The Midwest is the best if... (Glendale, Burbank: apartment, renting, car insurance)

[erin_elise_]

Originally Posted by seain dublin

It really depends on what you mean by quality of life. The Midwest is flat, has humid summers, and brutal winters. The poster on here who keeps bashing Southern CA (Nightbird) lives in Cushing, OK which was devastated by a tornado a few years back. It also stinks of crude oil. Have you been through that part of the country? It's flat, dusty, butt ugly, and has the smell of oil in the air. I have driven through the TX/OK oil country and all I could think was "this is the ugliest part of the nation I have ever seen"(and I have been through most of the country).

Ever hear the expression "when you go cheap, you get cheap"?

I guess if you consider quality of life a big house in an area that has no scenery, not much culture, hot humid summers, harsh winters so that you can have that bigger house vs. living in an area where you love the weather(most of time), have gorgeous scenery, lots to do in regards to entertainment and culture.

That's not to say there aren't great places to live in this country besides Southern CA, of course there are, but when you start basing everything on how much cheaper some places are you have to look at what they offer.

You go live someplace where you can get your McMansion for $150K, you better like that house, because you're going to be spending most of your time in it due to the weather, lack of things to do, lack of good paying jobs, etc.

yea i kind of agree with this sentiment.

weather plays a HUGEEEEEEE role in desirability, at least for me.

[seain dublin]

Originally Posted by 909er

That is actually a very false statement. I have friends and family that own a home, nice car, and boat making $20/hr. Thats a household income around $80k. You cant do that in CA. Its also easier to find a job over there, and if you lose your job, you can go to a temp agency and get by on $10/hr temporarily. In CA, you can't do that. Lose your job, you can be in serious trouble quickly. Go to a temp service to get by, nobody speaks English at the temp jobs out here, and wouldn't make enough to get by anyway.

And the lower taxes, registration, gas, and no smogging makes that Camry cheaper to run in the Midwest.

You also have false statements.

You think everyone in Southern CA is making over a 100K a year? Or even 80K a year? Guess again.

And what kind of "temp jobs" are you talking about? Where no one speaks English? So if you go to Apple One or Office Team no one there speaks English? And when they place someone at a company let's say in Pasadena, no one in the office speaks English?

Now if you're talking about standing on the corner waiting to get picked up as day laborer, than I agree, but you said temp agencies, that is simply not true at all.

As far as cars go, do you know what a Midwest winter can do to a car that isn't parked in a garage when not in use? Ever hear of hail storms? Cars last longer in CA due to the dry more moderate climate.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by 909er

That is actually a very false statement. I have friends and family that own a home, nice car, and boat making $20/hr. Thats a household income around $80k. You cant do that in CA.

I'd say a false statement is that $20/hr adds up to $80 K annually. Your math is way off.

[NOLA101]

Originally Posted by kingdomkz

Ultimately you will always save more money if you can just put up with humidity and winter in other states.

Not necessarily.

For one, you are only looking at income tax. Property taxes are much lower in CA than in the Midwest.

Also, utility costs are far higher in the Midwest. The winters have added costs, from snow removal, to heating, to wear and tear on your property.

CA has higher taxes but more services. The free beaches and parks in CA will be $10 or $20 in the Midwest. The better roads in CA will be potholed in the Midwest.

[znlwovuhrjw]

Originally Posted by NOLA101

Not necessarily.

For one, you are only looking at income tax. Property taxes are much lower in CA than in the Midwest.

Also, utility costs are far higher in the Midwest. The winters have added costs, from snow removal, to heating, to wear and tear on your property.

CA has higher taxes but more services. The free beaches and parks in CA will be $10 or $20 in the Midwest. The better roads in CA will be potholed in the Midwest.

You have never owned property and lived in Colorado. This lack of caring about accurate information is exactly why people do not like Californians.

