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Old 08-06-2010, 10:42 AM
Location: Los Angeles, CA
787 posts, read 1,588,470 times
Reputation: 372


Originally Posted by [B
Visit a Library[/b];15356825]I'm considering moving to Montana or Idaho just to avoid those people.
Are you from Russia or Ireland? Ever thought about going back there? We certainly won't miss you around here.
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:30 AM
237 posts, read 546,963 times
Reputation: 227
People in the LA area are very HONEST about all our warts. We don't pretend to like the disadvantages of a big city, like New Yorkers who not only tolerate, but seem to welcome stupid, incompetent agencies and take the magnificent failures of power outages and botched train service (NJ Transit Trains without power for 6 hours and toilets overflowing, people HOT and near passing out and, and just say, "That's life in New York," and chant, "The greatest city in world," NOT!

It is our cynicism and attitude of expecting better and demanding more from our politicians and public agencies that keeps things in LA working pretty darn well. We do NOT accept incompetency nor do we celebrate the mistakes made here, we expect change, and often the politicians and agency chief here it and get done, for the most part. Sorry, but even after all its problems LAPD still the most efficient police department, LAFD and LACoFD easily the best, and we expect it to be. But the difference here is that we call out our buffoonery, and we aren't so drunk with civic boosterism that we say "LA best city in the world" (sorry Paris and London and Madrid, and hell almost any of those better than New York) when we have high standards and a number of problems. We don't hate LA, we just aren't intoxicated with our own love of the place to imped the quest for making things BETTER, not accepting incompetence. We are realists not prone to believe in fantasy and think everthing is just fine the way it is

We will tell you everything that is wrong with our city and metro area, but we don't move, for the most part, because some like it here, but others feel trapped here because the economy and its diversity is so good here that jobs here are so good and pay so well, that some folks can't find similar or relativity good paying jobs--even with lower coast of living factored in--than they have here. My uncle desperately wanted to move back to Seattle (he was an Angeleno, but he loved Seattle while he lived there) but being in the stock market biz, there were NO JOBS for him in Seattle. That is to say that Seattle and most cities, even big cities, in the US except for New York, Boston, Chicago, San Francisco, don't have the tons of jobs in the financial sector--investment banks and brokerage houses--that LA does. All those companies have several big or boutique offices in the LA area. Well, he was stuck here as #3 in the company and making his big wad of cash. One of my aunts wanted to move to Las Vegas so badly for its lower cost of living and she was tired of LA going downhill from her view. But she was elderly and had a heart condition and required $2,500 per month of medications that the state of California paid 100% or due to her low income. CA has had Medi-Cal for decades, picking up what the Feds won't, the cost of medication for the elderly and those who can't afford $3,000 per month in med--or they DIE--through NO fault of their own. At the time, Nevada would not cover her medications. So, she was "stuck" here.

Bill Bratton, in an interview just before leaving Los Angeles was asked what he thought was one of the biggest problems with LA (so LA to ask such a brutally honest question that is certain to bring a negative answer; New York isn't interested in examining it self in that way, as if there is nothing to improve, and look out if you tell the truth about New Yorks problems because the citizens start crying; New York likes living in a perpetual dream of itself as the nation's Fantasy Land of hyperbolic civic boosterism, although that is true for just about any other city in the USA such as Seattle, Chicago, etc. Could you imagine a reporter asking a leaving police chief, "What didn't you like about Memphis or Portland or tell us how Houston sucks?). Bratton said it was the cynicism of LA, of how too often we are negative, always finding fault with things rather than on what could be the positive outcome. It's true, for every great idea here, whether the subway, the greening of our power grid, education reform, you name it, there is always some one or some group pouncing on it as a bad idea, and it creates a huge challenge to get it done, sometimes. We are the most diverse city and metro area in the country, and I mean politically. In Santa Monica there was Tom Hayden on the far left and a few miles to the east in San Marino, just below Pasadena, we have the John Birch society on the far right. There is a much bigger rift between the liberals and conservatives here than I think anywhere else, and that often creates the challenge in getting things done. Dems and Repubs in other cities easily can put aside differences and agree on what's best for New York, Boston, Chicago, etc, but not in LA, your opposing political party is gonna write letters to congress urging NOT to allocate subway money (that was back in the 1980's and Washington, after receiving the letter, couldn't figure out what we wanted, and why couldn't LA get everybody behind it). Now we are all behind it--the subway and other transit projects, but it was a good example.

