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Old 05-03-2015, 09:12 AM
 
Location: Southridge
452 posts, read 581,988 times
Reputation: 430

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Quote:
Correct, when you're paying in the triple digits every month to heat the house it gets costly in many states. The cost of home heating oil is pricey.
Quote:
Even on really hot days due to it being mostly dry you don't need to run the A/C nonstop in CA
Incorrect. Depending where you live in CA, this may be true. If you are within a few miles of the coast, you don't have many utilities, but you pay outrageous amounts in rent or mortgage. Far more than the Midwest. Now if you are in the SFV, SGV, or IE, you are running heat on winter nights and A/C quite a bit from now through mid-october. It's been over 90 degrees out here in the Valleys, and people have their A/C on, self included. My gas bill is much cheaper in CA but the electric is about the same as the Midwest.

In the Midwest during the winter, late Nov through early March, it is possible to have $200 to $400 heating bills those months, depending on size of house, insulation, severity of winter, etc, but that's only ~3 months. Your rent and mortgage are far higher in CA than a few utility bills in the Midwest.

Quote:
Its cheaper to live in the midwest, obviously. Do I prefer paying much less for much less things to do with zero scenery, nothing but chain restaurants, wal-marts and no beaches? No.
I believe this depends on your budget in CA, hence the point of the thread. If you're struggling in CA, you're not at the beach or non-chain restaurants very often. You're working or at home. You might as well live better in the Midwest than CA, unless looking at the mountains everyday is worth busting hump over?
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Old 05-03-2015, 10:02 AM
 
755 posts, read 637,224 times
Reputation: 1252
Quote:
Originally Posted by 909er View Post
if you can afford to own a home close to your job in SoCal, and the schools are good, you got it made....................Commutes are short, schools are generally above average for all income levels...............
This is true in parts of Phoenix as well, especially in the subs. I have nice home with a big yard and central local for all my needs; 18 min drive to work-wife is 15 mins- and my home school district is very good. And its not just about affordability, it is just difficult to find all of that together in LA no matter how much you make, LA is massive.

I moved away from LA 10 years ago. I had a home and a household income over 150k per yr. I moved to Phoenix for the bigger house and better lifestyle mentioned above for my kids. My household income is over 150k here and I have everything I want, but cooler summers, which doesn't bother me too much. So I am happy, but.......

I have been offered a more lucrative job opportunity in LA. Five years ago I would have jumped at the chance, but now I am settled-in in Phoenix, traveling to LA when I need to fill my jones. But, I do miss LA, period. For whatever reason, I miss it. I don't know if it is nostalgia, more friends, the things to do that I didn't do that often, but knew I could if I wanted, or just sometimes Phoenix is just too simple. Because of the latter I am really considering the move. But the beneath quote frightens me.

Most things here (as a whole) are nicer family-wise, except that summer heat (think SFV in Aug add 10 degrees with no nighttime cooling), but LA is just LA and the thought of moving back intrigues me and my wife. Now, you guys have this (see beneath quote) and the water issue!!! Who'd of thought that LA woud have a water issue over Phoenix

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingdomkz View Post
After all is said and done from the taxes in California, you are paying about 30% of all money spent to state taxes prior to federal taxes. 9.25-10.25% sales tax + 9.3% state income tax + (~5% total tax from fuel (do the math!) + ~5% property tax (LA/Bay Area home assessments) ((~10% changes above $120,000 per year)). This number also increases significantly for people who receive dividend payments or rely heavily upon dividend income (The combined state+federal value is 33% in California, the highest in the United States). Water taxes are also coming soon, the new number will probably be more around 35% for all state tax.
Even though money won't be an issue, I don't like being squeezed just because. Phoenix tax burden is so much less than LA and even though I can afford it, I don't like the idea of spending so much of my money on a house. I bought my LA home in 1999 and sold in 2005

With all of that being said, I am a dumbass and I am leaning towards moving back with a solid plan in place to ensure I won't loose out if LA is a bad as some say since I left; but, I heard downtown was stepping up and gentrification was kicking butt, making DWTN LA a more desirable place to visit. Having a sucky DWTN when I lived there limited the holistic appeal of the city.

If I can get Phoenix convenience in LA, its a no brain'er.

This thread reminded a lot of why I left, but also, why I miss LA.

Last edited by jmac1; 05-03-2015 at 11:12 AM..
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Old 05-03-2015, 10:46 AM
 
Location: So Ca
25,036 posts, read 23,208,073 times
Reputation: 22397
Quote:
Originally Posted by 909er View Post
Now if you are in the SFV, SGV, or IE, you are running heat on winter nights and A/C quite a bit from now through mid-october.
If you're way out in the IE, maybe. Not if you live in the SGV or the SFV.

