U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Maine
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 06-27-2011, 11:22 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
6,541 posts, read 13,780,873 times
Reputation: 1787

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maineah View Post
Every state where THE PEOPLE have voted on the question of Gay Marriage it has been stopped or overturned. A legislative initiative was not what the people of Maine wanted to be the deciding factor in determining what they considered a moral issue not just a legal one. Yes it may come up again and most likely will. It may very well pass next time as it was close the last time. Personally I could care less if gays marry....It's none of my business...It does not directly affect me in any way and if it makes people happier and more secure in their lives I see little point in fighting it. I do think it is for the people to decide however.
There are much more important issues in my opinion which need addressing. I'd much rather it is decided in referrendum by the voters than become law by executive fiat or legislative initiative. It means more when the people decide.
The tyranny of the majority should never trump the rights of a minority.

 
Old 06-27-2011, 11:31 PM
 
8,760 posts, read 16,176,616 times
Reputation: 3486
Quote:
Originally Posted by waccamatt View Post
The tyranny of the majority should never trump the rights of a minority.
Majority rules my friend...always has always will. That's how people get elected.... It's not tyrannical if most of the people believe it to be the best path to follow. Your statement has no bearing on the subject and is somewhat nonsensical.
 
Old 06-28-2011, 12:12 AM
 
Location: MINNEAPOLIS, MN
43 posts, read 104,231 times
Reputation: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by JViello View Post

As for the liberty and freedom infringements...I can assure you where I am currently planted there are PLENTY of people who do not agree with same sex marriage - which was passed, who are bent six ways to Sunday about certain public school curriculum's that are now being introduced forcing their kids to be taught various things about same sex marriage. That, my friend is in deed a violation of those parent's rights and "liberty". Specifically in the 1st amendment that says
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;
That last one is a real b*tch for those who hate religious people.

In short, when something becomes "law" it forces others into a box. I guess one just hopes they are on the "good" side of said law. I just prefer they don't pass the stupid law to begin with and let people just "live".
There is nothing prohibiting free exercise of religion in a curriculum referencing same sex marriage.

There are a lot of parts in the Bible condemning interracial relationships, and in the 60s a judge cited God as separating the races on different continents for a reason and that they were not meant to be together. It's funny how I don't hear about religious people citing immorality of interracial marriages anymore. There's plenty of evidence of it being immoral according to the Bible! Plenty.

The reason is because religions are based on ideas and texts that were written centuries ago. It is, by nature, anti-progressive. Religion does make progress, just as I'm sure 99% of people who consider their morals based on their religion would say that there is nothing wrong with interracial marriage. Unfortunately, because religion is based on the idea that there is a definitive right and wrong based on what a particular supernatural being wants, it is incredibly stubborn.

Because so many people are religious in this country, something else needs to be the driving force towards leading into a progressive society. Time and time again that has been government. And every issue government has intervened on in the past that has outraged the religious community of its time eventually becomes universally agreed upon by the religious community down the line (abortion is what they're currently learning to accept).

And gay marriage is next. It'll happen. I promise.
 
Old 06-28-2011, 12:13 AM
 
Location: Caribou, Me.
5,046 posts, read 3,605,810 times
Reputation: 3566
Quote:
Originally Posted by waccamatt View Post
The tyranny of the majority should never trump the rights of a minority.

But here you are engaging in one very wicked thing, and one very solipsistic thing, I believe:
Those who believe in the practice of marriage as it's been practiced and defined for thousands of years are "tyrants". That is a nasty, wicked arrow to fling. And deeply uncivil.
Because you deeply FEEL that something simply MUST be a right, therefore it is. That is solipsism.

I got no takers on the radicalism aspect of it, but I'll ask again: in what other radical ways do those of you who support gay marriage want to change society (if any)? This is a wildly radical notion that you have. I wonder if you have other radical notions.
 
Old 06-28-2011, 12:30 AM
 
Location: MINNEAPOLIS, MN
43 posts, read 104,231 times
Reputation: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by maineguy8888 View Post

I got no takers on the radicalism aspect of it, but I'll ask again: in what other radical ways do those of you who support gay marriage want to change society (if any)? This is a wildly radical notion that you have. I wonder if you have other radical notions.
You have yet to make a very good argument for your statement that our positions are radical. Society in its current nature has been changing radically for the past couple hundred years and even more so in the past 20 years. If my supporting gay marriage is radical because it is a fairly recent idea, then my answer for you on what other radical changes to society I support is this:

I support flying devices across oceans. Imagine how radical that idea was to someone 200 years ago.