Ironically, I think Bratton loved LA more than the rest of us. When asked by a reporter at LA Live how things were going with the Michael Jackson memorial preparations regarding the LAPD, Bratton said, "No problems; We're ready." Then he grinned and said, "Just another beautiful day in the City of Angles" I found the remark humorous. Here's a guy (Bostonian and New Yorker) who loves being here more than the rest of us . The problem is, we just aren't willing to settle, and strive to improve. Of course, that will never end, but in consequence it produces the best trained and competent police and fire throughout the LA area, and the Harbor still kicking a**, and the airports making big $$$ and a new International terminal, DWP still lower rates than SCE and very healthy and safe rail transit (some of the busses aren't so) overall, a pretty safe city and metro areal with a huge economy (still the largest manufacturing center?) in energy (oil), finance, industry, retail, education (countless colleges) and the busiest destination airport, meaning more people coming to our airports as destination, not hub traffic.

But we think we can still do better than that, even though we are #1 in many respects. Number 1 just isn't quite good enough.

Last edited by HarryKerry; 08-10-2010 at 01:43 AM..
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Old 08-10-2010, 05:06 AM
3 posts, read 3,920 times
Reputation: 15
Hmm, my family's known some firefighters here in southern CA and, over all, they are loving life and great people/happy families. So maybe the job one has and how much one enjoys it and is assured one will actually KEEP it helps a whole heckuva lot. Me, I'm unemployed and finding a job seems an impossible task these days (*seems*: I haven't given up yet). Not everyone has the MONEY to up and move. There are so many things to love about CA and generations of my family have been born and raised here. But it has definitely changed for the worse. I'm not a "hater", just an observer. I live in L.A. and can't wait to get back to the suburbs. I'm tired of the crime (yes, I know it's everywhere) and tired of walking over people on the sidewalks and their excrement in piles along the way. I can't count the people urinating/defecating outside in broad daylight (men and woman both and, have to say, they always answer me angrily in another language besides English when I point out what they're doing's disgusting). Come to L.A., but stay outta the areas that look sketchy when you're even driving through. if they look dirty and uninhabitable from your car, you certainly don't want to live in them and walk around. Yes, I'm unemployed. No, not a hater. Just a realist and can't wait to get out of here. And let's not get started on the city govt.
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:20 PM
Location: Outside of Los Angeles
1,248 posts, read 2,235,121 times
Reputation: 785
I am definitely not bitter. Some are bitter because they constantly complain about their life. Yes, I can also say it is really tough to find a job out here. But the only choice left is to keep on looking.
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:26 PM
6,474 posts, read 9,798,911 times
Reputation: 6315
Originally Posted by weldingfireman View Post
A while back I had posted that my family and i were thinking of movintg there either within the year or in 5 years after i retire from the FD here. Right away people started in with i wouldnt be able to find a job, bla bla bla without knowing i had fully looked into other departments that ARE hireing in this down economy in the LA area. I take constructive criticism pretty well. But that is not why i am posting i have been lurking on here just reading post , and it seems all the people who live in or around LA that post on here either hate life or hate LA. (what gives?) if you hate LA so much why dont you just move?
I find that funny because we go out there 3 -4 times a year for a week or so at a time for the past 7 or 8 years. and through out those years i have befrinded quite a few people out there some are other firemen and others are just like minded people as me. They seem to love LA thier life they live there or maybe they are just blowing smoke up my a** but i dont think that is the case they seem pretty happy, ya traffic sucks but it also sucks in any major metro city . Cost of living is alot higher than most of our Country other than NYC, but the pay is also better than most citys. Im just wondering why most that post on here post negative things about LA? I was taught if you dont like your life your job where you live ect then stop bitchen about it and change it !
Just my rant on all the haters on here. just saying there are more negative replys to things about LA than there are positive from the locals on here.

