Maine's 'Treegrowth' land status (Augusta, Penobscot: for sale, assessor, house)

[forest beekeeper]

This topic has came again again in another thread. So to avoid being 'off-topic there, I am starting this anew.

The state sent me a brochure telling me that I would need to contract a forester for a 'Forestry Management Plan', within one year of the date of my purchase. The brochure from the state said that my 'Forestry Management Plan' would be my private property. A form came with it that the Forester signed saying that he had in fact formed a 'Forestry Management Plan' and given it to me.

The seller recommended a Forester that I could use. I contacted him and he was already familiar with this parcel. Our forester reviewed a map of our woodlot, gave us a 'Treegrowth Plan', offered his advise and charged $300 for our property, $400 for the property that we manage. And of course his fee is a tax write-off.

The forester when you hire him, looks over your land and makes a forestry map of it, then 'forms' a management plan. He is available to answer any questions that you ever have about managing your land. His management plan has to be in writing, and when you pay him for this service that plan becomes your private property. The forester has to sign a form to certify that he did factually provide the land owner with a management plan.
[mine reads like it was written long ago, with every possible tree growing idea included in it. It is like a 'boilerplate' one size fits all kind of document. I can not imagine that he wrote it for me alone. It was printed with a book binding.] His signature on that form proves that the plan exists. [Now how does the state prove or dis-prove that I am or am not following that plan? I have no idea.] It is my understanding that I am the only person who holds my unique 'Forestry Management Plan'. The state only has a signed form stating that the 'Forestry Management Plan' exists. It is good for 10 years.

According to my 'plan' I could clear cut and re-plant. Or clear an area and set-up a tree nursery. My plan allows for me to grow Christmas trees, or firewood, or pulp wood, or fruit trees, or it can sit bare while nature decides to re-plant. I can determine at any time which acreage is doing which, within my plan. The options within my plan are many. My plan allows me to cut a driveway every forty feet if I wanted to, for proper access to the trees.

For purposes of building a house I applied to have one acre removed from 'Treegrowth' status. I was prepared to give the tax assessor a map showing exactly where this one acre lays. She does not want it. My one acre could be scattered anywhere on my property. It could be in one corner, it could be a thin strip, or a broken into a series of small clearings.



Each county has a different set 100% valuation for 'Treegrowth'. Penobscot county is:
softwood land is assessed at $100 per acre
mixed wood is $86 per acre
hardwood is $91 per acre.

If you have 50 acres of softwood [$100 X 50 = $5,000],
and 50 acres of mixedwoods [$86 X 50 = $4,300]
and 100 acres of hardwood [$91 X 100 = $9,100]
Then your 200 acres of woodlot would be valued at $18,400 @ 0.00842 mil rate your annual taxes would be $155



Treegrowth may include a lot of clearings. Random shapes and random sizes. Since the Maine theory of woodlot management is to never plant trees, but to wait for nature to re-plant, it may take centuries for the right species of tree to be planted by nature. In the mean time, we can chop down, or agent orange any other species waiting for nature to get it right [to conform to our desires].

Many of our clearings have berries growing. Otherwise you can do anything you want to do in a clearing. [just don't build structures, and don't plant in rows.]

We are working on clearing the low growth on our forest floor. There are livestock that love to eat that brush, and some trees are okay with that. It gives greater visibility looking through the trees further. And there are some crops even that will grow well in that setting. Working hand-in-hand with a Forestry Management Plan.

Some of our clearings have berries growing, which we have gleaned. Our clearings tend to be shoulder high growth come fall. And are not well manicured lawns. I can broadcast seed, in fact 'over-seeding' and it does not preclude nature from taking over that clearing and planting trees whenever she wants to. So I am still well within a Forestry Management Plan.

Woodlots are good to have, going through them and cleaning out the dead wood can keep you in firewood nicely.

Ginseng grows well on a forest floor, as does mushroom innoculated logs.

Goats, sheep and chickens all do well in a forest.

I do not think that spending $300 once every 10-years or 40+ acres [or $400 for 100+ acres] is a large expense to keep so much land in this status.

Your results may vary.

[starwalker]

Originally Posted by forest beekeeper

I do not think that spending $300 once every 10-years or 40+ acres [or $400 for 100+ acres] is a large expense to keep so much land in this status.

Your results may vary.

Thank you for your post in the other thread, following my comment about having learned about open space in a meeting with an other fellow forum member.

"Everything you may want to consider about land taxes for larger parcels" will be my bookmark for it, with all the useful links.

There are more ways to shake a stick and knowledge is powerful stuff. I truly appreciate those of you who have been around these topics longer than I, and spent more time digging out info that you are willing to share.

I just had not heard that "open space" was an option before last week... and now I know tons more, even, than that.

[Nor'Eastah]

Excellent "how-to" post for the prospective (or current) landowner wishing to take advantage of that program, but having questions about it. Question: How would you go about it if you purchased acreage that already had a sizeable clearing, from a seller who had planned on building a vacation camp or home, as so many parcels are listed today? Such parcels are of interest to us as they are already cleared in spots and ready to build with sometimes a well and/or septic already installed. Do you need to wait till some of the trees grow back? Can you exempt that 2-3 cleared acres, as you have done with one acre, and use the rest of the wooded area for that program?

