Only 3 school budgets do not pass (Garden City, Bedford: health insurance, chapel, mortgage)

[I_Love_LI_but]

Originally Posted by Burb

Less layers of administration? A higher percentage of school tax revenue actually reaching the school? Yes please

And don't forget lower property taxes in Connecticut than Long Island (???) with this absence of local government.

[amoret68]

Originally Posted by click

Well all I can say is thank God that Pat-Med was one of the two that got voted "NO", with the $15,000 taxes I pay annually, it is JUST ENOUGH! How much more are we expected to pay, seriously.............it isn't like I live in a gorgeous community with a huge house...........

Um, click, what is your solution? You know that they're just going to fire untenured teachers (raising class sizes) and cut programs; it will not affect, say, the superintendent's salary. Do you not care if the school district fails? If you don't care about how this affects the families in the community, can you at least see how this impacts your largest purchase? Are you (and other "no"-voters) unaware that real estate values rise and fall based on the perceived quality of the school districts? If Pat-Med gets worse, your house decline in value, and so will everyone else's.

Sigh. Someone enlighten me, because I don't get knee-jerk "no"-voters. Did these "no"-voters look at the budget, or is it that they always reject the first offer, like car buyers? This was a proposed 1.51% budget increase (about 4.49% increase in taxes). The cost of business rises every year, and at a rate higher than 2%. And a contingency budget? ( http://www.pat-med.k12.ny.us/budget/budgetdata.pdf ) It's only a fraction lower than the proposed budget. So, what are we saving, $10 a month? Gee, even if I didn't give a hoot about my kid's education, I'd think that $10 a month would be a small price to pay to preserve our reptutation. I can't tell how how disheartened and humiliated I am that our district was the only one to not pass a reasonable budget.

District consolidations, elimination of local governments--these are real solutions to our problems.

[totallyfrazzled]

Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but

And don't forget lower property taxes in Connecticut than Long Island (???) with this absence of local government.

But in addition to property taxes, CT also has Personal Property Tax which applies to cars, boats, mobile homes, and recreational vehicles -- which NY State does not.

CT's pp tax also applies to businesses in respect to fixtures, leased vehicles, and autos registered out of state.

CT's pp taxes are levied and collected by the towns and/or cities -- so it is a local tax/layer of local government.

My SO and I investigated moving to CT a few years ago (Farmington area) and felt that the property taxes were not SIGNIFICANTLY lower than comparable areas on LI for comparable houses in comparable condition. You do get larger lots there but the tradeoff was the difficulty in finding houses that have public water rather than a private well (which I am adamantly opposed to ever having). I would rather pay a couple thousand more in taxes and have public water and sewers on a half acre rather than have 1 or 1.5 acre but have to deal with cesspools and well water.

[Crookhaven]

Originally Posted by click

Well all I can say is thank God that Pat-Med was one of the two that got voted "NO", with the $15,000 taxes I pay annually, it is JUST ENOUGH! How much more are we expected to pay, seriously.............it isn't like I live in a gorgeous community with a huge house...........

15k for Patchogue?

MoFos be trippin'

Are you at least Waterfront?

Crooks

[click]

YUP, $15,000 for Patchogue!!!!!!!!!!! I have been in the process of grieving them for the past two years, they claim it takes this long. Anyway, NO I am not waterfront, as in the bay, but I do live on a lake, that does impact it some, but not that much. I spent hours yesterday googling and looking at property tax sites as well as, houses for sale in and around Patchogue. Mine seem to be the highest with a lot in the $8,000-$10,000 range, still mine are $5,000 over that. I am in the Village, so that accounts for $3,900 of the $15,000 the rest is the wonderful town of Brookhaven!

As far as Amoret68, don't even talk to me about the school budget. I am self employed and have been for my whole life. I am middle aged, not young. I am sick and tired of supporting all the teachers, police, politicians, etc. who make a hell of a lot more than I have during certain times. The school district in Patchogue has been in decline ever since the early 90's WITH ALL of it's high school taxes! So apparently having a budget pass or fail does not affect my house values as much as, the influx however, of illegals and gangs into our school systems. I have quite a few friends who are teachers, clients and fellow co-workers in my field that work within the Pat-Med school system. They agree with me 150%!!!!!!! Also, I don't understand why I have to go without having medical insurance for years and years and worry that one of my children could be in a car accident or get cancer or some other disease and how I am going to pay for it, when I am paying 100% of their healthcare insurance? I don't mind paying part of it, but 100%???? Who on earth in these economic times is getting free healthcare? AND, a few years back they were picketing not because we were CANCELLING their healthcare insurance, but because they were being switched to another insurance company! They didn't want the change in paperwork as was quoted in the news and local papers! The people I socialize with in the school district themselves, said it was "NUTS", their words not mine! I don't know about you, but some of us, JUST CAN'T PAY ANYMORE, period. That is why all the young or a large percentage of them are moving out, you won't even need school districts anymore at this rate. The retired as well, can't live here. It is becoming a place just for the rich. And, I know about the young, as I work in a field that directly impacts what happens to them right after college and marriage. I hear it at least three or four times a week right from their mouths. Property taxes are having a direct impact on the future of Long Island. I have quite a few relatives who have purchased homes within the last five years all over the country in North Carolina, Maryland, Virginia, Arizona, Georgia, Delaware, etc., just to name a few. They are living some of them in custom built homes with 3,000 or more square footage, two of which who are in Montgomery County in Maryland, (the richest county in America according to some polls) and they are both are four stories, 7,000 square feet, and their taxes are $3,500 or thereabouts! Beautiful, beautiful homes. All their utilities, electric, cable, water, half of what we pay. Sorry, but that tells me that things have been mismanaged for way too long here.

