If L.A. Sucks Why is housing expensive (Los Angeles, San Diego: real estate, rent)

[Sassberto]

Originally Posted by marilyn220

but it shows me that most of the country isn't as "inclusive" as back in NYC, even in liberal Cali.

In NYC, everyone lives in their little neighborhood, and segrates themself by block, highway or canal. That's why you have blacks on the east side of Flatbush and Whites on the west side, or Dominicans above 96th street, or Indians in Jackson Heights but not Corona

In CA everyone is pretty much all mixed together with the exception of the Ethnic enclaves, which are not "diverse" per se.

The Italians didn't learn to speak english or adopt American customs when they arrived either. It took years before that happened. Every single poor immigrant group has gone through this. The difference is that the Italians were white.

[deeptrance]

Originally Posted by marilyn220

Is this all it took? For you to be around 50 different foreigners to show how "diverse" the city is?

I generally agreed with your post although you seem to be hostile toward whatever you thought I was saying. Not sure why. My point was that the 50 different languages in 3 hours (exaggerated for effect ) is what makes me start to LOVE the place. Were you implying that my whiteness is some kind of curse that I carry with me and use against all who are "diverse" according to some arbitrary standard of what cultural diversity means? Hmmm...

I love LA. And your "New York is oh-so-much hipper than LA" take is really stale, it's been dumped on Cali for at least 50 years, meanwhile New Yorkers move out to Cali in droves for reasons of apparent self-inflicted pain and suffering.

Sorry for the sarcasm, I actually liked your post. I even gave you a positive on it.

[marilyn220]

Originally Posted by Sassberto

In NYC, everyone lives in their little neighborhood, and segrates themself by block, highway or canal. That's why you have blacks on the east side of Flatbush and Whites on the west side, or Dominicans above 96th street, or Indians in Jackson Heights but not Corona

In CA everyone is pretty much all mixed together with the exception of the Ethnic enclaves, which are not "diverse" per se.

The Italians didn't learn to speak english or adopt American customs when they arrived either. It took years before that happened. Every single poor immigrant group has gone through this. The difference is that the Italians were white.

Those blocks aren't as "separated" as you think. A "block" has FOUR sides. On one side can be owned by the Irish, around the corner can be all Italian or PR and across the street could be black or jewish. And this is not the sixties, seventies, and eighties, due to financial constraints those "blocks" are "diverse" now whether they want to be or not. There aren't that many neighborhoods today where it's just one group of people anymore. Yes, some do still exist, but not like they were back in the day. Thank goodness.

The very positives about Los Angeles, is that people who come here ARE LOOKING FOR A CHANGE and tend to see people for who they are (or what they can get) instead of their ethnic background. You can go into a store on Rodeo Drive in sneakers, baseball cap and sweats and the salespeople will treat you like you have a million dollars. No judgments. They're used to rich people being from all types of backgrounds and I like that. Quite different from NYC.

[Sassberto]

Originally Posted by marilyn220

Those blocks aren't as "separated" as you think.

Look at the demographic maps for NYC sometime.

http://www.socialexplorer.com/pub/ma...pSN=C2000Tract

[marilyn220]

Originally Posted by deeptrance

I generally agreed with your post although you seem to be hostile toward whatever you thought I was saying. Not sure why. My point was that the 50 different languages in 3 hours (exaggerated for effect ) is what makes me start to LOVE the place. Were you implying that my whiteness is some kind of curse that I carry with me and use against all who are "diverse" according to some arbitrary standard of what cultural diversity means? Hmmm...

I love LA. And your "New York is oh-so-much hipper than LA" take is really stale, it's been dumped on Cali for at least 50 years, meanwhile New Yorkers move out to Cali in droves for reasons of apparent self-inflicted pain and suffering.

Sorry for the sarcasm, I actually liked your post. I even gave you a positive on it.

See, this is why sometimes typing something in a post can sound quite different in person. No, I didn't mean to be sarcastic and I'm glad you're feeling the diversity of L.A - that's a GOOD thing, believe me. And no, being white is not a curse! LOL! It's just that being white affords you the opportunity to live, work, move anywhere you want without fear of repercussions. Yes, this is how most non-whites like myself think. LOL! You don't ever have to walk into a corporate office and see only two or three other minorities like yourself in an office of 100+ people. Or worry about if whether or not someone will rent you an apartment or hire you based on your race. Or be asked stupid questions (i.e., "How do u feel about OJ getting off?" or "Why do black people do such and such?") like you're a representative of the entire race.

No, being white is NOT a curse. It's a gift. You should look at it as being born with a silver spoon in your mouth even if you were born in a trailer park, because that's how "others" see it. I know it's not true, but in all honesty white people don't EVER have to deal with a minority for most of their lifetime if they don't want to. Hopefully, those perceptions will change soon, but those thoughts are pretty much alive and well in the hearts and minds of many non-whites.

