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Old 04-21-2015, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
24,151 posts, read 13,668,407 times
Reputation: 11364

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I just read this interesting article about Carney's ..the famous burger/hot dog place in L.A

The article is about the effects that raising the min wage could have on small businesses like this one.

Susan Shelley: Will small businesses like Studio City’s Carneys roll out of state if minimum wage rises?

I thought this was really striking ..

John and his brother Bill are the owners of Carneys, the hamburger and hot dog stands inside train cars on Ventura Boulevard in Studio City and on the Sunset Strip in West Hollywood.

“I could make more money if I didn’t work,” John said on a recent afternoon. Citing the thousands of dollars a week going out the door for payroll taxes, he said in frustration, “I could just rent the trains and the billboard space, have no employees, and not work.”


Also this..
"“If elected officials had ever owned a business,” John said, “they would realize that they can’t just keep piling on, adding costs over and over. Businesses are like sports teams. They can leave and go to another city. We’re all free agents.”"

If city of L.A makes it cost prohibitive to do business in the city , and business owners have little incentive to do business here, will we just see more businesses opening out of the city of county?

City of L.A isn't the only came in town now these days and other cities are growing and improving too. Look at the growth in Orange County or San Gabriel Valley .

Even if someone lives in city of L.A, they could still commute out of the city to operate their business.
As the owner of Carneys says.
This isn't the only article I've read like this. I had also heard that Tony Yanow owner of craft beer brewery Golden Road , and Tonys Darts away (burbank), and Mohawk Bend(Echo Park) is also worried about a min wage hike...he is diversifying and opening a big place in Orange County because of this, and because of general bureaucracy insanity of city of L.A
Golden Road Brewing Doubles Down on Huge New OC Brewpub - Eater LA


What use will a min wage hike do if it means LESS jobs and less businesses in the city of L.A? Which means more people unemployed..and less business taxes to collect , and more people driving further outside the city for work.

Anybody else concerned about this, and how it could affect the city?
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Old 04-21-2015, 01:17 PM
 
367 posts, read 502,684 times
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An issue surely but the minimum wage here is pitifully low in relation to COL... some businesses will be put out unfortunately but min wage increase will improve the economic health of the region at large (as seen in pretty much all long term studies of minimum wage increases). There does exist a minimum wage that is mathematically unsustainable... 15.25 by 2019 is nowhere near it.
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Old 04-21-2015, 01:58 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
635 posts, read 547,773 times
Reputation: 438
Funny how states with a higher minimum, like Washington, are thriving. Yes raising the minimum wage will hurt some small businesses but it has been proven that a small increase in prices can cover the increase to the minimum wage. You also need to look at large companies like Walmart that pay little while the family that owns the majority of Walmart stock, the Waltons, are the richest family in the USA. Walmart also has the largest amount of employees on welfare by raising the minimum wage you can get more people off welfare and more people to be self sustainable. When most of the wealth growth over the last few years has only gone to the top couple percent of people you need to look at the income inequality and something needs to change. As the middle class shrinks and more people fall in to the poor class you need to be concerned. Raising the minimum wage wouldn't just help those making minimum wage think about the gap between $9 and $15, it will help a large portion of the population.
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Old 04-21-2015, 02:04 PM
 
9,716 posts, read 12,940,289 times
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Some businesses will move but others will take their place. Businesses go where the customers are -- and the customers aren't moving just because the minimum wage goes up.

There was a business owner who used to post about taxes on these pages. He was always angry about how high the taxes were in California. One day he packed up and moved to Colorado. Finally he got his "lower taxes."

But there was a problem with that. You see, here in California his business was thriving and he was selling 100 units a month of his product. In Colorado, he was only selling two units a month. So, he got his lower taxes but he also got a much lower income.

Businesses need to balance everything to figure out what they need. It isn't always the lowest taxes or the lowest costs.
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Old 04-21-2015, 02:14 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
24,151 posts, read 13,668,407 times
Reputation: 11364
Quote:
Originally Posted by UB50 View Post
Some businesses will move but others will take their place. Businesses go where the customers are -- and the customers aren't moving just because the minimum wage goes up.

There was a business owner who used to post about taxes on these pages. He was always angry about how high the taxes were in California. One day he packed up and moved to Colorado. Finally he got his "lower taxes."

But there was a problem with that. You see, here in California his business was thriving and he was selling 100 units a month of his product. In Colorado, he was only selling two units a month. So, he got his lower taxes but he also got a much lower income.

Businesses need to balance everything to figure out what they need. It isn't always the lowest taxes or the lowest costs.
Good point , not every business will survive in every environment. But I think we could see less of a diversity of businesses.

This hurts the poor or middle class more than the rich of course.

If you look at a high cost area like Beverly Hills or Brentwood, there aren't too many places where you can get a cheap meal for example.
It's nothing for someone that is rich to buy a $12 sandwich, but that's a lot of money to the min wage worker. Of course most probably prepare their own meals...but that's besides the point.

Also the min wage goes up that's great...but then everyone from the supermarket to the hot dog stand is going to charge you more because their costs went up...that $3 raise per hour will quickly disappear.
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Old 04-21-2015, 02:26 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
635 posts, read 547,773 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982 View Post
Good point , not every business will survive in every environment. But I think we could see less of a diversity of businesses.

This hurts the poor or middle class more than the rich of course.

If you look at a high cost area like Beverly Hills or Brentwood, there aren't too many places where you can get a cheap meal for example.
It's nothing for someone that is rich to buy a $12 sandwich, but that's a lot of money to the min wage worker. Of course most probably prepare their own meals...but that's besides the point.