[click]

And, Amoret68, the claim of the cost of businesses rising, my business has taken a cut by 50%! I have come down on what I charge by half and am still being asked for "discounts", while everything is rising. That is right, I have cut my income in half during the last year and a half. Sorry, but I'll take the "humiliation" at having our budget go down. I'm sick of hearing them say that "there will be no tissues in class or no crayons and punishing the children for these things". You can count on me and a lot of my neighbors voting a big fat "NO" each and every time it comes up for a vote. Something has to change...........and yes, maybe district consolidation and a reduction in local government is way past due.

[amoret68]

Click, I believe people have a right to be angry that they don't have good health insurance, but they shouldn't begrudge anyone else for having it. Everyone in America should have it, and the fact that we don't causes us to snipe at each other instead of demanding health care reform.

And, elsewhere on this board I've defended teachers' pay because of the education they're required to have and the high cost of living on LI. Now, do I believe that elementary school teachers need master's degrees? No, but NYS does. Do I believe teachers should receive automatic raises when they get 15 or 30 credits above the master's level? Oh, hell no! What a waste of their time and our money! But I don't make the rules. I only wish that everyone who votes down these budgets would channel their energies toward change instead of just pointing fingers at teachers, the majority of whom do not make 6 figures and are just trying to do a good job. (I know there are some absurdly overcompensated teachers and some who should be fired for incompetence, but these are not as common as irate people like to think.)

Again, I believe that consolidating and/or eliminating layers of government is the most effective way to get to the root of our tax problems and I'm glad to see you agree.

[dman72]

A person paying $15,000 in taxes for a house on the Patchogue River is absurd. I can't dispute a person in that situation being angry. However, voting against the budget every year is just being reactionary..not that I can blame you.

[I_Love_LI_but]

Originally Posted by amoret68

Again, I believe that consolidating and/or eliminating layers of government is the most effective way to get to the root of our tax problems and I'm glad to see you agree.

As Totallyfrazzled pointed out above, the lack of any local government has not brought Connecticut's property taxes to anything significantly lower than Long Island. The school districts are what is eating up the most of our money around here. Let's just admit it instead of look for diversions.

[click]

FIRST, I wholeheartedly agree that what I pay, with no exaggeration, is absurd. That is why I am grieving them. I have heard from a few other people that some get $2,000-$3,000 in savings, at least that is what I am hoping for, but not expecting. Anyway, I am not voting against the budget to be reactionary, contrary to what you may believe, I too, have voted for it many, many times only to see nothing come of it and have my children told time and time again, with notes from teachers, etc., to please bring in tissues for the class as the budget doesn't allow them, or there is no money in Pat-Med for crayons, or we are getting rid of this program, or that, there will be no sports this year, etc. etc. AND, I am FED UP! So fed up, that words cannot express the anger. The children never see anything in the way these school budgets. IT ALL goes to teacher's salaries. We have Patchogue First, who a few years back sent every homeowner a list of every school teacher's salary in Pat-Med and the teachers had a fit saying I don't know what your husband or wife makes what right does that give you to know what I made for a living? Are you KIDDING ME? I pay your salary. The starting salary for most of them was in the mid to high $60's with a ton making well into the $100,000's. I'm sorry but when people are having a hard time making ends meet and putting food on the table, a raise in property taxes is not the answer. Tenure is another thing that has hurt our school districts. It has been studied time and time again that when a teacher isn't protected with tenure, you get better teachers. Who else gets their job protected? I ask you. A job should be, if you do a good job, you are rewarded and have nothing to worry about, if you don't, then you deserve to be axed. These unions on Long Island do us no favors at all whatsoever. It all depends on what side of the fence you sit on, if you are a teacher, then your job is so hard and you want as much as you can get. As I mentioned in another post, I have had to cut my salary (self-employed) by 50% and am making half of what I was in 2007. Why because if I didn't, I wouldn't be working at all. And, at that, I am still being asked to offer further discounts. I have a master's degree and must pursue further classes on an ongoing basis just to keep current with the trends, have to pay insurance in order for me to even be allowed to do my job (required by clients), pay other vendors for supplies (of which none have cut their prices), and must by new equipment every single year as it wears out. And, as far as channeling their energies, I was on the board of the PTA and other school functions as a volunteer for many, many years, so don't judge and think I didn't work to channel change. It is just that change does not come and this is the only way the people right now have a way to say enough, we can't do it anymore!