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Old 01-21-2017, 01:59 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Humboldt1 View Post
Indy had 28mm visitors in 2015, so calling BS on this one.

I did not pull Cincy, Cleveland, Columbus or St Louis but imagine their numbers are similar, maybe larger.
https://www.google.com/amp/www.cleve...?client=safari


Louisville blew out Cleveland in tourists not only grossly but per capita its substantial.

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnat...i-tourism.html

Louisville is the same as Cincy there amd once all the hotels convention center, and especially, bourbon attractions open, louisville will pull away.

Bourbon is Louisville 's trump card and something no one posting here clearly understands which is why Louisville has doubled tourists in just 3 years.


anyways....louisville is a successful city post merger with every single metric but crime (which is up nationally)
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Old 01-21-2017, 02:56 PM
 
3,008 posts, read 4,164,683 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
so Indy has a 50% larger metro area but only 3 million more visitors?

St louis is nearly twice as big metro but only 1.5 million more?
My point is proven! The post meant to say per capita. Why does Louisville success bother so many?? Louisville has one of the highest per capita tourism rates in the midwest and even thee south.

where is the souce indy had 27 million? that's effectively very similar to louisville numbers.

Louisville IS a major tourist city and you will all be provej wrong in the next few years.
Indy's tourism numbers were done by Rockport analytics which I stated.

Your point really isn't proven. What metric does Louisville use to qualify as a tourist? It's not uncommon for cities to have similar numbers within the same population tier.

Throwing up an estimated number which these numbers are doesn't tell the full tale. What's the occupancy rate which is a metric that is determined and not estimated? I posted months ago in retort to you that while Louisville has been building hotels, it's occupancy rate really didn't warrant it. Maybe that rate has gone up but until it hits the rates of a minney or Indy on a consistent basis which those 2 cities do, they will just be better. One, the rate is higher and secondly, they have more rooms to fill to keep that rate by a margin of 2k plus rooms respectively.

I don't think anyone is jealous of anything with Louisville. Folks just aren't over inflating what it is. You will get tourists for derby and the trail as well as six flags reopening. Just don't get carried away with the Louisville is the greatest thing since sliced bread boosterism.
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Old 01-21-2017, 05:01 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msamhunter View Post
Indy's tourism numbers were done by Rockport analytics which I stated.

Your point really isn't proven. What metric does Louisville use to qualify as a tourist? It's not uncommon for cities to have similar numbers within the same population tier.

Throwing up an estimated number which these numbers are doesn't tell the full tale. What's the occupancy rate which is a metric that is determined and not estimated? I posted months ago in retort to you that while Louisville has been building hotels, it's occupancy rate really didn't warrant it. Maybe that rate has gone up but until it hits the rates of a minney or Indy on a consistent basis which those 2 cities do, they will just be better. One, the rate is higher and secondly, they have more rooms to fill to keep that rate by a margin of 2k plus rooms respectively.

I don't think anyone is jealous of anything with Louisville. Folks just aren't over inflating what it is. You will get tourists for derby and the trail as well as six flags reopening. Just don't get carried away with the Louisville is the greatest thing since sliced bread boosterism.
So wait, now you come in to the LOUISVILLE forum and tell people what to think? You have boosted Indy many times.

Louisville has THIRTY hotels under construction. That's because it has a lower vacancy than anywhere in this region but Nashville. Occupancy above 60 are great money makers. That's why out of state businesses are investing hetr. So you are saying people are flocking to build hotels here to lose money?? Do you honestly believe these business men/women are fools? No...Louisville is hot and awake for the first time in 100 years. This place was a dump as recently as the 1990s. What a turn around since the first time I came here with my father! I literally remember trash heaps om the waterfront. Now it is glistening with marinas and apartments.

Louisville isnt the gratest thing ever...but its one of the finest metros under 2 million and the growth and 9 Billion in construction in city alone proving it.
If you think the only draws here are bourbon, derby, and what you incorrectly calked six flags, you are sorely mistaken. Just ask the droves of people here every weekend from Indianapolis and surrounding areas.
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Old 01-21-2017, 05:48 PM
 
3,008 posts, read 4,164,683 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
So wait, now you come in to the LOUISVILLE forum and tell people what to think? You have boosted Indy many times.

