U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Maine
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-10-2007, 06:29 PM
 
Location: SoCal
352 posts, read 268,036 times
Reputation: 258

Advertisements

Just began reading a new (to me) book about Maine entitled "Off The Beaten Path - a Guide to Unique Places" Moderator cut: pleasedon't use advertising links

It was revised in 2006, but an entry in the introduction caught my attention and I wonder what has happened to the idea of a North Woods National Park in Maine.

Quote: "Northern Maine, the "Great North Woods", is currently the scene of some controversy. The area is primarily a huge commercial woodland, complete with untold miles of private roads and many small, long-established working communities. A plan to turn this area (which makes up about half of the state) into a North Woods national park is supported mostly by nonresidents, including some famous Hollywood types. Bumper stickers and signs announcing "North Woods National Park 100 miles" are seen on Saab and Volvo bumpers and store windows in places like Belfast and Camden."

I haven't read enough of this book yet to know whether the author describes proposed boundaries for this park, but his map of what he refers to as the North Woods area that appears opposite the table of contents consists of the entire counties of Piscataquis, Penobscot and Somerset.

Has this plan perished, is it hibernating or is it being actively being persued?

Last edited by Cornerguy1; 12-10-2007 at 07:41 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-10-2007, 06:58 PM
 
Location: Northern Maine
9,494 posts, read 14,291,662 times
Reputation: 8929
Park advocates have not given up. Their strategy is to make Maine land worth less by degrees so that eventually it will be worthless to any commercial enterprise. Their biggest triumph was the Mainee land use law that went into effect in 1971. Their second biggest was the new Maine Forest Practices Act which was LD2286 some six years ago. That one law has put many small and medium size loggers out of business and that's the intent.

There is a long rogues gallery starting with;
The Nature Conservancy
Audubon
Natural Resource Council of Maine
Maine Coast Heritage Trust
Northern Forest Lands Council
MAGIC
National Wildlife Federation
Sierra Club
The Wilderness Society

and many others. When you see these names for the first time they sound innocuous enough. When you look at what they do and not just what they say they reveal themselves for what their long term goals are. They want no human use of our home which is Northern Maine.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 07:08 PM
 
17,159 posts, read 22,175,230 times
Reputation: 31232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Northern Maine Land Man View Post
Park advocates have not given up. Their strategy is to make Maine land worth less by degrees so that eventually it will be worthless to any commercial enterprise. Their biggest triumph was the Mainee land use law that went into effect in 1971. Their second biggest was the new Maine Forest Practices Act which was LD2286 some six years ago. That one law has put many small and medium size loggers out of business and that's the intent.

There is a long rogues gallery starting with;
The Nature Conservancy
Audubon
Natural Resource Council of Maine
Maine Coast Heritage Trust
Northern Forest Lands Council
MAGIC
National Wildlife Federation
Sierra Club
The Wilderness Society

and many others. When you see these names for the first time they sound innocuous enough. When you look at what they do and not just what they say they reveal themselves for what their long term goals are. They want no human use of our home which is Northern Maine.
im glad you posted this!! maine is over 95% forests, and someone in an earlier thread said we are gaining 77000 new acres of forests each yr,,
if anyone drives north on i-95 north of bangor,,you will see nothing but trees for over 100 miles,,til you get to houlton.
central and northern maine needs all the jobs,,that can be created and maintained,,logging is big business, in central and northern maine, we need to preserve these jobs!!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-10-2007, 08:24 PM
 
914 posts, read 1,844,872 times
Reputation: 1091
This thread goes along with the news today with the Roxanne Quimby deal worked out by Mr. Baldacci. Do a Google search for RESTORE. It's a group looking to develop a National Park in and around Baxter Park. Roxanne Quimby has stated that is a noble goal and with some of her millions first purchased an entire township near the north end of Baxter. She cancelled all the leases that people had for camps in this township. No matter how much you had invested, sorry get it off her land. (an older thread discussed the perils of leased land now days) She also wouldn't allow snowmobiles on her land. (a major snowsled trail connecting to the north end of Baxter passed through this township). She later went on to buy several thousand acres near the South end of Baxter. I believe she traded the northern township for some of this land. I believe she now holds over 10,000 acres in the Baxter region. I didn't read the details of the agreement Baldacci signed today, but I think for a few million dollars we (the state) get snowmobile access to some access roads on some of her land. I think the state takes ownership of some of it, but stings attached removes it from ever being a productive forestry asset. The Katahdin Lake deal that the state made with Gardner Timberlands is also in this same vain. The state traded 21,000 acres of public lots throughout the state for 6000 acres surrounding Katahdin Lake. (acreage might be a little off, but it was that disproportionate) Plus around $14 million were thrown in to sweeten the deal (money raised from private donors though!) RESTORE might be a noble idea, but don't tell that to the people in the affected area that have no jobs because of shutting down a huge chunk of the forestry industry.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-11-2007, 06:52 AM
 
Location: God's Country, Maine
2,052 posts, read 3,974,482 times
Reputation: 1295
I didn't vote for the bond last month for land for Maine's future fund, because they helped the AMC buy a parcel and they cut off bear hunting in the area.

