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Old 11-20-2016, 05:47 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natguy View Post
Again with the 2 days....I clearly wrote 2 weeks and I never said Downtown wasn't active, just mostly tourists and not a whole lot for residents to do
I'm not the shopper, my wife is and I dropped her off in New Albany while I went exploring the neighborhoods although I didn't get very far before she called me and told me to come pick her up because there was so very little shopping. Maybe in time, both locales will attract more of both national and local retailers but as of now any real shopping has to be out in the suburban fringes where all the strip malls and big box retailers are located.

Construction on almost every block ?? I strongly disagree with your statement. After extensive walking around downtown, all we saw was work along Main Streets Whisky row and at the Omni site but maybe dozens of new projects began in June after we had left but I find that difficult to believe
Listen,

Chattanooga is SO SMALL that this is not even comparable! Chattanooga could fit most of its city squarely within downtown Louisville:

http://www.rivercitycompany.com/reta...opEatGuide.pdf

This lists LESS than 100 establishments. This also includes pretty much everything "urban" chattanooga has to offer and it seems to me that over half the list is restaurants.

Louisville is too big to have a website that compares everything, so let me compare Chattabooga to New Albany, IN a SUBURB of Louisviille:

New Albany Shopping | Southern Indiana is So IN

They are actually somewhat comprable alone! New Albany probably has 50-60+ "retail estbalishments" in downtown area alone, which is similar to the Chattanooga list.


Now keep in mind that Chattanooga has absolutely nothing like urban neighborhoods. Really nothing. No Germantown, no Highlands. No Clifton, no Crescent Hill. No Butchertown, Old Louisville or Beechmont.

No heart of St Matthews. No Nulu. The list goes on and on. If you want to compare cities, you can compare Louisville to Nashville and then say some of the things you did, but unfortunately I am afraid you missed alot in Louisville.

I am also from Chicago, and within the mile loop there is NOT much retail. It is also dead after 5 PM...like any CBD in America. The pulse and big city activity in downtown Chicago is along the Magnificent Mile.

Comparing Louisville and Chattanooga is about as silly as comparing Louisville with Chicago. Sure, you can draw some comparisons. but when one city is 5 times bigger than the other, it really cannot be compared.

Just curious, did you look here?

http://villagegreen.com/louisville/8...ts/photos#gref


Just to prove to you that Louisville has multiple suburbs, not just New Albany, with about as much retail as downtown Chattanooga, here is another, Norton Commons, which lists 60:

http://nortoncommons.com/commons-lifestyle/town-center/


Should you revisit, I will be happy to show you around Louisville. It's not a city that jumps out at you, and since it is so much bigger than Chattanooga, it is not as easily explored. Pretty much anything walkable in Chattanooga is downtown. That is not the case at all in Louisville. Chattanooga is much more quint. It's cute and compact. But with all Louisville's contruction, it will be a whole new place by 2016. You mentioned, "just the Omni," but did you realize that will have 200 luxury apartments, an upscale grocery, several retail establishments, 2 pools, a park, and at least 4 restaurants plus a speakeasy/bowling alley and nightclub? That alone is a 350+ million project.


As a final example, the Highlands ALONE has more shopping/retail destinations than all of downtown Chattanooga and surrounding areas combined:

http://www.thehighlandsoflouisville.com/Shopping.php

This doesn't include 100+ restaurants:
http://www.thehighlandsoflouisville.com/Restaurants.php

Again, this is not even a comparison and I have left out multiple Louisville neighborhoods, including downtown.

Last edited by Peter1948; 11-20-2016 at 06:15 AM..
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Old 11-20-2016, 01:26 PM
 
79 posts, read 80,984 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
Listen,

Chattanooga is SO SMALL that this is not even comparable! Chattanooga could fit most of its city squarely within downtown Louisville:

http://www.rivercitycompany.com/reta...opEatGuide.pdf

This lists LESS than 100 establishments. This also includes pretty much everything "urban" chattanooga has to offer and it seems to me that over half the list is restaurants.

