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Assimilation is not about everyone looking the same or believeing the same way. It is about being able to communicate and work together as a community. If people cannot understand each other because of a polyglot of languages how are they going to be able to work together? We don't expect people in Mexico to learn our language, and there are plenty of ex-pat Americans living there, so why should we have to learn anyone else's language to accommodate them when they CHOOSE to come to an English speaking nation? Should we also have to learn Korean, Chinese, Japanese, Swahili, Arabic or the languages of any other immigrant group? We don't make concessions for them, so why should we have to keep making concessions for Hispanic speaking immigrants or citizens? What makes them so much more special or worthy than any other foreign national?
Cyanna: All due respect but nobody is talking about CONCESSIONS except you. Take a trip back to late 1800's Milwaukee and GERMAN was widely spoken in the public schools and made an official part of the curriculum (until WWI of course...things got a little nasty).
The purpose for the German classes and German speaking teachers in the public schools was NOT becuase there was anything SPECIAL about the GERMANS. There were simply just so many of them it only made sense to accommodate them. It was also seen as a way to give these "foreign" kids an avenue to learning the English language.
Cyanna: All due respect but nobody is talking about CONCESSIONS except you. Take a trip back to late 1800's Milwaukee and GERMAN was widely spoken in the public schools and made an official part of the curriculum (until WWI of course...things got a little nasty).
The purpose for the German classes and German speaking teachers in the public schools was NOT becuase there was anything SPECIAL about the GERMANS. There were simply just so many of them it only made sense to accommodate them. It was also seen as a way to give these "foreign" kids an avenue to learning the English language.
Cyanna just believes what's good for the goose is good for the gander.
You're living in a fantasy world. Hollenbeck has or had one of the highest murder rates in the entire city. It was right up there with South Central LA in the 90's. People get jumped there and shot for being in the wrong place. Do you even know people or do you just walk by on the sidewalks and wave to everyone? lol Lady I know you mean well but you are naive. Get to know your East LA neighbors and ask them how many of their sons, fathers, grandfathers, brothers are dead or in jail or been shot. Of course not everyone is bad but for the few that are, they ruin it for the entire area.
what planet are YOU from? Jay100, since you are so insistent, please give all of us poor, deluded, east-LA dwelling folk a little enlightenment on a place that you obviously have only driven through at high speeds. please, tell us about our neighborhoods. you are obviously a font of wisdom and understanding that surpasses our daily, first hand knowledge. please, shower us with your prejudices, which hold so much more weight than our daily experience. and yes, i AM from out of state, but i have been in Los Angeles for five years, and for a year i have lived in East LA. i shop there, i do my laundry there, i even belong to the Boyle Heights Paranormal Project, and have gone into the old Linda Vista Hospital right across from Hollenbeck Park at all hours of the night. again, i know that this isn't enough to be able to say anything definitive or actually hold an opinion about the PLACE I LIVE IN, and i think "the One" and i actually would be able to live much more fruitful, safer, fulfilling lives with a little bit more of your evenhanded guidance. oh, heavens no, i am not being sarcastic!!!!!!!!
by the way, my own father did 3 federal terms for bootlegging. i have never equated jail time with a person's relative worth or goodness as a human being.
again, just DYING to hear about your personal experiences in East LA, something other than armchair statistics that you read in the paper over your morning coffee before you went for a jog in Woodland Hills. Gosh, i don't know if i will be able to even walk down Main Street today without hearing your wisdom first.
Cyanna, i am sure that your relatives spoke Tongva. You know, when they moved here from Europe. Oh, don't know what Tongva is? It was the native language of the Gabrieleno tribe. You know, some of the original. Dwellers. of LOS ANGELES. Oh wait, you don't know any of it? wow, how dare you come to this country without knowing the language? what are you, some kind of layabout?
the only possible sensible and Christian (or just Jesus-like) response to a GENUINE concern over language is to do something about it. in other words, if that is your only concern, and it isn't rooted in maybe? just a little racism? then come on down and teach some ESL courses to some immigrants and their children. but that's like asking the anti-abortion activists to go adopt a bunch of kids. it'd be too proactive and too sensible. better to sit on your couch with some bon-bons and complain about them immigrants stealing your jobs. even tho illegal immigration is down 75 percent.
Cyanna, i am sure that your relatives spoke Tongva. You know, when they moved here from Europe. Oh, don't know what Tongva is? It was the native language of the Gabrieleno tribe. You know, some of the original. Dwellers. of LOS ANGELES. Oh wait, you don't know any of it? wow, how dare you come to this country without knowing the language? what are you, some kind of layabout?
the only possible sensible and Christian (or just Jesus-like) response to a GENUINE concern over language is to do something about it. in other words, if that is your only concern, and it isn't rooted in maybe? just a little racism? then come on down and teach some ESL courses to some immigrants and their children. but that's like asking the anti-abortion activists to go adopt a bunch of kids. it'd be too proactive and too sensible. better to sit on your couch with some bon-bons and complain about them immigrants stealing your jobs. even tho illegal immigration is down 75 percent.
