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Old 04-20-2008, 06:52 PM
 
Location: Caribou
39 posts, read 90,443 times
Reputation: 30

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maine Writer View Post
It is. And at the same time, it's sad that agribusiness has changed BMP's to involve their money-making products over what's good for soil. What's good for soil is good for life. It does, after all, begin in the soil. We couldn't eat a healthy diet without it.

And speaking of soil, I'm going back to work. Thanks for a nice lunch break folks!


I do agree with your premise healthy soil etc is better for the world and less pesticides herbicides etc. But I do disagree with the no oats, molasses etc. I like organic but I am not an UberOrganic.
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Old 04-20-2008, 07:57 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
29,722 posts, read 47,483,706 times
Reputation: 17565
Quote:
Originally Posted by thDishRanAwaywiththespoon View Post
Animals that only eat hay often have hay bellies-feeding animals grain with molasses is a good idea. It gets them through the winter and the animal enjoys the grain.

'hay-belly' is generally a horse phrase, referring to poor quality straw being fed as if it were hay.

There are many differences between horses and goats.

The smarter of the two has horns.

Since we know that goats and deer can be perfectly healthy and can live long lives from eating nothing but trees and bushes. I find it difficult to imagine that if a goat was presented with 'too much' straw that goat would simply go back to eating trees.
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Old 04-20-2008, 09:00 PM
 
Location: Corinth, ME
2,712 posts, read 4,914,794 times
Reputation: 1863
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post

Since we know that goats and deer can be perfectly healthy and can live long lives from eating nothing but trees and bushes. I find it difficult to imagine that if a goat was presented with 'too much' straw that goat would simply go back to eating trees.
That would presume they could GET to the trees... Out west, when I last raised goats, they were most commonly kept in pens, and not allowed free range. Of course, we also had real alfalfa hay as their main diet, but we also fed some grain to the youngsters after they were weaned, and to the does in milk. In that time and place I never heard of urinary problems in the bucks.

Our trees were all pine and fir, too... nothing without needles to speak of... and I fear given free range we would have been drinking off-flavored milk.
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Old 04-20-2008, 09:27 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
29,722 posts, read 47,483,706 times
Reputation: 17565
Quote:
Originally Posted by starwalker View Post
That would presume they could GET to the trees... Out west, when I last raised goats, they were most commonly kept in pens, and not allowed free range. Of course, we also had real alfalfa hay as their main diet, but we also fed some grain to the youngsters after they were weaned, and to the does in milk. In that time and place I never heard of urinary problems in the bucks.

Our trees were all pine and fir, too... nothing without needles to speak of... and I fear given free range we would have been drinking off-flavored milk.
LOL

<WARNING! WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---

You must never allow a goat to eat what it's body is designed to eat.
The best diet for a goat is in fact highly processed and packaged in a bag.

<WARNING WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---



I have not seen real hay since we moved to Maine.

hmm, 'off-flavoured goat-milk' is that an oxymoron?

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Old 04-21-2008, 04:36 AM
 
Location: Corinth, ME
2,712 posts, read 4,914,794 times
Reputation: 1863
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
LOL

<WARNING! WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---

You must never allow a goat to eat what it's body is designed to eat.
The best diet for a goat is in fact highly processed and packaged in a bag.

<WARNING WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---




I have not seen real hay since we moved to Maine.

hmm, 'off-flavoured goat-milk' is that an oxymoron?

of, course, what is true for humans MUST be true for goats as well, no? If goats were more popular, I am sure someone would be making "happy meals" for them as well!

However, regarding "off-flavor" milk... I have to say that whatever KAF is doing for her herd, their milk is wonderful! (Haven't had any of yours yet...) If goats are at all like cows (or humans, with which I have personal experience) things eaten DO "come through the milk" and affect it. I remember stories from my grandparents of their cow getting into the wild onions and having to throw out the highly flavored milk. Now, if they had gotten into the strawberries... LOL And as a La Leche League leader, I helped many a mom dealing with babies who wouldn't nurse -- or perhaps shouldn't have -- after mom had eaten highly spiced food, cabbage or beans or other gas-inducing stuff or drunk lots of caffeine.

I wonder if the natural diet of goats who live in a area with strongly flavored browse contributes to the perception that their milk is "ick" or if that is strictly prejudice coming from unfamiliarity, in this culture?
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Old 04-21-2008, 05:28 AM
 
Location: Caribou
39 posts, read 90,443 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
LOL

<WARNING! WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---

You must never allow a goat to eat what it's body is designed to eat.
The best diet for a goat is in fact highly processed and packaged in a bag.

<WARNING WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---



I have not seen real hay since we moved to Maine.

hmm, 'off-flavoured goat-milk' is that an oxymoron?

If a goat was a wild animal and had not been domesticated, I would say you have a point but these animals have been domesticated-that is like saying people should go back to eating what they ate during cavemen days.
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Old 04-21-2008, 05:29 AM
 
Location: Caribou
39 posts, read 90,443 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
LOL

<WARNING! WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---

You must never allow a goat to eat what it's body is designed to eat.
The best diet for a goat is in fact highly processed and packaged in a bag.

<WARNING WARNING>
--- sarcasm alert ---



I have not seen real hay since we moved to Maine.

hmm, 'off-flavoured goat-milk' is that an oxymoron?


WHAT? This place Maine used to be reknowned for the hay it grew and there is Lucerne farms. Off flavored goat milk yes goat milk has that "baaaaa" after taste but you don't want anymore than the "baaaa".
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Old 04-21-2008, 05:34 AM
 
Location: Caribou
39 posts, read 90,443 times
Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
'hay-belly' is generally a horse phrase, referring to poor quality straw being fed as if it were hay.

There are many differences between horses and goats.

The smarter of the two has horns.

Since we know that goats and deer can be perfectly healthy and can live long lives from eating nothing but trees and bushes. I find it difficult to imagine that if a goat was presented with 'too much' straw that goat would simply go back to eating trees.

Hay belly refers to the beach ball belly a horse gets from being fed a steady diet of hay poor or good-I use the term on goats too. It's improper but I think feeding animals only hay is like feeding humans only salad. Where's the nutrition??

You don't like horses FB??? The SHAME!
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Old 04-21-2008, 05:50 AM
 
3,061 posts, read 7,296,573 times
Reputation: 1889
I've had horses for many years, and many of my friends had and have them. What we call "hay belly" is NOT from eating poor quality hay, but rather from eating too much GOOD QUALITY hay. Being well fed in other words. Poor quality would starve a horse.
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Old 04-21-2008, 06:09 AM
 
Location: Maine
5,969 posts, read 11,132,103 times
Reputation: 5240
Quote:
Originally Posted by thDishRanAwaywiththespoon View Post
Hay belly refers to the beach ball belly a horse gets from being fed a steady diet of hay poor or good-I use the term on goats too. It's improper but I think feeding animals only hay is like feeding humans only salad. Where's the nutrition??
As I said earlier, it comes from good soil. Well balanced soil provides the minerals and nutrients needed for nutritious hay. Hay shouldn't be just a filler. Maine Grass Farmers Network and EatWild (Jo Robinson) have information available to anyone who wants to learn about grass feeding animals. Both are online.
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