Louisville has THIRTY hotels under construction. That's because it has a lower vacancy than anywhere in this region but Nashville. Occupancy above 60 are great money makers. That's why out of state businesses are investing hetr. So you are dayinh people are flocking to build hotels here to lose money??

Louisville isnt the gratest thing ever...but its one of the finest metros under 2 million and the growth and 9 Billion in construction in city alone proving it.
If you think the only draws here are bourbon, derby, and what you incorrectly calked six flags, you are sorely mistaken. Just ask the droves of people here every weekend from Indianapolis and surrounding areas.
Firstly, I can go whever I want! Secondly, READ my posts and you will see I give HONEST upfront comments both good and bad. Thirdly, the amount of times you've popped up in the Indy forum where Louisville wasn't even thought of and decided to add your louisville homerism to the topic completely void of anything KY, shouldn't be talking. I'm sure other forums know exactly what I'm saying.

Now to to the rest of your post, 18k hotel rooms metrowide for Louisville vs 33000 Indianapolis with overall better occupancy rates. Now take the prime area which is the CBD where Louisville still average around 61-63% occupancy vs. 71% for DTI. Even when Louisville reaches that 5200 room plateau, Indy will still have more rooms connected to the Indiana Convention Center than Louisville has hotel rooms which will be at approx 8300 by that time. 70% is the benchmark for the demand for a signature hotel (hotel of 1k rooms or more).

Why would you hype 9 billion? Seriously everyone and their mother is spending billions on downtown revitalization. You want Louisivlle to get a cookie for doing something everyone else is doing. What did you think every other city supposed to stop or something. Since you say I'm boosting, let's use this as an example. Indianapolis has had a rolling 8-10 billion per year investment since the 70's into downtown. Didn't even slow down during the recessions. Whooptidoo for Louisville.

Seriously Pete, as I said earlier, no one is jealous of Louisville, just the whole best thing since sliced bread is just plain bs to put it bluntly. It isn't doing anything special that anyone else isn't. Indy, Columbus, Nashville, New Orleans, Austin, Charlotte, etc. everyone is doing it! Everyone is having success with it for their regions.
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Old 01-21-2017, 08:58 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msamhunter View Post
Firstly, I can go whever I want! Secondly, READ my posts and you will see I give HONEST upfront comments both good and bad. Thirdly, the amount of times you've popped up in the Indy forum where Louisville wasn't even thought of and decided to add your louisville homerism to the topic completely void of anything KY, shouldn't be talking. I'm sure other forums know exactly what I'm saying.

Now to to the rest of your post, 18k hotel rooms metrowide for Louisville vs 33000 Indianapolis with overall better occupancy rates. Now take the prime area which is the CBD where Louisville still average around 61-63% occupancy vs. 71% for DTI. Even when Louisville reaches that 5200 room plateau, Indy will still have more rooms connected to the Indiana Convention Center than Louisville has hotel rooms which will be at approx 8300 by that time. 70% is the benchmark for the demand for a signature hotel (hotel of 1k rooms or more).

Why would you hype 9 billion? Seriously everyone and their mother is spending billions on downtown revitalization. You want Louisivlle to get a cookie for doing something everyone else is doing. What did you think every other city supposed to stop or something. Since you say I'm boosting, let's use this as an example. Indianapolis has had a rolling 8-10 billion per year investment since the 70's into downtown. Didn't even slow down during the recessions. Whooptidoo for Louisville.

Seriously Pete, as I said earlier, no one is jealous of Louisville, just the whole best thing since sliced bread is just plain bs to put it bluntly. It isn't doing anything special that anyone else isn't. Indy, Columbus, Nashville, New Orleans, Austin, Charlotte, etc. everyone is doing it! Everyone is having success with it for their regions.
This is not an Indy comparison thread. If you werent worried about Louisville, you wouldn't have searched for Indianapolis comments and chimed in to our discussion about merger. The fact that you posted here means you DO feel threatened by what is going on in the ville. There is no way Indy has had 10 billion in development every year since 1970. Thats pure hyperbole and you know it. You know so little about Louisville that you thought it was Six Flags which reopened.

