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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:18 PM
 
267 posts, read 250,241 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by OvertaxedinMass View Post
We both work in the city, I work in finance she work in advertising.
Well, I think there's your answer why you are affording it here.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:20 PM
grant516
 
n/a posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
According to grant516 (a post with no links to documentation) if the budgets do not pass (2 votes) the governor of NY has mandated a 0% increase for all schools in this state for this year's budget votes.

My school budget's costs were only raised by 0.83%. That's pretty good and the way they are keeping it so low is by getting rid of staff, including teachers. Our other problem, however, is that the State has cut the State Aid to our schools by 3.99% and the budget/taxes have to go up to compensate for that. Or more staff cutting and cutting of other expenses.

At this point, I am fine with schools going back to having an average of 30 kids in the classroom. It was fine when I went to school, so why not now? I think the "small class" nonsense was only started by the unions to get more teachers in their ranks paying dues and for those teachers to have less work to do, not because it benefits the students. The only classes I can see it benefit is special education, and even back when I went to school those classes were small.

PS: Thanks for the compliment (AMEN, AMEN, AMEN). Soon you will see my detractors come on here and bash me for being a terrible and selfish and cruel person as to not want to continue to pay the insanely upward-spiraling real estate taxes and to want reform of the unions.
Do I really need to document my sources, this is conversation not a formal submission -

Contingency Budgets:Educational Management:NYSED

In any event I'm sure if you read me, you know it's coming from a reputible source, whether or not you value or respect my opinon.


As for the small class issues, other states have amended state law to limit class sizes despite it's high cost to obviously maintain. Research and studies show obvious benefits for the students, and teachers alike.

The only difference I can tell you about how it may seem like it worked better 'back in the day', was the different legal stance students enjoy in the 21st century. Today children are entitled to being disruptive, one cannot remove them physically or their belongings from a classroom environment. One cannot touch, assign chores, berate, insult, forbid standard privleages, or essentially effectively reprimand in any way.

Special Education classes were previously smaller, however the school of thought now is to put them together with general education students and offer two teachers and resource time (another teacher contact hour). Special Education students may run 3x the average of a Gen Ed. student, and these reformulations were on account of lawsuits and parental input- not the guidance of educational philosophers and pedagogy specialists.

I stand behind what I say though on the topic, and I like to feel I offer a bit more of a realistic and thoughtful aproach.
Taxes, when will it end... likely never.
Will cutting school costs 10% across the board fix it, no.
Will cutting police costs 10% across the board fix it? no.
Those two combined.... nope.

Would a project the scale of Walt Disney World fix it? ... yes.

Would a company like Oracle, or Intel fix it... yes.
(for at least the local surroundings it's in.)

Are COL & Taxes high here. Sure, are they worse than Midtown Manhattan... No; and that place does crazy business.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:25 PM
 
Location: Centereach
404 posts, read 427,003 times
Reputation: 186
I still don't get how the contingency budget could have an increase of 3x that of the budget up for vote.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:26 PM
 
Location: Centereach
404 posts, read 427,003 times
Reputation: 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
^^^
Some of us don't want to run.

We want to stand and fight.

We want reform of out-of-control unions for a start.

Any idea how?
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:30 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
15,149 posts, read 14,225,545 times
Reputation: 6035
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant516 View Post
Do I really need to document my sources, this is conversation not a formal submission -

Contingency Budgets:Educational Management:NYSED

In any event I'm sure if you read me, you know it's coming from a reputible source, whether or not you value or respect my opinon.
Thank you for the link. I value and respect everyone's opinion unless I catch them lying. I have not caught you lying. I find some of your POVs a bit troubling, such as "give up and just keep letting them ream you with high taxes." However, I guess the fact that you don't want to do anything about it can be explained by your posts on here stating you are only here to save enough money to buy a home for cash in a low cost area out of state.

Quote:
Originally Posted by grant516 View Post
As for the small class issues, other states have amended state law to limit class sizes despite it's high cost to obviously maintain. Research and studies show obvious benefits for the students, and teachers alike.

The only difference I can tell you about how it may seem like it worked better 'back in the day', was the different legal stance students enjoy in the 21st century. Today children are entitled to being disruptive, one cannot remove them physically or their belongings from a classroom environment. One cannot touch, assign chores, berate, insult, forbid standard privleages, or essentially effectively reprimand in any way.

Special Education classes were previously smaller, however the school of thought now is to put them together with general education students and offer two teachers and resource time (another teacher contact hour). Special Education students may run 3x the average of a Gen Ed. student, and these reformulations were on account of lawsuits and parental input- not the guidance of educational philosophers and pedagogy specialists.
Just one question: if students misbehave in class, are teachers no longer able to send them to the Principal or Dean's office?