Quote:
If you're struggling in CA, you're not at the beach or non-chain restaurants very often. You're working or at home. You might as well live better in the Midwest than CA, unless looking at the mountains everyday is worth busting hump over?
If family and job are not factors, then of course people who are seeking a lower cost of living would move to the midwest. Most of us who like southern CA are here for the following reasons: we grew up here, our families and friends are here, and/or our jobs are here. (Yes, the weather is good and there are many cultural advantages, but they're secondary). Anyone who moves here because of the weather, the culture, the myth of endless beaches, etc, is going to find a lot wrong with southern CA.
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Old 05-03-2015, 11:23 AM
 
Location: Southridge
452 posts, read 581,988 times
Reputation: 430
Quote:
Not if you live in the SGV or the SFV.
I lived in Glendale for 3 years and it is true that you need climate control in the valleys. It gets hot, and cold.
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Old 05-03-2015, 12:25 PM
 
17,815 posts, read 24,355,812 times
Reputation: 36242
Quote:
Originally Posted by 909er View Post
Incorrect. Depending where you live in CA, this may be true. If you are within a few miles of the coast, you don't have many utilities, but you pay outrageous amounts in rent or mortgage. Far more than the Midwest. Now if you are in the SFV, SGV, or IE, you are running heat on winter nights and A/C quite a bit from now through mid-october. It's been over 90 degrees out here in the Valleys, and people have their A/C on, self included. My gas bill is much cheaper in CA but the electric is about the same as the Midwest.

In the Midwest during the winter, late Nov through early March, it is possible to have $200 to $400 heating bills those months, depending on size of house, insulation, severity of winter, etc, but that's only ~3 months. Your rent and mortgage are far higher in CA than a few utility bills in the Midwest.



I believe this depends on your budget in CA, hence the point of the thread. If you're struggling in CA, you're not at the beach or non-chain restaurants very often. You're working or at home. You might as well live better in the Midwest than CA, unless looking at the mountains everyday is worth busting hump over?

Sorry, that's not true. I don't live anywhere near the beach and had the A/C on in the house(two story) the last couple of days for only a couple of hours, because it is dry it takes till mid to late afternoon for the house to start to get too warm, run the A/C for a couple of hours and it is fine.

You make it sound like you're running the A/C non stop like you would have to do in a southern state with high humidity for months on end, you don't have to do that in CA.

Now if you're in a hot and humid climate you need to run the A/C all day and all night and it adds up. My utility bills are much less in CA than in FL. I have lived in 5 states, also turned on the heat only once here this winter, that's not an option back east. BTW my car insurance decreased as well by several hundred dollars, with a newer car in CA.

The big expense in CA is the home purchase, but other things like groceries, car insurance are cheaper than FL. The Midwest I'm sure is cheaper. But you have awful summers and brutal winters. And it's so flat. I would look at places like NC or TN, that offer some scenery and more moderate climates if someone wants to relocate out of CA.

And as far as your mountains comments go, I lived in CA for almost 20 years, left for a few years and was visiting family(who live in right up against the San Gabriel mountains) I was standing outside one morning, my cousin said "what are you looking out?", I said "the mountains". Try living somewhere for awhile that is flat, incredibly hot and humid most of the year, and not a lot of trees(FL)....LOL.

As the song goes "Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got
‘Til it's gone"

It's easy when you live somewhere that has amazing scenery and lots to do to take it for granted. Than you go somewhere else that lacks scenery, lacks any culture, jobs that pay much less, etc. That you realize while it costs more to live here, there are reasons for that.


And yes there are people who would rather live somewhere where they can enjoy the scenery and the weather vs. having a bigger home in a place they don't really care for. You get one "go round" in life, living somewhere you don't like just because it's cheaper isn't living.
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Old 05-03-2015, 01:29 PM
 
Location: So Ca
25,036 posts, read 23,208,073 times
Reputation: 22397
Quote:
Originally Posted by 909er View Post
...you are running A/C quite a bit from now through mid-october.
I see from your profile that you live in zip code 92337....no wonder you're running your A/C six months a year.
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Old 05-03-2015, 02:00 PM
 
Location: OC/LA
3,830 posts, read 4,412,163 times
Reputation: 2214
Quote:
Originally Posted by 909er View Post
I lived in Glendale for 3 years and it is true that you need climate control in the valleys. It gets hot, and cold.
I have yet to turn on my AC this year. I'm 15 miles inland.
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Old 05-03-2015, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,545 posts, read 20,322,279 times
Reputation: 16932
Quote:
Originally Posted by seain dublin View Post
It really depends on what you mean by quality of life. The Midwest is flat, has humid summers, and brutal winters. The poster on here who keeps bashing Southern CA (Nightbird) lives in Cushing, OK which was devastated by a tornado a few years back. It also stinks of crude oil. Have you been through that part of the country? It's flat, dusty, butt ugly, and has the smell of oil in the air. I have driven through the TX/OK oil country and all I could think was "this is the ugliest part of the nation I have ever seen"(and I have been through most of the country).

Ever hear the expression "when you go cheap, you get cheap"?

I guess if you consider quality of life a big house in an area that has no scenery, not much culture, hot humid summers, harsh winters so that you can have that bigger house vs. living in an area where you love the weather(most of time), have gorgeous scenery, lots to do in regards to entertainment and culture.

That's not to say there aren't great places to live in this country besides Southern CA, of course there are, but when you start basing everything on how much cheaper some places are you have to look at what they offer.