Louisville is too big to have a website that compares everything, so let me compare Chattabooga to New Albany, IN a SUBURB of Louisviille:

New Albany Shopping | Southern Indiana is So IN

They are actually somewhat comprable alone! New Albany probably has 50-60+ "retail estbalishments" in downtown area alone, which is similar to the Chattanooga list.


Now keep in mind that Chattanooga has absolutely nothing like urban neighborhoods. Really nothing. No Germantown, no Highlands. No Clifton, no Crescent Hill. No Butchertown, Old Louisville or Beechmont.

No heart of St Matthews. No Nulu. The list goes on and on. If you want to compare cities, you can compare Louisville to Nashville and then say some of the things you did, but unfortunately I am afraid you missed alot in Louisville.

I am also from Chicago, and within the mile loop there is NOT much retail. It is also dead after 5 PM...like any CBD in America. The pulse and big city activity in downtown Chicago is along the Magnificent Mile.

Comparing Louisville and Chattanooga is about as silly as comparing Louisville with Chicago. Sure, you can draw some comparisons. but when one city is 5 times bigger than the other, it really cannot be compared.

Just curious, did you look here?

800 Tower City Apartments | VillageGreen.com


Just to prove to you that Louisville has multiple suburbs, not just New Albany, with about as much retail as downtown Chattanooga, here is another, Norton Commons, which lists 60:

Town Center | Norton Commons


Should you revisit, I will be happy to show you around Louisville. It's not a city that jumps out at you, and since it is so much bigger than Chattanooga, it is not as easily explored. Pretty much anything walkable in Chattanooga is downtown. That is not the case at all in Louisville. Chattanooga is much more quint. It's cute and compact. But with all Louisville's contruction, it will be a whole new place by 2016. You mentioned, "just the Omni," but did you realize that will have 200 luxury apartments, an upscale grocery, several retail establishments, 2 pools, a park, and at least 4 restaurants plus a speakeasy/bowling alley and nightclub? That alone is a 350+ million project.


As a final example, the Highlands ALONE has more shopping/retail destinations than all of downtown Chattanooga and surrounding areas combined:

Shopping in The Highlands of Louisville, KY USA

This doesn't include 100+ restaurants:
Restaurants in The Highlands of Louisville, KY USA

Again, this is not even a comparison and I have left out multiple Louisville neighborhoods, including downtown.
You clearly missed my point. I only am comparing the percentage of retail in the CBD and both Chatt and Chicago of course is higher. Neighborhoods outside of CBD don't count in my argument . if we live downtown it matters not the amount of retail a half hour away in Norton or drive in the car to Bardstown rd. My argument that downtown Lou's retail sector is almost non existent is still valid .

What constitutes a urban neighborhood ? Any city over 100K in population with a predominantly pre WW2 housing stock is what I would call urban and both Chatt and Lou fit that criteria, what is your definition ?
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Old 11-20-2016, 01:46 PM
 
79 posts, read 80,984 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
This list is WAY behind and only lists projects over I think 3 or 10 million:

http://www.bizjournals.com/louisvill...ect-watch.html

And there are dozens even here on this site.
Several cranes went up after you left, but you missed MAJOR construction sites all over. Heck, 8 hotels are under construction downtown alone! A few of these are historic rehabs. For example, I am sure you walked by the Starks and Republic Buildings and had no idea they are under construction for apartments and hotels. That is what I mean.

In fact, there are sooo many projects, that some are not even listed on that site yet, even some huge ones like this:

http://www.bizjournals.com/louisvill...ct-in-the.html

There are literally too many for me to even remember.

There is almost 2 billion in construction for downtown either now or proposed.


I am not discounting what you are saying, and cannot disagree with some of it, but you need to give it another look, probably next year.