This is a Louisville thread and Louisville is doing great, it is booming. I think alot of it is related to merger. Lots of cities are doing well but lots aren't. Louisville is doing all the right things with the exception of transit because the bridges project was a boondoggle.

But seriously quit coming in here talking about Indy. I lived there and its bland and boring. Indy was only brought up in terms of Airbnb visitors, of which Louisville gets more. You are correct that some or if that is Louisville has kess hotels and thus probably makes up for it with airbnb "hotels."

If you have thoughts on why on why Louisville is better or worse after merger then sure, lets discuss it. If you'd like to do an Indy vs Louisville thread this isnt the place.

Last edited by Peter1948; 01-21-2017 at 09:17 PM..
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Old 01-22-2017, 09:52 AM
 
Location: Humboldt Park, Chicago
2,686 posts, read 6,830,363 times
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Default Response to Peter

I agree that 10B is pure hyperbole since the 70s but msamhunter shows that Indy has much more robust hospitality economy that Louisville based upon hotel rooms and occupancy. 10b in 1970s would have been a truly large number because of inflation alone.

They family that runs freaking Holiday World now runs what used to be Kentucky Kingdom, which is essentially a small Six Flags.

Nothing wrong with being a booster for your area but posting bs numbers is misleading when you know other numbers refute airbnb numbers (total hotel rooms and occupancy, dollars spent, visitor numbers, downtown investment).

I grew up 90 minutes from Louisville so we spent more time in Cincy and Indy and mostly drove thru it on way to Nashville or the Smokies.

Nashville has improved a lot in the last 30 years, not nearly as much for Louisville and honestly you do not get favorable view of Louisville as you drive 65 thru town.

I have no doubt Louisville has nice areas and nice newer developments but I just do not see it as major tourist draw.

I do not see Indy as more bland or boring than louisville, just slightly more affluent (per capita income and household income). Not saying Indy is perfect. I live and work in Chicago and need to be in bigger metro than Indy for my job (international corporate finance).

Last edited by Humboldt1; 01-22-2017 at 10:08 AM..
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Old 01-22-2017, 02:51 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Humboldt1 View Post
I agree that 10B is pure hyperbole since the 70s but msamhunter shows that Indy has much more robust hospitality economy that Louisville based upon hotel rooms and occupancy. 10b in 1970s would have been a truly large number because of inflation alone.

They family that runs freaking Holiday World now runs what used to be Kentucky Kingdom, which is essentially a small Six Flags.

Nothing wrong with being a booster for your area but posting bs numbers is misleading when you know other numbers refute airbnb numbers (total hotel rooms and occupancy, dollars spent, visitor numbers, downtown investment).

I grew up 90 minutes from Louisville so we spent more time in Cincy and Indy and mostly drove thru it on way to Nashville or the Smokies.

Nashville has improved a lot in the last 30 years, not nearly as much for Louisville and honestly you do not get favorable view of Louisville as you drive 65 thru town.

I have no doubt Louisville has nice areas and nice newer developments but I just do not see it as major tourist draw.

I do not see Indy as more bland or boring than louisville, just slightly more affluent (per capita income and household income). Not saying Indy is perfect. I live and work in Chicago and need to be in bigger metro than Indy for my job (international corporate finance).
I think that is a pretty fair assessment....except you are way off on multiple points. But Indy is by no means "rich" compared to Louisville.

What we have here is people chiming in to a Louisville thread about merger who have NO IDEA about anything going on here. Just in the last 3 months, so many construction sites have sprouted in the urban core its simply mind boggling. There is no exaggeration. Who is posting "BS numbers?" So far we have seen that from MSAmhunter by falsely boostering Indianapolis in a Louisville forum by making the laughable claim that Indy has had 10 Billion a year in construction since 1970.

We now have you stating KY Kingdom is a "small park" owned by the family who runs Holiday World....also untrue and misleading. So who is the ones posting "misleading facts?" So, you are from 90 minutes from Louisville....is the translation, you are from Indiana and came here to defend Indianapolis?