If you want to move here then DO IT. Your experiences will probably be different than the others who post here.

I'll admit that when I first moved here from the east coast it was extreme culture shock. I knew LA wasn't NYC, but I had no idea that it's basically a serious of small towns or suburbs masquerading as "cities" under the Los Angeles County umbrella. Even the city of Los Angeles is not as metropolitan as I believed it to be.

But that's MY fault for not investigating further, but it wouldn't have mattered anyway, because I needed to LIVE HERE to UNDERSTAND. You can research on a place for weeks, months, years, etc., but it STILL won't make a difference until you LIVE and WORK there.

I'm over my anger and disappointment now and found this place to be an excellent learning experience for the future. You'd be surprised how many people live in their cars, go to the gym to shower/change for work, then hang out at a wifi friendly place after work. Many people work two or three jobs to survive and live with one or two extra people in a $700 studio/single.

Even before the economy trashed it wasn't that easy to find a job, unless you knew someone or transferred from another city. Being that you're a fireman it might be different for you since you're part of a very special and admirable "clique" so to speak. Heroes tend to stick together and help one another out. But please, please don't negate someone else's negative experiences, because they don't fit what you see here when you "visit".

"Visiting" LA is NOT the same as LIVING here which you'll soon see when you move here.
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:46 PM
Location: Los Angeles
10,583 posts, read 12,947,262 times
Reputation: 7621
Originally Posted by weldingfireman View Post
But that is not why i am posting i have been lurking on here just reading post , and it seems all the people who live in or around LA that post on here either hate life or hate LA. (what gives?) if you hate LA so much why dont you just move?
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
I found out a long time ago that there are some posters on C-D that seem downright miserable and their comments must be taken within the context of that negative world view.
It seems pretty clear to me that the people who frequent this section of the City-Data forum are somewhat more negative about Los Angeles than the general population (those who don't even know what a forum is). They come here to C-D because they're frustrated and they want to "blow off steam." They're negative because for whatever reason they aren't free to just pick up and move to a pleasant place. However that doesn't mean that their negative comments aren't true. They've just lost their objectivity and are not considering the many nice things about L.A. and California, particularly because there's no reason to complain about things you like.

Originally Posted by bhcompy View Post
People are down on LA(and California) because it is a sinking ship. Outrageous government spending, outrageous public pensions, outrageous union contracts(particularly prison guard union), outrageous taxation, and a populous that cannot keep from shooting itself in the foot every state wide election cycle by adding billions in more debt through costly initiatives. And that doesn't even touch on illegal immigration, deteriorating schools, the multitudes of social service abusers, jobs, etc. California is going to continue to degenerate fiscally until the state declares bankruptcy and/or there is a constitutional convention. This is why there is middle class flight from the state.
That pretty much sums it up. If the "big one" (earthquake) doesn't get you then the state government and economy is going to come crashing down on you and destroy the state economy and our jobs and shoot our taxes and other fees through the roof. It might even happen.

I'm reminded of the story that you can toss a frog in a pot of boiling water and it will reactively jump out to save itself, but if you put the frog in a pan of cold water and turn the flame on low the water will gradually heat and the frog will sort of fall asleep and get cooked. I'm not so sure about that second part but sometimes I feel that's what it is like for us long time California residents, having known how nice Los Angeles and other parts of California were back in the '50s, '60s, '70s and so on. Nothing really ever just suddenly got bad, it's more like every little negative thing gets just slightly worse each year, but over the course of 20-30 years it's one hell of a big difference. It's like Dorothy in Oz, we're not in Kansas anymore! We long time residents (if I can speak for most of us) have seen our lovely state become ruined. That's what makes so many of us negative.