California's 1% property tax is dependent upon the price of the house itself, so if you live in a house that costs $650,000 you pay $6500 per year whereas the person with the 2% property tax with the exact same house for the price of $150,000 will instead pay $3000 per year. Very misleading notions of reality.

http://energy-models.com/tools/avera...gas-cost-state

Wrong, California is one of the most expensive states in the country on electric AND soon to be gas after the swap over to natural gas electric power plants.

"Free Beaches and Parks", you're telling me you drove right through the toll booths in Yosemite and ignored the parking meters at the beaches?

Wrong.

Buy a metal roof and buy weather proof materials for the house.

[909er]

'd say a false stats that $20/hr adds up to $80 K annually. Your math is way off.

That was each person of a married couple making $20/hr

[quixotic59]

Originally Posted by kingdomkz

After all is said and done from the taxes in California, you are paying about 30% of all money spent to state taxes prior to federal taxes. 9.25-10.25% sales tax + 9.3% state income tax + (~5% total tax from fuel (do the math!) + ~5% property tax (LA/Bay Area home assessments) ((~10% changes above $120,000 per year)). This number also increases significantly for people who receive dividend payments or rely heavily upon dividend income (The combined state+federal value is 33% in California, the highest in the United States). Water taxes are also coming soon, the new number will probably be more around 35% for all state tax.

Ultimately you will always save more money if you can just put up with humidity and winter in other states.

So we're thinking of moving from NYC to LA. Looking at your numbers as a guide here's what I dug up on NYC (ballpark figures for annual income in the $60,000 to $80,000 range):

Sales tax: 8.875%
NYC Income Tax: 2-3%
NYS Income Tax: 3-4%
Gasoline Tax: 4%
Property Tax: 11-19%

That gives a range of 29-39%.

Then there is this:
"By one measure, in cities like Houston or Phoenix — places considered by statisticians to be more typical of average United States incomes than New York — a solidly middle-class life can be had for wages that fall between $33,000 and $100,000 a year.
By the same formula — measuring by who sits in the middle of the income spectrum — Manhattan’s middle class exists somewhere between $45,000 and $134,000.
But if you are defining middle-class by lifestyle, to accommodate the cost of living in Manhattan, that salary would have to fall between $80,000 and $235,000. This means someone making $70,000 a year in other parts of the country would need to make $166,000 in Manhattan to enjoy the same purchasing power.
Using the rule of thumb that buyers should expect to spend two and a half times their annual salary on a home purchase, the properties in Manhattan that could be said to be middle-class would run between $200,000 and $588,000."

Suddenly, Los Angeles looks a lot better.

[znlwovuhrjw]

New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, Massachusetts, and California are all relatively expensive.

[seain dublin]

Originally Posted by NOLA101

Not necessarily.

For one, you are only looking at income tax. Property taxes are much lower in CA than in the Midwest.

Also, utility costs are far higher in the Midwest. The winters have added costs, from snow removal, to heating, to wear and tear on your property.

CA has higher taxes but more services. The free beaches and parks in CA will be $10 or $20 in the Midwest. The better roads in CA will be potholed in the Midwest.

Correct, when you're paying in the triple digits every month to heat the house it gets costly in many states. The cost of home heating oil is pricey.

Than you have FL, where you need to the run the A/C 24/7 about 9 months out of year, it's not an option not to, not just due to the horrific heat and humidity but to prevent mold. You're looking at triple digit bills as well . In Southern CA most of the year you can do without heat or A/C.

Even on really hot days due to it being mostly dry you don't need to run the A/C nonstop in CA, in places like FL and other hot/humid states, you can't turn it on and off for an hour or two, it has to keep running all the time.

And there is no cool down at night either.

[John_marts]

Yes. We are all aware of the phrase "you get what you pay for".

Its cheaper to live in the midwest, obviously. Do I prefer paying much less for much less things to do with zero scenery, nothing but chain restaurants, wal-marts and no beaches? No.