Quote:
Originally Posted by grant516 View Post
I stand behind what I say though on the topic, and I like to feel I offer a bit more of a realistic and thoughtful aproach.
Taxes, when will it end... likely never.
Will cutting school costs 10% across the board fix it, no.
Will cutting police costs 10% across the board fix it? no.
Those two combined.... nope
.

Would a project the scale of Walt Disney World fix it? ... yes.

Would a company like Oracle, or Intel fix it... yes.
(for at least the local surroundings it's in.)

Are COL & Taxes high here. Sure, are they worse than Midtown Manhattan... No; and that place does crazy business.
Why is it all or nothing with you? Every little bit of reform helps. Especially since we will not be buillding a new Disney to save the day anytime soon.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:32 PM
 
9,343 posts, read 14,961,175 times
Reputation: 4168
Quote:
Originally Posted by GPC View Post
Ideally, no adult children would need/want to live with mom and dad. A better alternative, in my opinion, is to move to an area where everyone can afford to pay their own housing expenses. Besides, even if mom and dad allowed their adult kids to remain at home, I can only imagine the damage inflicted on their kids' pride as a result.

People can, and do, change their attitudes.

You're looking back at a special period in time -- the latter part of the XX Century -- when the house/income ratio was low enough so that many families could afford separate residences for parents and their adult children.

This special time has passed -- and, it ain't coming back -- and we are now, economically speaking, no longer in a time when the house/income ratio is low enough so that most families can afford separate residences for parents and their adult children. Today, for many families, it will require the income from BOTH the parents and their adult children to have the income for a house.

While many adult children no longer have the income to buy a house, they do have the income to finance the multi-generational expansion of a parents' house, or for the parents to sell their current house, take that money and add money to be financed by the adult children, and buy a larger house more suitable for a multi-generational residence.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:33 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
15,149 posts, read 14,225,545 times
Reputation: 6035
Quote:
Originally Posted by corky101 View Post
Any idea how?
First steps:

Throw out all current school board members.

Let new school board members know we are serious about union reform.

When new governor comes in office, let new governor know NYS residents DEMAND reform of the public employee pension plan so that going forward it will reflect private industry (as in 401ks or 403bs with an optional contribution by the employer) and DEMAND that NYS taxpayers will no longer fund medical insurance for NYS public retirees and their families and that they must go on Medicare like everyone else.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
15,149 posts, read 14,225,545 times
Reputation: 6035
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter Greenspan View Post
People can, and do, change their attitudes.

You're looking back at a special period in time -- the latter part of the XX Century -- when the house/income ratio was low enough so that many families could afford separate residences for parents and their adult children.

This special time has passed -- and, it ain't coming back -- and we are now, economically speaking, no longer in a time when the house/income ratio is low enough so that most families can afford separate residences for parents and their adult children. Today, for many families, it will require the income from BOTH the parents and their adult children to have the income for a house.

While many adult children no longer have the income to buy a house, they do have the income to finance the multi-generational expansion of a parents' house, or for the parents top sell their current house, take that money and add money to be financed by the adult children and buy a larger house more suitable for a multi-generational residence.
Realistically, just how many communities on Long Island allow such expansion of homes? Even if they did, many homes are on small lots where there is no room to do so.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 02:40 PM
GPC
 
958 posts, read 1,250,013 times
Reputation: 571
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter Greenspan View Post
People can, and do, change their attitudes.

You're looking back at a special period in time -- the latter part of the XX Century -- when the house/income ratio was low enough so that many families could afford separate residences for parents and their adult children.

This special time has passed -- and, it ain't coming back -- and we are now, economically speaking, no longer in a time when the house/income ratio is low enough so that most families can afford separate residences for parents and their adult children. Today, for many families, it will require the income from BOTH the parents and their adult children to have the income for a house.

While many adult children no longer have the income to buy a house, they do have the income to finance the multi-generational expansion of a parents' house, or for the parents to sell their current house, take that money and add money to be financed by the adult children, and buy a larger house more suitable for a multi-generational residence.
I hope multi-generational residences don't become the norm. That would be sad. I'm glad I'm moving to an area where my kids will be able to buy their own houses someday. It's important for adult kids to move away so they can have a sense of independence and privacy.
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Unread 05-07-2010, 05:25 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
15,149 posts, read 14,225,545 times
Reputation: 6035
Quote:
Originally Posted by GPC View Post
I hope multi-generational residences don't become the norm. That would be sad. I'm glad I'm moving to an area where my kids will be able to buy their own houses someday. It's important for adult kids to move away so they can have a sense of independence and privacy.
That would signify an end to the American middle class. Period.

America would become a bunch of serfs and overlords.

I might as well move to India then.
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