I support the insane idea that everyone can communicate with everyone through the world wide web. What? The world wide web??? COMPUTERS?? PHONES THAT YOU CARRY WITH YOU.... ALL THE TIME??? Go back 40 years and tell the average joe what society would be like 40 years into the future and you'd be met by people who think your notions on how society will change are insanely radical and far, far out in left field.
 
Old 06-28-2011, 02:34 AM
 
Location: South Portland, Maine
2,356 posts, read 4,960,250 times
Reputation: 1511
Quote:
Originally Posted by elston View Post
Since it directly effects me....I will respond.

It is highly probably that the issue will come before the people of the State of Maine again....not thru the legislature...but as a referendum issue, to be decided by the voters. I believe that it is very likely that it will pass this time.....it was narrowly defeated last time and the momentum is on our side......and the campaign has already started. The Gov. doesnt have veto power over a referendum.

I am a senior citizen and have some health conditions.....but I still expect that I will live to be able to have my relationship recognized by the State of Maine.

It is ironic that altho our country professes the seperation of church and state.....my church is ready and willing to marry us.....the only obstacle to my legal marriage ...is a coalition of religious organizations and their financial and political influence.....The Catholic Church and the Church of Latter Day Saints (Morman) have at one time or another suffered prejudice and ostracism but now are the ones denying me the right to marry the person of my choice.....so much for the Golden Rule.

If these churches attempted to block divorce and to annul second marriages except for widows and widowers......more people might recognize that the right to marry is profound and important.....and the state should not use its power to deny equal protection under the law.....based on the religious beliefs of some of the citizens.
Elston, it is hard for me to debate you on this issue...

the fact is when it comes to most things me and you are on completely different sides and usually I have no problem speaking my mind..

But this issue is obviously close to you and means a lot for you..

You can't read into every comment everyone is saying for or against it.. at the end of the day you know how you feel.

I agree with you that eventually this will all come to pass..

Eventually there will be enought people that feel that this is a none issue and not worth fighting.. And hopefuly that will bring you some peace of mind.
 
Old 06-28-2011, 02:38 AM
 
Location: South Portland, Maine
2,356 posts, read 4,960,250 times
Reputation: 1511
Quote:
Originally Posted by waccamatt
The tyranny of the majority should never trump the rights of a minority.
I hope you feel the same way about progressive taxes, gun laws, expression of religion, and a whole host of other things that the left has been watering at the mouth to cram down our throats..
 
Old 06-28-2011, 02:42 AM
 
2,031 posts, read 2,315,851 times
Reputation: 1375
Quote:
Originally Posted by maineguy8888 View Post
Not going to happen.

I simply ask supporters of gay marriage if they have any other radical beliefs, and if there are any other radical changes they want. (Marriage has been primarily between women and men for millenia, thus any attempt to change that basic fact is by definition a radical one.)

What's been done in the name of equality....
and what's been done in the name of freedom...
Oh, yes it is.

Gay Marriage Opponents Now in Minority - NYTimes.com



The trend is obvious. The only question is how "when?". And the only answers are "soon" or "sooner".
 
Old 06-28-2011, 05:22 AM
 
1,403 posts, read 3,067,677 times
Reputation: 1308
Quote:
Originally Posted by maineguy8888 View Post
But here you are engaging in one very wicked thing, and one very solipsistic thing, I believe:
Those who believe in the practice of marriage as it's been practiced and defined for thousands of years are "tyrants". That is a nasty, wicked arrow to fling. And deeply uncivil.
Because you deeply FEEL that something simply MUST be a right, therefore it is. That is solipsism.

I got no takers on the radicalism aspect of it, but I'll ask again: in what other radical ways do those of you who support gay marriage want to change society (if any)? This is a wildly radical notion that you have. I wonder if you have other radical notions.
This notion isn't radical. That is why you haven't had any "takers" to argue with you why it is radical. Your initial assumption is wrong to start with.
 
Old 06-28-2011, 07:31 AM
 
Location: On a Slow-Sinking Granite Rock Up North
3,637 posts, read 5,289,795 times
Reputation: 2650
Quote:
Originally Posted by msina View Post
It will come to pass. Within the next few years it will be legal throughout the country. I'm sick to death of those that continuously complain about governments role in legislating "THEIR" personal freedoms yet, demand that the personal freedoms of others be supressed. Hipocrisy at it's finest.
[QUOTE]....It's none of my business...It does not directly affect me in any way and if it makes people happier and more secure in their lives I see little point in fighting it
Exactly! Mind your own Damned business people.[/quote]



Ding! msina wins the prize! I'd rep you and Maineah in triplicate if I could.

Last edited by cebdark; 06-28-2011 at 07:36 AM.. Reason: added
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread


Options
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2016 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Maine
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top