And there is NO WAY chattanooga has more going on in its downtown than Louisville. It's not even close. No major arena, no major theatre district. Chattanooga does not attract 20+ million tourists a year (it attracts less than 4 million). The only thing Chattanooga has on Louisville is a very tiny aquarium. That aquarium is so small it reminds me of the Falls of the Ohio interpretive center in Clarksville IN, across from Louisville, which also has some fish tanks. Ok, that's a stretch but yo get the idea. The Tennessee aquarium is the type of place you go once and you have seen it all, and don't really need to go again after 2 hours there.
A 7 story apartment building in downtown Lou is considered a major development ? I guess if it was a small city or a dead downtown.
The reuse and remodeling of old buildings to residential uses is indeed a positive note but I would question that the loss of office space and resulting decrease in jobs downtown might be a major negative too .
I forgot about the Kindred expansion as we stayed at the Brown hotel across the street but it looked like a forgettable project anyways. Suburban looking office project expanding on prime downtown real estate to me screams at waste of land space
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Old 11-20-2016, 08:52 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natguy View Post
A 7 story apartment building in downtown Lou is considered a major development ? I guess if it was a small city or a dead downtown.
The reuse and remodeling of old buildings to residential uses is indeed a positive note but I would question that the loss of office space and resulting decrease in jobs downtown might be a major negative too .
I forgot about the Kindred expansion as we stayed at the Brown hotel across the street but it looked like a forgettable project anyways. Suburban looking office project expanding on prime downtown real estate to me screams at waste of land space
How did you ignore the 2 billion in other development there? Yes. 300 units is a big development. It would be one of the biggest apartment projects in downtown Chattanooga, and it is a drop in a bucket as to what is going on in Louisville. That was my point. That list leaves off dozens of projects.

While I appreciate your opinion, you are just not aware of Louisville has to offer.

How come no comment as to why you claimed downtown Louisville was "dead as Gary and had the retail of Gary" but triumphed a SMALL TOWN as very active?

Your argument holds no weight as the stats I showed prove. Downtown Chattanooga has less than 100 retail establishments, and thats a stretch as they included pretty much every business that exists there! On the other hand, I picked 6th string suburbs of Louisville like New Albany And Norton Commons which have as much retail as ALL of downtown Chattanooga...

I am not trying to knock Chattanooga...I actually like it. But to say its downtown has more to offer is at best a stretch and at worst some kind of weird boosterism. Again, picking the worst (but still big) development in downtown Louisville and nitpicking it is preposterous. Why would you mention the Kindred HQ when it is arguably the worst project going on? Again, the motivations seem suspect.

Your argument that Chattanooga offers as much retail as Louisville in the urban core is just as ridiculous as me claiming Louisville could compete with retailers in urban Chicago, or even urban ATL

Sure, it would be nice to have a Jcrew in downtown Louisville. Kudos to Chatt for having that in a small town. That said, there aren't any really major chain retailers there either. You are acting like Chattanooga is Charelston or something. Granted, I have not been there extensively for almost 1.5 years, but did it change that much? I think not.

All I am saying is let someone who knows Louisville show you around. Get a good apartment finder or realtor. Hope your search goes well.

Last edited by Peter1948; 11-20-2016 at 09:01 PM..
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Old 11-20-2016, 09:06 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natguy View Post
A 7 story apartment building in downtown Lou is considered a major development ? I guess if it was a small city or a dead downtown.
The reuse and remodeling of old buildings to residential uses is indeed a positive note but I would question that the loss of office space and resulting decrease in jobs downtown might be a major negative too .
I forgot about the Kindred expansion as we stayed at the Brown hotel across the street but it looked like a forgettable project anyways. Suburban looking office project expanding on prime downtown real estate to me screams at waste of land space
Downtown Louisville is gaining jobs, though. You didn't mention the office buildings that are getting built, like Nucleus.

Again, maybe you have good intentions, but your posts look awfully similar to a troll we used to have around here who would say they were from Chicago then compare Louisville to tiny southeast towns and then talk about how downtown Louisville was dead. Sure, its completely dead compared to Chicago. But compared to Chattanooga? It's like New York City! lol
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Old 11-21-2016, 05:28 AM
 
79 posts, read 80,984 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
Downtown Louisville is gaining jobs, though. You didn't mention the office buildings that are getting built, like Nucleus.