No, my maternal ancestors spoke Lenape Algonquian. Some of my maternal ancestors spoke English, Dutch and German. My paternal ancestors spoke the old Irish tongue, Dutch, French and English. However, those who were not English speakers all learned the language, even my Lenape, who were NATIVE to this land. English speaking people conquered this land; English speaking people fought a Revolution for this Nation. Therefore, we are an English speaking country and until a foreign army invades us and changes the rules as conquerors are known to do, we should remain an English speaking country.
But if we want to be anal and pedantic about it why don't we insist that everyone learn the Algonquian or other actual Native American languages and revert to that as the national tongue? I'm not bitching and complaining that people don't speak MY native tongue, and they were here first, so why should people from another country come here and complain that we don'tr speak their language? My ancestors learned English, so can everyone else. And they didn't have ESL in the 17th century, 18th century or 19th century.
Nobody has stolen my job, you plunker. A non-English speaker couldn't be employed in the job I do. Eating bon bons all day? No, actually I work my ass off and I pay my taxes.
Why should anyone have to teach the language to new immigrants? When Americans travel abroad they try to learn the language of a foreign country BEFORE they go for a visit. I expect the same of those who wish to come here.
But if we want to be anal and pedantic about it why don't we insist that everyone learn the Algonquian or other actual Native American languages and revert to that as the national tongue?
i only use the native languages argument to underline the absurdity of a conquerer complaining when he gets conquered. we didn't assimilate- "we" obviously being a very broad term to mean the conquerers, whether they be spanish, english, dutch etc. not getting on a soapbox, but i have long believed that we lost any moral leg to stand on about two hundred years ago when we began breaking every single treaty we every signed with native tribes. since most of the people complaining about the "illegals" seem to be white people, it just really strikes me as somewhat hilarious and something in the league of comeuppance that we are now freaking out about a massive influx of people we consider "invaders". we stole the land, in the first freaking place. if that had not been true, perhaps we would have a bit of a point.
and, also, "give us your tired huddled masses yearning to be free". ever hear of that? if someone has a problem with that then they have a problem with everything america stands for. we are all mutts, *******s, invaders, usurpers. at some point, we are going to have to learn to get along and stop it with this us/them crap.
i will give you this tho. "plunker" is a great word. is that like a minge or a berk? seriously, i laughed out loud.
btw i pay taxes too. everyone on this forum does. every illegal does when he walks into a store and buys something.
When Americans travel abroad they try to learn the language of a foreign country BEFORE they go for a visit. I expect the same of those who wish to come here.
Actually, there are many Americans are blissfully ignorant of languages other than English and seem to expect other non-Americans to be able to speak English while abroad.
Actually, there are many Americans are blissfully ignorant of languages other than English and seem to expect other non-Americans to be able to speak English while abroad.
yup, americans are notorious for that. in fact most europeans know a little bit of english. americans like to think that there is only one true language i guess. have you seen how we measure up educationally to other countries? makes me weep. we are breeding idiots. feed em some cheetos and plant em in front of the tv for some more "hannah montana". somehow i don't think this is what we defeated hitler for.
But if we want to be anal and pedantic about it why don't we insist that everyone learn the Algonquian or other actual Native American languages and revert to that as the national tongue?
i only use the native languages argument to underline the absurdity of a conquerer complaining when he gets conquered. we didn't assimilate- "we" obviously being a very broad term to mean the conquerers, whether they be spanish, english, dutch etc. not getting on a soapbox, but i have long believed that we lost any moral leg to stand on about two hundred years ago when we began breaking every single treaty we every signed with native tribes. since most of the people complaining about the "illegals" seem to be white people, it just really strikes me as somewhat hilarious and something in the league of comeuppance that we are now freaking out about a massive influx of people we consider "invaders". we stole the land, in the first freaking place. if that had not been true, perhaps we would have a bit of a point.
and, also, "give us your tired huddled masses yearning to be free". ever hear of that? if someone has a problem with that then they have a problem with everything america stands for. we are all mutts, *******s, invaders, usurpers. at some point, we are going to have to learn to get along and stop it with this us/them crap.
i will give you this tho. "plunker" is a great word. is that like a minge or a berk? seriously, i laughed out loud.
btw i pay taxes too. everyone on this forum does. every illegal does when he walks into a store and buys something.
America cannot sustain every single person throughout this big world who wishes to come here. Its a simple matter of economics and protecting our own people. Hence, we have immigration procedures. We do have the right to set forth laws which are intended to keep out those who have criminal backgrounds, mental instabilities, contagious diseases or an inability to become gainfully employed. In your world we would leave the borders wide open and watch everything go to Hell.
We didn't steal anything from Mexico. We fought a war, signed a treaty and paid millions for the land. The Aztecs also fought battles and won land from the original native inhabitants of areas in Mexico. And so the world goes throughout history.
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