ETA: Oh, I don't think NYC is the be all and end all of the Universe. There are reasons why I left and don't want to go back. When I did my research on LA four years ago, apartments were inexpensive and jobs "appeared" to be plentiful in what I do. Fast forward to NOW, rents for a one-bedroom is $1200 - $1500 and studios aren't much better. No PERMANENT job as of yet either. I didn't come here for "self-inflicted" pain. This was supposed to be a cheaper version of NYC, but for all that I'm going thru I would have been better off in San Francisco.

[marilyn220]

Originally Posted by Sassberto

Look at the demographic maps for NYC sometime.

http://www.socialexplorer.com/pub/ma...pSN=C2000Tract

I don't need to see a map Sassberto, up until THREE years ago, I lived there. I've SEEN all FIVE of the boroughs change due to high rents and home prices. The closer you are to Manhattan the more money you have to pay. Trust me, when I say those neighborhood are becoming more INTEGRATED. Not because they want to, but because they have no choice and it's becoming harder and harder to find a place due to landlords becoming more picky (and careful) about who they let in.

[coldwine]

California is very expensive, but it isn't because everyone wants to live there. Nor are three billion people trying to live there.

California is expensive because it has high taxes that gouge the eyeballs out of business, and I think it's something like $0.79 of every tax dollar goes to the federal government, and not to California proper. That's a lot of lost revenue to make up.

Further from that, California has amassed debt it cannot pay off. So things like infrastructure are falling apart without there being much to replace them.

What makes housing specifically so expensive is the use of land. I'm not sure how to best express what California has done to its own land other than to say, a mentally crippled chimpanzee with cataracts drawing on a wall probably has a better grasp of organization than zoning laws in Cali. The worst part is that it's never going to change-- SoCal is filled up, and it's going to stay that way. The land use is so inefficient and sprawling that, coupled with the idiotic building restrictions, demand is so far inflated beyond real numbers. It isn't real demand that drives the Californian housing market-- it's purely imaginary in the minds of creditors and owners. Which is why houses in San Diego and Los Angeles are impossible to sell.

I love California, and I think that it's an amazing place, but as a young college student I don't know anyone who plans on going there. Every job fair, Californian businesses line up at my university and beg engineering, business and law students to submit resumes, but it's just never feasible. The same thing happens a lot with NYC employers; these days it's not really worth our money or time to look to the coasts for a future.

[Need_affordable_home]

So you are saying CA isnt close to worth the price it costs and its not demand causing the high prices but ineffecient use of land. I feel the same way in south Florida, those prices are crazy(not as bad as CA but still) I can buy in other desirable locations for much less and I dont mean Oil city, how bout a huge(5000+ total square feet) 6 bedroom brand new house near Atlanta Georgia for just $250k? Now thats a fairly reasonable price. Texas is even cheaper but Georgia has a better climate(not so insanely hot in summer)

[fairweathergolfer]

Originally Posted by coldwine

California is very expensive, but it isn't because everyone wants to live there. Nor are three billion people trying to live there.

California is expensive because it has high taxes that gouge the eyeballs out of business, and I think it's something like $0.79 of every tax dollar goes to the federal government, and not to California proper. That's a lot of lost revenue to make up.

Further from that, California has amassed debt it cannot pay off. So things like infrastructure are falling apart without there being much to replace them.

What makes housing specifically so expensive is the use of land. I'm not sure how to best express what California has done to its own land other than to say, a mentally crippled chimpanzee with cataracts drawing on a wall probably has a better grasp of organization than zoning laws in Cali. The worst part is that it's never going to change-- SoCal is filled up, and it's going to stay that way. The land use is so inefficient and sprawling that, coupled with the idiotic building restrictions, demand is so far inflated beyond real numbers. It isn't real demand that drives the Californian housing market-- it's purely imaginary in the minds of creditors and owners. Which is why houses in San Diego and Los Angeles are impossible to sell.

I love California, and I think that it's an amazing place, but as a young college student I don't know anyone who plans on going there. Every job fair, Californian businesses line up at my university and beg engineering, business and law students to submit resumes, but it's just never feasible. The same thing happens a lot with NYC employers; these days it's not really worth our money or time to look to the coasts for a future.

HMMMM. A thinking person in their early twenties.

My thought is you are smart and have good logic and foresight, but most young men and women in their early twenties are not thinking with their larger heads and there is sunshine, a lot of clubs, beaches, and quite a singles scene here.

You sound like you have your head on straight, but my guess is you are few and far between. Also there are some jobs that to be employed in NY or LA is critical if they want success. There are no options and it is an honor in those fields to be employed in either NY or LA.

[Kathleenh54]

Grew up in NY, moved to Ventura five years ago and moved with retired spouse to Ashland, Oregon this summer. We loved SoCal and would have stayed but the cost of living was too high for us on a fixed income. Prop 13 is great for people who've lived in their homes for thirty years, but for 'new arrivals' it isn't very retiree friendly. I'd have stayed forever, problems notwithstanding.