For me the final straw is that the traffic is getting so bad that it's difficult to get any place without taking two or three times as long as I remember it used to be. Places and times where the light would turn red and I'd wait a bit and it turned green and I was off to the next intersection have turned into sometimes taking 2-3 traffic signal cycles just to get through that intersection (e.g. Reseda and Rosco, Reseda and Sherman Way). Those of you who recently arrived will say, "well traffic is always that bad during rush hour." And it is that bad, but I remember when it wasn't like that. I remember when things weren't slow except right around 8 a.m. and 5 p.m. weekdays. Now our rush hour has turned into rush hours and it's like that most all day long on weekends and holidays.

The economy tanked my career which was almost at its end anyway so the employment which was the main factor in me staying has now become not an issue, so I'm going to move to a prettier place and a smaller town, somewhere in a state that doesn't begin with the letter "C."

I'm not bitter about it. I realize that there's plenty of good in Los Angeles, in California, and it's balanced by plenty of bad too, but bad isn't the only thing there is here. There's even things I'm going to miss, but I see no reason why I can't come back and visit Los Angeles any time I want, see my friends and family, and shop at some of the stores I know I won't find out of state (particularly Asian specialty markets).

To sum it up, I believe that many of those who have been here the longest have become more negative, and lots of them come to City-Data to ***** about it, particularly if they're in the position of not being able to readily move or if they just don't have the initiative and would rather ***** than do something about it.

So anyone who is reading this from out of state, come on out and consider moving to Los Angeles. Please! I need you to buy my house! I'll come visit you, I promise!
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Old 08-10-2010, 01:26 PM
Location: Virginia
18,717 posts, read 25,479,691 times
Reputation: 42803
FWIW, here's an opinion from someone who lived many years in LA and (for the most part) loved it. Southern California has mild weather all year round. There are a lot of things to do besides sitting on an internet forum. So a high percentage of the "nonbitter" people are outside doing those things. The people who are feeling bitter (for whatever reason) are more likely to indoors looking for a place to vent. So, bottom line, city-data just doesn't represent the typical Californian.

Where I live, city-data seems to attract a more typical representation of the population (IMO). But that's because it's 98 degrees outside today and everyone, the bitter and the non-bitter, is staying indoors and playing on the computer until it cools down enough to go out and have fun.
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Old 08-10-2010, 03:36 PM
Location: Outside of Los Angeles
1,248 posts, read 2,235,121 times
Reputation: 785
I have to admit even I have done some complaining about LA and to a lesser extent California. But I'm human after all. I am beginning to find out and realize that it is far easier to complain and look at all the bad things. That's why I'm trying to stay away from that but it is not an easy thing to do. I've been here since 1983 and this place has changed very much. But I'm trying to embrace those changes and deal with them. I've always tried to analyze both the good and bad about LA and have tried to accept that even though this place has its drawbacks, I can still survive and get by. I have always been optimistic that things will get better with time
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Old 08-10-2010, 03:37 PM
5,409 posts, read 10,895,380 times
Reputation: 2233
in LA and loving it!
i have no problems with the diversity here. i dont think the city is being over run by one group. the beauty of LA is in its many many faces. so what if i cant understand most of the signs in koreatown. or in other parts of LA. it doesnt bother me at all. all that matters is that i can say, "more kimchee please". or "mas salsa please".

i love LA. have since day one. nothing like it. dont believe the hype...or the haters
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Old 08-10-2010, 10:34 PM
Location: Earth
17,449 posts, read 22,338,517 times
Reputation: 7227
Originally Posted by SoCal35 View Post
Are you from Russia or Ireland? Ever thought about going back there? We certainly won't miss you around here.
The "Voice of Reason Network" is far right Russian Orthodox, so "Visit a Library" is presumably Russian (or from somewhere in the former USSR).
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