Why do we need 126 school districts on Long Island? (Hempstead: insurance, gated)

[AlexisT]

Oh yes. Imagine the fun in Wheatley Heights as they're shaved off HHH and put in with Wyandanch. Talk about a nonstarter.

[nbres]

Originally Posted by AlexisT

Oh yes. Imagine the fun in Wheatley Heights as they're shaved off HHH and put in with Wyandanch. Talk about a nonstarter.

There is a moral point to consolidation besides the economic sense it makes and that is consolidation would be fair to all.

Every child deserves an equal opportunity.

If public education is the great equalizer and road to future success then it is morally indefensible to suggest that we keep the discriminatory educational system we presently have now on Long Island.

[AnthonyNYC]

No joke - I'll cut 23,000 jobs, Mayor Bloomberg warns

Mayor Bloomberg insists his threat to eliminate 23,000 city jobs unless Albany comes up with extra cash is no bluff.
"We're not bluffing about anything. We don't have any extra money," he said Sunday.
The mayor said Albany should divert a slice of money from the planned federal stimulus plan to support the city schools.
If not, the layoffs could include as many as 14,000 teachers.
"It would be cataclysmic," Bloomberg said.

[totallyfrazzled]

Originally Posted by nbres

If public education is the great equalizer and road to future success

That's an assumption, not a proven fact. There are many other things that contribute to a child's later success; public education is only one of them and IMHO not the most influential thing either.

But leaving that philosophical discussion aside and focusing on the original point: Everybody talks about how taxes would be lowered if districts were consolidated, etc etc. Hypothetically that would be true for those who lived in currently-high-taxed districts. But wouldn't the "leveling of the playing field" work both ways? Use the example of consolidating the adjacent Half Hollow Hills and Wyandanch districts. Wouldn't the taxes of those living in the "old" Wyandanch district rise from their present levels as well as those of the HHH residents go down? It might make the district more attractive to buyers but what about those who can barely afford the $3000-$6000 tax bill that's average for Wyandanch now? If consolidation raises THEIR taxes above their affordability threshold, they're going to be pushed out even as it becomes easier for the HHH taxpayers to remain.

btw, I disagree that LI's system is "discriminatory". No matter where you are in the USA, you're going to have better schools in higher-income areas and worse schools in low-income ones. That's not discriminatory, it's simply Life in the Real World.

[AlexisT]

Originally Posted by nbres

There is a moral point to consolidation besides the economic sense it makes and that is consolidation would be fair to all.

Every child deserves an equal opportunity.

If public education is the great equalizer and road to future success then it is morally indefensible to suggest that we keep the discriminatory educational system we presently have now on Long Island.

But that's 2 entirely different things. You could consolidate without ripping kids away from their existing schools. The problem above would occur if we forced district boundaries to align with town lines. Given the difficulties in changing district boundaries (it's not a simple procedure, AIUI) it would be better to just merge existing districts.

[I_Love_LI_but]

Originally Posted by totallyfrazzled

I know a lot of people who live in areas both on and off (mostly off) Long Island who pay a lot less in taxes than I did in the last couple of houses I owned. In all cases, at least 50% or more less. Did I often complain about how high my taxes are? Sure I did. But that doesn't mean I would ever consider for one minute relocating to where any of them live. The reduction in cost just wouldn't come close to compensating for the loss of other things that are important to me.

I feel the same way.

[llama8]

I wonder if consolidating HHH and Wyandanch will really bring equality. Wyandanch kids will still be zoned for their school and HHH would still be zoned for its school. Making it one district won't do anything. Even if Wyandanch schools get more money, the education, test scores, and culture of the school won't change. It's not the name of the district..it's the people in it. I don't think consolidation would equalize anything. It would cause animosity and create more beaurocracy. Consolidation made the city schools become some of the worst in the nation. I don't want that happening on LI.

The only way to equalize would be forced integration...making half of hhh go to Wyandanch schools and vise versa. That would mean busing kids farther and I hate to say it...a lot of people moving out of HHH since it would be unfair.

Statistically, forced integration leads to white flight. Not my opinion, but a historical fact. I wonder if wealthy families in HHH would really stay and allow forced equalization to happen? Also, would it really become equal?? I doubt that the curriculumn and teachers at Wyandanch are bad...it think the culture of the people in that district don't prioritize education. I also think it is a class issue, not a race issue. Elmont is doing quite well in scores and Elmont Memorial had an intel semi-finalist this year!!!

[longislandmike]

Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but

Great Idea!

You would like your tax dollars, as high as they are and going higher, going into a, virtual, sinkhole, every year ?

What other things would this effect ?

For example, wouldn't it also "drag down" the property values ?

I'm sure there would be an eroding tax base in this total area, because of the HORROR School; what kind of Maniac would move into the area, who had the money, NOT to do so ?

It seems that one would effect, the other, somehow.

It's no accident that these BAD schools, suffer on their own. Basically, it's what has been called gerrymandering...but for schools. While EVERYONE has concentrated on this practice on the electoral process, ALL THE BUSSING in the WORLD, hasn't helped cure our country of this. And it's NOT going to stop.

Whether it's Class or Color, people are going to do this, in one name or another, and it's so institutionalized and ingrained in our Society, it's not going stop. For one reason or another, it's going to exist.

[AlexisT]

2 points:

1) Consolidation, on its own, may not save a dime. Unless the overall level of expenditure is reduced, it's merely going to be redistribution. This will create winners and losers. Some areas will do really well from consolidation because they have such a poor tax base. Some will get hit--the Hamptons, or any other area with high-value property and few children to educate, would see an enormous tax increase if they had to pool their money with the rest of the county.

2) I think that over time, consolidating districts would result in bringing up the worse off districts, because they're currently caught in a cycle where no one wants to buy there and they're getting a progressively more distressed population. In addition, there would inevitably be some redistricting and a larger district (more than just merging HHH and Wyandanch) would make it easier to redistribute low-achieving students without plonking down hundreds of them in a single school.

However, I think it would take a good 10-15 years to really see an effect. It would not provide instant results.

[longislandmike]

Originally Posted by nbres

There is a moral point to consolidation besides the economic sense it makes and that is consolidation would be fair to all.

Every child deserves an equal opportunity.

If public education is the great equalizer and road to future success then it is morally indefensible to suggest that we keep the discriminatory educational system we presently have now on Long Island.

Let the lawyers and the politicians beat each others' brains out, about "moral point(s)" and being "fair to all".

I only care about MINE, in the end, and so does EVERYONE else !