You go live someplace where you can get your McMansion for $150K, you better like that house, because you're going to be spending most of your time in it due to the weather, lack of things to do, lack of good paying jobs, etc.
Only a few tornaods have come near Cushing, and the last one with much damage didn't effect most of the town. Not sure where you get your info but it was a while longer than 'a few years ago'. Keep in mind that during storm season (spring) the storms can be loud and fierce but don't hang around long. The vast majority of people in this state who've lived here all their life have never seen a tornado. And with all the chasers and radar and so on, you can know just where storms are. I follow the radar on my laptop and all the tv stations are on telling you exactly where any active storms are.

Personally I'm a lot more worried about the earthquakes which have become so common of late. And this state is actually centered over five distinct climatic zones, from the desert like area near Texas to the wooded green country up near Tulsa. Where I live is hilly and there are lots of trees and a beautiful open sky, on the mixed area leading into Green country. Sceneary is more than what you drive to. There is also no crush of people around you and spring into fall this area is green.

The difference between here and the IE is that the scenery may not be as spectacular as what you can drive to on a weekend there, but its here, not at the end of a long drive. It's not wall to wall people either, if that's something which you seek. And while I'm not in love with the oil stuff, there is little of it in your face. The industrial areas are not in residental areas as a rule. But the real plus is the sky is BLUE, not grey and filled with smog. The IE may have beautiful skies for a few months a year, but once the smog comes in its prevasive. I had to get away from that and when I got her could breath. That sold me instantly.

And weather here isn't that different than socal in a lot of ways. Summer is hot. But people visit the many lakes, and while we're having a drought problem, its far far less than California. Its no hotter here than in socal. In winter it gets cold and we get snow storms, but generally they don't last long.

People don't hide inside the house, but go out for entertainment like everyone else.

The thing which is different, which some of us wish to get away from, is that things don't move at warp speed here. People aren't in a rush. Its relaxing and refreshing. If that appeals to you and your not a fan of socal speed, places like OK and the 'flyover' zone just might make you happy.

In the end we always compromise and there are some, but then if you move TO socal your going to have to do that too.

If a place isn't for you, fine, it isn't but don't just 'generally' bash a whole swath of the country because you traveled through it and it wasn't like home. And 'boring' depends on one's defination of 'boring.

I'd never go back to an area with the smog like socal.
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Old 05-03-2015, 02:10 PM
 
35,097 posts, read 48,541,556 times
Reputation: 62561
Quote:
Originally Posted by 909er View Post
You don't have a household income of at the very least $125k in SoCal, but preferably $150k or higher. I say this because if you can afford to own a home close to your job in SoCal, and the schools are good, you got it made.

But if you don't make a whole lot, you can buy a home for $125k or less in the Midwest. Commutes are short, schools are generally above average for all income levels, unemployment rates are low, people are friendly, etc.

You're just not going to get that premium weather that we pay the weather tax for. And for some, that tax is awfully high. Quality of life in other states is much higher for lower incomes.

The midwest as well as everywhere else is best when people who do not like living there do not move there or do move away from there.
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Old 05-03-2015, 02:22 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,545 posts, read 20,322,279 times
Reputation: 16932
Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982 View Post
Good point nightbird, I think it's good to keep an open mind. LA definitely isn't the place for someone if they are looking for a nonrushed laid back type of lifestyle . Although some parts can be slower than others . Burbank or Glendale for example are a much different scene than West Hollywood or Santa Monica for example.

I've never been to OK though so I'm sure things are entirely different there .

If I haven't been somewhere I try not to have preconceived notions of what it might be like .

I was born in LA , but I can't say I will always stay here . I think a lot of people have the attitude of "I'll never leave LA" but do they really know much about other places ?

With more people getting pushed into poverty because of housing costs you would think more people would be looking at alternatives .

I saw an article where a lady was protesting for a $15 minimum wage because she couldnt support her 6 kids on $9 An hour . She said if she made $15 she wouldn't need welfare and could support her family .. Seems like strange logic .

I think LA politically has turned off a lot of the middle class too by catering more and more to the poor or low income .

Having too many poor people and the rest mostly wealthy and rich doesn't make for a strong economy .

It's good to have some social programs for the poor to help them advance , but the poor that can't support themselves have overwhelmed the system , and city services are really lacking which translates into a lower quality of life for anyone considered " middle class" .

Of course you won't hear any discussion of this because it's not politically correct.
Why assume I agree or disagree about anything politics from where I live? The problem with our general society is we're subdividing down the middle. Those with money are florishing. Those on the lower middle and down are struggling and slipping. That middle is fading. Why should an ordinary house built in the fifties and sixties cost 200k? Why should people need to earn twelve bucks an hour to survive? We're creating an underclass which is in the end going to sink us as a society.

My son and his wife are in their eartly twenties, and moved from socal to Utah where they finally found jobs, and they are talking about when they get the income of buying there since housing is so much less. People like me, who could do no better than a crummy little apartment and them who are starting out and renting a room are leaving and won't be coming back.

As far as 'slower', Burbank moves at warp speed. The IE does too. Everyone who moves here had to deal with the pace, which is simply not in any hurry. It's frustrating at first, but if you decide you like it going back to the rat race would just not be an option.
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