Newsweek 2009 top 1500 schools (Union, Jericho: credit, home, public school)

[AlexisT]

Given the set of criteria used, yes, piling magnet and selective schools in with comprehensives (open enrollment) is ludicrous. In a selective school, everyone is going to take APs; in a comprehensive they don't. It has nothing to do with the quality of education they are giving. You have to compare apples with apples.

The list IS meaningless, because all it does is measure exams taken. Not passing. Not performance. Just whether or not you get kids to take the exam. If you have kids take 5 APs and they get a string of 2s, you're ranked higher than a school where every kid takes 3 but gets a 5. Does this make sense to you? Not to me. The author justifies it by saying that otherwise, you're rewarding schools who only allow top students to take the test, but IMO, there should be a score that weights for both. Discounting performance completely is a farce.

[flowergarden]

The US News and World Report ranking takes scores on the APs into account. Their list is meaningful because it is looking at how well the kids are doing on those difficult tests.

[dman72]

Originally Posted by flowergarden

The US News and World Report ranking takes scores on the APs into account. Their list is meaningful because it is looking at how well the kids are doing on those difficult tests.

Right, and in that ranking, Long Island is represented well, especially amongst open enrollment schools. 3 out of the 39 top open enrollment schools are from LI. Period. AGAIN, that's 2 counties in one state. Some large STATES only have one school represented. If your point is that LI schools are average, you've given nothing to support that idea.

[thepokerdepot]

Originally Posted by dman72

That's a nice vaguery. However, in the same breath you implied that either the list is broken, that the school system on LI is broken and needs fixing because this list isn't overflowing with Li schools. This implies that you think this list is evidence to either fact. On the contrary, it is not evidence to that at all. It is evidence to the fact that areas without great schools can make themselves look better by putting all the smart kids in separate schools from everyone else.

So, you'll have to find some OTHER evidence that indicates that the educational system on LI is broken, or maybe change your tune on that matter, since most evidence indicates that it ISN'T broken.

People are being taxed to death, yes. That's a valid argument. However, all the people who are insane about taxes who try to use the offensive strategy of saying that schools aren't good ..have little or no credibility. This is where the "agenda" comes in. People hate school taxes, so, instead of simply saying that taxes are too high, they have to say the schools stink, as they think that reinforces their agenda. It actually takes credibility away from them, because the schools don't stink.

You know what the problem is,..I never voted to make Nassau a "School State",..I never voted to pay 12k in School taxes a year.

I think it is not Fair, that people have to pay unreal school taxes because someone at the District School say's so.

The people that want to spend crazy money on district schools can afford to send their kids to private schools. Why do all the residents have to suffer?

My property as well as others are losing equity because, as everybody knows, Property taxes are part of mortgage payments and hence used to value a home.

[dman72]

Originally Posted by thepokerdepot

You know what the problem is,..I never voted to make Nassau a "School State",..I never voted to pay 12k in School taxes a year.

I think it is not Fair, that people have to pay unreal school taxes because someone at the District School say's so.

The people that want to spend crazy money on district schools can afford to send their kids to private schools. Why do all the residents have to suffer?

My property as well as others are losing equity because, as everybody knows, Property taxes are part of mortgage payments and hence used to value a home.

I can't argue with that. We have a problem with taxes on LI.

However, as someone else wants you to believe...the schools aren't average. They are above average.

[56 Fighter]

Originally Posted by dman72

However, as someone else wants you to believe...the schools aren't average. They are above average.

Fair point and I agree with you. Now comes the chicken and the egg question:

Are the schools above average because the demographics/ wealth of LI are favorable? Or are they above average because the teachers here on LI are just that good? If it's a mix, how much of that is a result of the teachers, and what drop-off, if any, would result if comp were held steady?

[dman72]

Originally Posted by 56 Fighter

Fair point and I agree with you. Now comes the chicken and the egg question:

Are the schools above average because the demographics/ wealth of LI are favorable? Or are they above average because the teachers here on LI are just that good? If it's a mix, how much of that is a result of the teachers, and what drop-off, if any, would result if comp were held steady?

It's a good question. However, I looked at some other high ranked schools in that list and checked their average teacher salaries on salary.com. Almost identical to LI. Now, I was looking in Md and VA outside Washington DC, where COL is high..but should we expect teachers on LI to make what they make in Michigan where you can buy a house for 150K?

[anotherNYer]

How do explain why their are so many other high achievers, the list contains many schools from Florida, Texas, N.C? LI is represented, but so are many other states. I think LI's standing is partly due to it's socio-economic standing. I would not question the magnet schools. Most magnet schools are set up in low-income areas and take a mix of students. The idea behind magnets is to draw students to an area that may otherwise be considered disadvantaged. Although Garden City and Cold Spring Harbor are not magnet schools, I would hardlly consider them a mix of students. If they weren't a top school I would really be worried.

[dman72]

Originally Posted by anotherNYer

How do explain why their are so many other high achievers, the list contains many schools from Florida, Texas, N.C? LI is represented, but so are many other states. I think LI's standing is partly due to it's socio-economic standing. I would not question the magnet schools. Most magnet schools are set up in low-income areas and take a mix of students. The idea behind magnets is to draw students to an area that may otherwise be considered disadvantaged. Although Garden City and Cold Spring Harbor are not magnet schools, I would hardlly consider them a mix of students. If they weren't a top school I would really be worried.

The first 2 schools from Texas on the Newsweek lis are obviously specialty schools..or do they name open enrollment schools in Texas "Gifted and Talented"?

I see a lot of OPEN ENROLLMENT schools from the NYC metro area, and very few from other STATES. It seems that people are seeing what they want to see in these lists. Again, set up a "gifted and talented" school here on LI that pulls form local districts, and watch Texas get their behinds whooped. NYC metro area schools on average crush Texas suburban schools in terms of preparing kids for college. Anyone who makes an argument otherwise really has an axe to grind with school taxes.

[56 Fighter]

Originally Posted by dman72

It's a good question. However, I looked at some other high ranked schools in that list and checked their average teacher salaries on salary.com. Almost identical to LI. Now, I was looking in Md and VA outside Washington DC, where COL is high..but should we expect teachers on LI to make what they make in Michigan where you can buy a house for 150K?

Teachers shouldn't make $30g a year after 10 years but they shouldn't make $200k a year after 30 either. I don't think anyone has any problem with teachers making $80-$100k after 20 or so years and starting around $40k. However when it gets to be more than that is when people start taking issue. I wonder how many teachers in LI schools earn over $125k on LI versus other high cost areas...