Please find me where I exaggerated. My original post was supposed to say Louisville had more "per capita" tourists than any city around. And that is remarkably true. Louisville has 24.2 million tourists. Indy has 27 million. Louisville is a SIGNIFICANTLY higher per capita tourist draw. Based on metro size difference, Indy should have close to 50 million tourists. You will see that by 2020 Louisville will very likely draw more tourists than Indy. So, even though you do not "see" Louisville as a tourist draw, it does not matter: Louisville is a tourist draw and that tourist draw is growing EXPONENTIALLY. Just a few short years ago Louisville had 10 million visitors. Again, many of your opinions of Louisville is from driving through and stopping at an exit on I-65. That means NOTHING!

Louisville has less hotel rooms so that is why 31 are getting built over the next 2 years. That is also why Louisville has far more Airbnb hosts and more Airbnb room nights.

Name a city that has multiple tourist attractions (bourbon distilleries) open every year. Do you guys honestly think all these distilleries are patronized by local Louisvillians? I am starting to think none of you have spent any significant time in the urban core of Louisville in the last few years


And Humbolt, please visit Louisville and quit trying to just google information. First of all, KY Kingdom is not small. Not huge, but no small. There is NO RELATION between KY Kingdom and Holiday World. Six Flags closed KY Kingdom after they ran it into the ground due to disinvestment.
A local Louisville investor, Ed Hart, revived the part and has been adding big time attractions every year since opening. He was actually the original creator of the park inthe 90s long before Six Flags took over and destroyed it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kentucky_Kingdom

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holida...in'_Safari

Koch family has NOTHING to do with KY Kingdom and never have....you must have googled the article where they thought about buying it, lol

Last edited by Peter1948; 01-22-2017 at 04:01 PM..
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Old 01-22-2017, 04:06 PM
 
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
9,584 posts, read 20,459,831 times
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Louisville the city isn't a huge magnet for tourists but Louisville Events are. Thunder Over Louisville, Derby, Oaks, Pegasus Parade, Forecastle, St James Court Art Show, etc. Earlier I forgot to mention Thunder, which draws more people than Derby and Oaks combined. Cincinnati has no events in the ballpark of Louisville's top 3, Indy does have the IRL and NASCAR race at the Speedway.
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Old 01-22-2017, 04:14 PM
 
Location: Humboldt Park, Chicago
2,686 posts, read 6,830,363 times
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Default Kentucky Kingdom

Peter,

You are correct about Kentucky Kingdom. I was wrong about Koch family as they only considered buying the park. It is a moderate sized amusement park with regional draw. We always went to Kings Island though they were both 90 mins from where I grew up.

I am not an Indy booster btw, having left the area 15 years ago due to better job prospects in Chicago.

I think a better number would be convention dollars to compare Indy and Louisville.

I only said Indy was slightly more affluent than Louisville. Both are far from wealthy and actually slightly below national average, though col is pretty low for both.

I did agree with you that per capita Louisville has a lot of visitors compared to larger metros in Midwest.
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Old 01-22-2017, 09:28 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Humboldt1 View Post
Peter,

You are correct about Kentucky Kingdom. I was wrong about Koch family as they only considered buying the park. It is a moderate sized amusement park with regional draw. We always went to Kings Island though they were both 90 mins from where I grew up.

I am not an Indy booster btw, having left the area 15 years ago due to better job prospects in Chicago.

I think a better number would be convention dollars to compare Indy and Louisville.

I only said Indy was slightly more affluent than Louisville. Both are far from wealthy and actually slightly below national average, though col is pretty low for both.

I did agree with you that per capita Louisville has a lot of visitors compared to larger metros in Midwest.
One of main convention center here closed for 200 million renovation next to 300 million hotel.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.biz...?client=safari


The yum center is now one of busiest in the WORLD for concerts! Louisville IS a big tourist draw. New orleans or Vegas? No way. Austin or Nashville? Not far off.

Certainly more than ohio michigan and many mid sized cities in mid america. Lots to do here!
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