Again, maybe you have good intentions, but your posts look awfully similar to a troll we used to have around here who would say they were from Chicago then compare Louisville to tiny southeast towns and then talk about how downtown Louisville was dead. Sure, its completely dead compared to Chicago. But compared to Chattanooga? It's like New York City! lol
Maybe because I'm from Chicago, development in Lou looks pitiful compared to where I live but a trip through Nashville a month ago looked like a boom town compared to Lou and the cities are about the same size but I still stand with my original claim that downtown Lou is a ghost town from a retail perspective.
So what happened to all the trees ?
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Old 11-21-2016, 10:20 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,176,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natguy View Post
Maybe because I'm from Chicago, development in Lou looks pitiful compared to where I live but a trip through Nashville a month ago looked like a boom town compared to Lou and the cities are about the same size but I still stand with my original claim that downtown Lou is a ghost town from a retail perspective.
So what happened to all the trees ?
Nashville is one of the most booming cities in America for its size.

That said, Louisville is no slouch. 7 tower cranes up right now downtown alone!

Comparing project Watches for both cities, Louisville has about 2/3 as much projects as Nashville. So, Louisville is not as far behind as you say.

Also, no way is Louisville a ghost town. Come back almost any warm evening and drive or walk from downtown. 4th, main, market, east to bardstown rd, then jaunt over to Frankfort ave and heart of st Matthews....people and shops everywhere!
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Old 11-22-2016, 04:16 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
Nashville is one of the most booming cities in America for its size.

That said, Louisville is no slouch. 7 tower cranes up right now downtown alone!

Comparing project Watches for both cities, Louisville has about 2/3 as much projects as Nashville. So, Louisville is not as far behind as you say.

Also, no way is Louisville a ghost town. Come back almost any warm evening and drive or walk from downtown. 4th, main, market, east to bardstown rd, then jaunt over to Frankfort ave and heart of st Matthews....people and shops everywhere!

Moderator cut: -.Bardstown, Frankfort av and St. Matthews are not part of downtown.

7 construction cranes ?.....3 alone on the Omni project I assume, the rest on small hotel projects. Nashville had at least 2 dozen when we were there and most were delegated to new apartment highrises. No comparison at all

Last edited by Oldhag1; 11-26-2016 at 03:17 AM.. Reason: Please discuss the topic only, not other posters
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Old 11-22-2016, 12:42 PM
 
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
9,584 posts, read 20,459,831 times
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Louisville will not be able to keep up with Nashville until Kentucky updates its outdated tax code. GOP just took the last Democrat controlled chamber and major tax reform and passing 'Right to Work' are said to be a top priority, perhaps even removing the state income tax. Kentucky is socially conservative and fiscally liberal, Tennessee is one of the least taxed states. The other problem is Louisville never has competitive mayoral elections and voters reward politicians who keep the status quo. Wal Mart wanted to open a store in poorest part of town and city govt killed the project because the 'parking lot would destroy the planet'. Louisville has a lot of good, creative people but local govt prevents growth that is possible.
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Old 11-22-2016, 04:49 PM
 
79 posts, read 80,984 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by censusdata View Post
Louisville will not be able to keep up with Nashville until Kentucky updates its outdated tax code. GOP just took the last Democrat controlled chamber and major tax reform and passing 'Right to Work' are said to be a top priority, perhaps even removing the state income tax. Kentucky is socially conservative and fiscally liberal, Tennessee is one of the least taxed states. The other problem is Louisville never has competitive mayoral elections and voters reward politicians who keep the status quo. Wal Mart wanted to open a store in poorest part of town and city govt killed the project because the 'parking lot would destroy the planet'. Louisville has a lot of good, creative people but local govt prevents growth that is possible.
Interesting perspective considering that most of the boom towns in the country are ruled by Liberals . I suspect the city of Lou doesn't do enough to entice more developers or prospective employers to the city but I bet its more to do with the State not approving incentives then any sole thing the city is doing. Lot of funding for infrastructure comes from the state too and if conservatives run the state, very little of the states money will ever be invested in that and it shows. I know Lou has a sewer system that is in dire need of replacement, many streets in sub par condition and joke of a mass transit system.
A lack of a State income tax will not attract outside investors but a state of the art infrastructure system might and the last thing Lou or the State's residents can ill afford are RTW laws as they will shrink income for the working class even more than our unbalanced and unregulated capitalism system already has.
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