Why do you all think your taxes are so high? (Portland: property taxes, health insurance)

[RMoore007]

Originally Posted by forest beekeeper

I was raised in California, I attended college in Fresno. My mother lives in Merced, I have brothers in Turlock, Modesto, Sausalito and Sacramento. I once owned apartments in California.

Today I would have extreme difficulty supporting my family with my pension, if I lived in California.

However we have been able to move to Maine, buy a large property and build a house, while we still have one child in school.

If this is 'high taxes' [which are in fact significantly lower than our taxes were in California], then WooHoo! 'high taxes' that cost less.

Small world. I have a business and deliver to every one of those places.
My office managers mother lives in Merced. I have a business associate that lives in Turlock. Suasalito is just too cool. And Fresno is just, well you know, Fresno.

The overall taxes in Maine may be higher. But the home and land prices are not. That is really the biggest most expensive thing in our lives. As your example shows, it is possible to seek out and produce a better quality of life, with less income. My brother did it. My sister did it. My nephew did it. All in the last 4 years. All from California. They won't be back. Not that I'm trying to convince anybody to move there. It's different for my family. Too many darn roots. Can't break them, even if I wanted to.

I do have to add that I also have relatives that have moved to different states too. They were not all enamored with the Maine experience. I have family in Texas, Missouri, North Carolina, Florida and California. Every one of those places is very different from Maine. Taxes are real cheap. Everyone should move there.

[mainebrokerman]

reading thru this thread, i guess id be one,,that may get a bit overly defensive,,on maine negativity.

thier are opinions, and thier are facts,, ..when someone uses a broad brush to paint ALL of maine, on different issues, i believe that should be challenged,,,

someone could start a thread, "maine has the highest taxes in the nation"
now, for the thousands that may be looking at maine, perusing the threads,,they could conclude thats a fact and ,,,why should i even look at maine?? (the broad brush negative light)

most that live here, agree the taxes are high,,,but thiers more to it than that,,,,as bydand stated,,as a percentage of income,,because our average income is less than other areas...and ,,its also a trade off,,for many of us,,,to live in maine,,lower crime rates, beautiful scenery, slower pace, fresh air, etc


ive often shared personal info stating my property taxes,,,they are VERY LOW,,and many towns ,, do vary significantly,,in property taxes...
so when someone states,,maine property taxes are very high with a broad brush,,,,ITS SIMPLY NOT TRUE!!

[maine4.us]

I will throw in my opinion not as a Mainer, but as a small town person. I think what causes the taxes to be high in Maine is that there just aren't quite enough people to spread the cost of infrastructure out. I mean in a small Maine town of 1700, they would most likely have a school, possibly two. They would have a police department and a volunteer fire department. They would of course likely have city water and septic. They would have to plow streets in winter, and keep at least 5 full time employees on hand. When you add all that up, and divide by 1700 you have approximately 700+ households to pay for all this. Every operation has an optimum size, and most of the small Maine towns, just aren't big enough to lower the cost of all the services they provide. The taxes on my home are $1128 a year. That isn't much for all the services that are provided by the town.

As I have read, the taxes paid depends on what property is worth in the area and what services the town wants to provide. The level of service dictates the millage rate.

To the people in the rural areas, you may be carrying an unfair burden.

[flycessna]

Originally Posted by maine4.us

I will throw in my opinion not as a Mainer, but as a small town person. I think what causes the taxes to be high in Maine is that there just aren't quite enough people to spread the cost of infrastructure out. I mean in a small Maine town of 1700, they would most likely have a school, possibly two. They would have a police department and a volunteer fire department. They would of course likely have city water and septic. They would have to plow streets in winter, and keep at least 5 full time employees on hand. When you add all that up, and divide by 1700 you have approximately 700+ households to pay for all this. Every operation has an optimum size, and most of the small Maine towns, just aren't big enough to lower the cost of all the services they provide. The taxes on my home are $1128 a year. That isn't much for all the services that are provided by the town.

As I have read, the taxes paid depends on what property is worth in the area and what services the town wants to provide. The level of service dictates the millage rate.

To the people in the rural areas, you may be carrying an unfair burden.

Actually i have found the oppiset to be true. It is those towns of 1700 that choose not to have a police dept, not to have a public works, have a volanteer fire dept and no town water. The schools are district based for the most part. So its these small small towns that have lower mil rates.

[maine4.us]

I was thinking about the towns that did provide those services. That is also the big reason for the push for consolidation of the schools, which is rural cleansing in fact as it has been called by other forum members. It would depend on the town and the services they wanted. From what I have seen, most of the small towns in Maine run lean operations. You can play with the valuations and millages all you want, but a city will have to pay it's bills and everyone will pay a share. More people, less of a share. It's a division thing.

If you have a town with no PD, no library, no town FD, no water and sewer, and almost no children, of course your taxes would be cheaper.

[flycessna]

Originally Posted by maine4.us

I was thinking about the towns that did provide those services. That is also the big reason for the push for consolidation of the schools, which is rural cleansing in fact as it has been called by other forum members. It would depend on the town and the services they wanted. From what I have seen, most of the small towns in Maine run lean operations. You can play with the valuations and millages all you want, but a city will have to pay it's bills and everyone will pay a share. More people, less of a share. It's a division thing.

If you have a town with no PD, no library, no town FD, no water and sewer, and almost no children, of course your taxes would be cheaper.

Well the schools here are district base so I am not sure how that works...I do not know if the towns have to pay equall share of school costs or if it depends on how many children are going there from a particular town.

Rural cleansing.......a little harsh........I have not seen any sympathy from other postors for those that are getting fleeced by the state on taxes while they themselves are avoiding high taxes by living in extreme rural areas.