Also the min wage goes up that's great...but then everyone from the supermarket to the hot dog stand is going to charge you more because their costs went up...that $3 raise per hour will quickly disappear.
Jim it has been shown on many studies that the prices of products and services would need to increase a small amount to cover the raise in minimum wage...so an increase would not quickly disappear. The only reason it would is if places like Walmart take advantage of such increase. We need to stop allowing big business to scare us in to believing an increase of the minimum wage is a bad thing...it's happened many times since the minimum wage law was made law...if it had kept up with inflation and production it would be at $15 right now.
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Old 04-21-2015, 05:09 PM
 
Location: La La Land
1,514 posts, read 1,894,333 times
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According to this profile:



https://credibility.com/limitedservi...eys-restaurant





It would appear that Mr. Wolfe is making some unnecessary noises.
While every business needs to make profits, so does every employee need to earn a decent living. No one guarantees that a business will be able to maximize its profits at the cost of fair wages. If you choose to do business in a high COL city, your wages must be aligned with that cost of living.

It seems that somewhere along the line every business owner assumed they would become wealthy on the backs of their employees. As someone who was involved in two family businesses, after covering expenses, salaries were the next consideration. If it meant a couple of percentage points less profit, we were satisfied as long as we knew our employees were fairly compensated. In the long run it resulted in loyal and trustworthy employees and healthy businesses that survived many difficult times, often due to the assistance of our happy employees..
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Old 04-21-2015, 05:25 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
635 posts, read 547,773 times
Reputation: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by quixotic59 View Post
According to this profile:



https://credibility.com/limitedservi...eys-restaurant





It would appear that Mr. Wolfe is making some unnecessary noises.
While every business needs to make profits, so does every employee need to earn a decent living. No one guarantees that a business will be able to maximize its profits at the cost of fair wages. If you choose to do business in a high COL city, your wages must be aligned with that cost of living.

It seems that somewhere along the line every business owner assumed they would become wealthy on the backs of their employees. As someone who was involved in two family businesses, after covering expenses, salaries were the next consideration. If it meant a couple of percentage points less profit, we were satisfied as long as we knew our employees were fairly compensated. In the long run it resulted in loyal and trustworthy employees and healthy businesses that survived many difficult times, often due to the assistance of our happy employees..
It's too bad most companies don't understand what you just wrote. The Walton's of Walmart are worth $175 billion, that is the combined income of 30% of the US population...but Walmart has more employees on public assistance than any other company...they also pay low, give no benefits to most employees and under-work most employees.

At one time in this nation one member of the household could support the whole family and get healthcare/retirement from their employer. Now both adult members in a family need to work in attempt to support their family. The middle and poor class continue to lose ground in income inequality. It amazes me how many people who would benefit from a minimum wage increase are against it...the sheople who follow a government controlled by big business...your Democracy is really an Oligarchy.
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Old 04-21-2015, 09:46 PM
 
Location: West Hollywood
3,196 posts, read 2,351,138 times
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It's entirely a myth that increasing minimum wage kills businesses and destroys jobs. Large corporations are practically unaffected because worker pay has become such a small expense in relation to operating costs and profits and small businesses already pay better than most corporations so only a tiny percentage of small businesses end up having to pay their employees more when minimum wage increases do occur. As history has shown, increasing the minimum wage results in an economic boost. More people have more money to spend which leads to more jobs and better business, especially in mid- to large-sized cities. The perception of minimum wage increases killing jobs and making everything more expensive comes from the corporate executives(and their media lapdogs) that want to maintain their absurd salaries and golden umbrellas. It's not a coincidence that executive salaries and benefits have increased several times over in the last several decades while worker wages have stagnated.
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Old 04-23-2015, 11:03 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles (Native)
24,151 posts, read 13,668,407 times
Reputation: 11364
I just read this article that was in the L.A Weekly. It was one of the more quality articles that I've read, compared to some of the fluff pieces.

Will L.A.'s Proposed Minimum-Wage Hike Harm Restaurants or Help Workers

It has quotes from the owners and workers at Canter's deli on Fairfax as well as other restaurant owners and workers.

The third generation owner of Canter's deli says that if the law passes she will most likely not stay open later, which would mean a loss of employees or shorter hours for employees and existing employees having to work much harder. One of the waiters mentioned that service would also fall.

Service is already pretty bad at some places, so I can just imagine when owners start cutting back.

Some restaurants such as Bestia (which is a hotspot I've heard of but haven't been to) would likely go to a flat rate service charge of 18% across the board , which a lot of customers don't like.

It sounds like some of the service staff there make $35/hour or $70,000 a year.

I think the owner of Canter's makes a good point that some people are trying to support 4 or 5 kids on min wage , and that is a personal choice.

Another thing I thought of is that with much higher wages, restaurants will probably be looking to automate and use technology as efficiently as possible. I know there are already some places that have those tablets where you order ,etc.

I know there are some apps now where you can pay for your meal via smartphone.

restaurants in China already have robot servers.
This restaurant replaced humans with robot waiters | New York Post

This is interesting too...not sure why this hasn't come to the U.S...I'm sure there would be an audience for it.
https://www.finedininglovers.com/blo...t-restaurants/

There are many servers that are great , but I think we've all had restaraunt experiences where we would of rather had a robot.

If people had the option to be served by a robot for less than being served by a human...I'm sure many would be perfectly fine with the robot as long as their food came out good.
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