45 AM
 
852 posts, read 2,011,767 times
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Default I agree...

Quote:
Originally Posted by llama8 View Post
Although an interesting idea, I think education in middle to lower middle class areas would suffer greatly and many teachers would leave for higher paying areas. This would create total inequality in education and completely divide the island between rich and poor. Also, many working class towns have large amounts of salary off the books and illegal renters. It would be disastrous...but maybe it could be reworked. I just can't see a fair way of doing it.

The Jericho's and Roslyns would by far have superior teachers and your middle class districts to poor district couldn't keep up. Already there is some pay inequity, but not as much as this would cause.
I have to grudgingly agree here. My wife won't apply for teaching positions in Brentwood because others have said it is a war zone. The pay is enticing though. Imagine if the pay dropped.

That's a problem for my idea. I'll have to think on it for a while.
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