Should I care if a school closes down and now they have to find away to get their kids bussed 2 hours to another school...I don't know....they choose to live there. maybe I'll call them whiners.

I think Also that those towns that do not have those things........do not want them. I've see some research done for towns that were contemplating creating their own police force. Currently they had recieved law enforcement services from the county police. One fact of creating your own Police dept was that your calls for service will double...maybe more.

I always found that interesting...and a little sad. That means all those people that were used to dealing with things on their own were now going to take advantage of calling the cops. IE. Your neghbors son keeps peeling out in the neighborhood......before you would politely speak with him about your concern thereby creating a stronger neighborly bond, now just call the cops.

These things are true too. As a police officer in one Maine's larger cities you would be suprised what we get calls for.... and do. I've driven out of control children to school who refused to get on the bus......and I've gone to the school to drive them home because mom and dad don't have a car. I've gone to homes to remove bats, a racoon, and one time a neighbors cat. I have driven people home who were stuck at the food mart and didn't have a car but now its raining, I have driven people to the hospital because they didn't have a car couldn't afford a taxi and their situation was not an emergency so they couldn't call an ambulance. I had to speak to someone because their grass was getting to high and made the neighborhood look bad. OK OK I am getting carried away but you get the point. City services are convient.....but people have learned that once you start down that road there is no turning back. And ultimately People need to learn to live with less.

[bignhfamily]

Here's my perspective on Maine taxes from across the maple curtain. Here we have no sales tax or income tax. We do pay taxes on interest and dividends. We do pay property taxes (and a lot of them).

My home town (pop. 2750) is in the upper valley area of NH. We have town water/sewer, small PD, volunteer fire dept., elementary school and district middle/high schools (part of 7 towns) Here an average home on a town lot cost at least $250k. The taxes on an average home would be $5785 (mil rate @ .02314) As soon as you add a few acres this price climbs sharply. I am self employed. I pay State business taxes. There seems to be plenty of work for those who want to work.
Now if you take our nest egg and apply it all as a down payment on a mortgage for a home here in NH, with a few acres, then we are still looking at a big mortgage payment ($1200-$1500 a month) and another $500 a month give or take in property taxes. We still haven't factored in any insurances either.

In some of the towns we have looked at in Maine, we could use our nest egg to outright buy a home with 50 acres still have money to fix it up and not owe a bank a penny (a savings of $1200-$1500 a month). Also the property taxes on the properties I've looked at are MUCH,MUCH cheaper. The highest has been around $1200. (These are towns west as far as Palmya and north as far as Sebec from Bangor) I realize there is a 5% sales tax, but as my spending is in my control, I thus in turn control what I dish out for those taxes. Maine also has an income tax, as we are aware. If we took a 50% pay cut by moving to Maine and were at the 8.5% State Income Tax bracket we are still looking at less than $4000 per year in income taxes.
So if I add my Maine property taxes and my Maine income taxes it equals $5200 versus the $5785 in property taxes alone here in NH. Also, remember, I've eliminated any mortgage payment as well.
As far as other monthly expenses (electricity, cable, phone, internet) and things like car registration, auto insurance, etc it seems to be comparable with what we pay now.
Finally, I hope to be bartering and trading my produce, livestock and services with you other fine residents of Maine (can't tax that can they).
OK so am I missing something here??? Does this make sense or am I way off???

We are happy to live with less! Less is More!

[Melonghunter]

Unless you are in or near one of the larger areas,Bangor,Agusta,Portland,or over on the coast or down in Kittery...the pay scale is the major disparrity here.
We have watched housing go up in our area from a low of 18,000 to 70,000 plus in the last 4-5 years alone.taxes have risen likewise.It used to be much cheaper to live here.
The influx of folks from elsewhere that think its so cheap tend to pay too much and make prices rise,allbeit artificially.
Try raising a family,paying 1200. per year taxes 9real estate 0plus sales ,state,federal tax....3.oo per gal. for gas and home heating oil....all this on 20,000 or so per year.
weare not all docs.,lawyers and the like.It is hard for us to keep good medical help in the rural hospitals,they can make so much more elsewhere...It ain't all roses folks.

[Northern Maine Land Man]

bignhfamily wonders:
"OK so am I missing something here??? Does this make sense or am I way off???"

You are right on target. Our tax burden is high because Maine government spends too much. They had an announcement that all non-essential personnel could stay home today due to the weather. What if we just did that every day? That would be a start. The number od non-essential personnel in Maine government is huge for a state with the same population as NH.

You can move to Maine, live simply and pay low taxes. People do it all the time. If you buy the most expensive house in the neighborhood you'll pay the most taxes. Nope; "It ainn't all roses", but I would not live anywhere else. We go this way once. I could live anywhere I want and this is where I choose to live. It takes a certain dedication to stay. We left once and worked out of state to save up enough to come back. I hope to stay forever this time.

[AustinB]

Originally Posted by flycessna

OK, I guess I really didn't mean Northern as much as rural. unorganized comes to mind. I think there was a time only Cities were pushing the envalope of high mil rates. Then it pushed into the smaller towns. Now "most" towns surrounding the cities now have budget crises's and the Mil rates are climbing. The last safe havens are unorganized areas and some out of way towns.

It almost seems Maine is for the unemployed, poor retirees, poor people in genreal, and minimalists.

Just last week on one of these threads a nice lady wanted to know if it was true that anyone that makes less than 70k was able to get free healthcare here. I almost fell out of my seat. I feel that there are alot that would wish it were so.(most in our legislature) The perception is out there that we are very generous, and it may well be a self-fullfilling one at that. The more that come looking for the handouts will create the need for the handouts.

I know that I'm soundeing like a crank, but there is such a thing as being too generous.