The AMC in recent years has purchased Nhamakanta, Medawisla (second Roach,) and Little Lyford Pond. These are all old sporting camps with substantial land holdings. I noticed in all of the areas, while out hunting this fall, a significant number of culverts pulled up within the areas.

I am suspicious of any acquired land deals involving the AMC, Quimby or others. Restore is on the open season list up here along with coyotes. They are using the idea of Canadian Lynx and Eastern Timberwolf habitat to further their agenda.

The stupid State, in their eternal wisdom, tried to reintroduce the Caribou up here. It was a dismal failure. I think they all jumped off the Knife Edge together!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-11-2007, 08:40 AM
 
Location: South Portland, Maine
2,356 posts, read 4,936,961 times
Reputation: 1511
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainebrokerman View Post
im glad you posted this!! maine is over 95% forests, and someone in an earlier thread said we are gaining 77000 new acres of forests each yr,,
if anyone drives north on i-95 north of bangor,,you will see nothing but trees for over 100 miles,,til you get to houlton.
central and northern maine needs all the jobs,,that can be created and maintained,,logging is big business, in central and northern maine, we need to preserve these jobs!!

I am not familiar with logging but was curious

how much logging is needed to maintain a status quo with respect to employment in Main?

How much land is needed to support that logging?

I would expect the land to be relogged over and over again.

Wouldn't a large Northern Maine federal park bring in a lot of federal tax dollars?

Would their be room for both?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-11-2007, 11:54 AM
 
Location: God's Country, Maine
2,052 posts, read 3,974,482 times
Reputation: 1295
Wink logging

Quote:
Originally Posted by flycessna View Post
I am not familiar with logging but was curious

how much logging is needed to maintain a status quo with respect to employment in Main?

How much land is needed to support that logging?

I would expect the land to be relogged over and over again.

Wouldn't a large Northern Maine federal park bring in a lot of federal tax dollars?

Would their be room for both?
Gone are the days of huge lumber camps and the farms that went with them to support the manpower needed to log a forest. All that is needed is a Feller-buncher, grapple skidder and Delimber, run by a three man crew. They can rake right through a spruce stand in no time.

There is practically no old growth in Maine, as the land has been harvested many times. The average plantation can be harvested in 32-45 years, depending on the species and purpose. Many stands are sprayed with herbicide to inhibit hardwoods, if it is to be used for pulp or dimensional timber.

The hardwood ridges are harvested for firewood and veneer. Most all the veneer goes to Canadian mills along with the good clean pine. These trees are quite old. For instance, a beechnut does not produce nuts for the first 50 years of its life.

As for a National Park, the Feds own enough real estate out west that they manage poorly. Here in the East, we don't worry about most of the crap that comes with land ownership out west like timber, mineral and water rights. You have every right to the aquafir under your land and the timber that grows on it. Go to Coos Canyon and pan for gold, if you want, no problem!

Federal tax dollars??? Is that an oxymoron? The only dollars the government own are ours!!! Part of the deal for tree growth rates and hard jobs with low pay, was free access to the forest lands for recreation.

Nobody wants a National Park, few want a State entity and many of the local companies have sold out to internationals. Many large parcels have been bought by private individuals and we call them Kingdom parcels. We have seen the end of the Great North Woods as we know it. The best way to avoid a debacle like a park is to involve community and the landowners.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-11-2007, 01:23 PM
 
Location: God's Country, Maine
2,052 posts, read 3,974,482 times
Reputation: 1295
William Beardsley: Plum Creek means business (http://bangornews.com/news/t/viewpoints.aspx?articleid=157586&zoneid=35 - broken link)

nice article
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-11-2007, 02:27 PM
 
Location: Northern Maine
9,494 posts, read 14,291,662 times
Reputation: 8929
No paper company in Maine owns timber land in Maine any more. Every single mill has sold its land. The last hold-out was Fraser and their land has now been sold. Why would a mill sell its natural resources? There are two reasons:

1. Maine is hostile to business. It doesn't have to be that way, but we have had the same bunch of crooks in Augusta for 32 years.

2. Augusta changes the rules every two years when we get a new batch of legislators. When a business is trying to manage a crop with a life cycle of 45 years or more and the legislature changes the rules every two years it is impossible to plan. To be responsible to its shareholders the company must sell its land.

"For instance, a beechnut does not produce nuts for the first 50 years of its life."

The beech and the red maple are non-indigious species brought in from overseas. The beech came from Holland and the Dutch Elm disease came from there too. If we can cut down the beech trees before they produce nuts and put them into firewood or pulpwood we will improve our forests and let our white birch, yellow birch, ash, cherry and rock maple thrive again.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-11-2007, 06:13 PM
 
378 posts, read 934,817 times
Reputation: 101
The whole pretense that they are making national parks is ludicrous. IF they are about 'preserving' land then they must next explain how it is that one may now purchase a home plunk smack in the middle of national forests??? How is THAT preserved??

They're just up to stealing the land from the people. Then someone like the above comes along and as Americans we believe in a man doing what he will with his land. or a woman in this case. BUT, it's all just a big carnival show to steal the land from the people and disenable the people from living off the land.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Options
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2016 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Maine
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top