If the taxes for the parcel are listed as presently say, $68 up to (max I have seen for just land) $150, is there any advantage to going with Treegrowth? Any disadvantages?

[forest beekeeper]

Originally Posted by Nor'Eastah

... Question: How would you go about it if you purchased acreage that already had a sizeable clearing, from a seller who had planned on building a vacation camp or home, as so many parcels are listed today?

Apply.

If you are in a UT, then apply through Augusta. I think Lisa Whynot's office, if not then one of her office mates.

If you are in one of the higher taxed areas of Maine, then you go through your town tax [thief] assessor.

... Such parcels are of interest to us as they are already cleared in spots and ready to build with sometimes a well and/or septic already installed. Do you need to wait till some of the trees grow back?

Goodness no. Not all 'treegrowth' land has trees growing on it. I have many areas of my 'forest' that are fairly clear of trees.

... Can you exempt that 2-3 cleared acres, as you have done with one acre, and use the rest of the wooded area for that program?

Yes.

... If the taxes for the parcel are listed as presently say, $68 up to (max I have seen for just land) $150, is there any advantage to going with Treegrowth? Any disadvantages?

'Treegrowth' sets the assessed value of the land.

A township can not raise that assessed value. If you were to buy land for $900 per acre, and the assessor wanted to assess it as $900/acre, then normally that would be your assessment. Multiply your assessed value by the mil rate and that is your taxes.

If you ever take land out of treegrowth, you pay a penalty.

So long as it is in 'treegrowth' your plan for it must be some form of tree-something. While other states would require treegrowth land to be planted and actively growing trees, Maine does not. The commonly accepted thought in Maine is to allow nature to plant trees at it's own pace.

It is common to allow nature to plant and grow any kind of trees that nature wants to grow. Then if it does not conform with your 'plan' spray herbicide to kill those trees, and wait for nature to re-plant, in the hope that maybe the next generation of re-planted trees will be more to your plan.

You could plant trees if you wanted to. You can plant Christmas trees. You can plant poplars for firewood. You can plant fruit trees.

[Maineah]

I want to grow black walnut trees. The nuts are good and the trees produce tons of them . Then after 20 or so years my kids can cut the wood and sell it for $25.00 a board foot (by then).

[Northern Maine Land Man]

"Can you exempt that 2-3 cleared acres, as you have done with one acre, and use the rest of the wooded area for that program?"

You can put anything over 10 acres into the tree growth program. The higher the alternate value of your land the more you will save. Many incorporated towns value "back land" at $250 an acre. The difference in tax between tree growth and not is about $2.50 an acre per year. I am happy to pay the extra $250 on my 100 acres and not risk having Augusta tell me I can never build on my land because I have a contract with the state to grow trees for sale. Don't laugh. This proposed on a regular basis, All it will take is the right gang to be elected and we kiss it goodbye.

You do have options within the tree growth program, but the bottom line is that you must be growing trees for harvest. By entering the program you are building a huge bill to be paid by somebody when a better opportunity arises for that land. I have some land that gets cut on a regular basis. Maine grows 1/3 cord per year forever on average ground. I can take 33 cords a year off my 100 acres forever and not diminish the resource.

I also have a piece that has not been cut for over 100 years. It has just about every kind of tree that grows in Maine. I have not found a butternut yet. I don't intend to cut that ground so I can't put it in tree growth. If you put land into the tree growth program you are borrowing from your kids. They will end up paying the penalty. Augusta has a long memory and they want their pound of flesh.

-break-

It will take 80 years at least to grow a black walnut saw log. Plant them anyway. My family has managed forests for over 600 years and it is generations between planting and harvest for some of those trees.

[Maineah]

Originally Posted by Northern Maine Land Man

"Can you exempt that 2-3 cleared acres, as you have done with one acre, and use the rest of the wooded area for that program?"

You can put anything over 10 acres into the tree growth program. The higher the alternate value of your land the more you will save. Many incorporated towns value "back land" at $250 an acre. The difference in tax between tree growth and not is about $2.50 an acre per year. I am happy to pay the extra $250 on my 100 acres and not risk having Augusta tell me I can never build on my land because I have a contract with the state to grow trees for sale. Don't laugh. This proposed on a regular basis, All it will take is the right gang to be elected and we kiss it goodbye.

You do have options within the tree growth program, but the bottom line is that you must be growing trees for harvest. By entering the program you are building a huge bill to be paid by somebody when a better opportunity arises for that land. I have some land that gets cut on a regular basis. Maine grows 1/3 cord per year forever on average ground. I can take 33 cords a year off my 100 acres forever and not diminish the resource.

I also have a piece that has not been cut for over 100 years. It has just about every kind of tree that grows in Maine. I have not found a butternut yet. I don't intend to cut that ground so I can't put it in tree growth. If you put land into the tree growth program you are borrowing from your kids. They will end up paying the penalty. Augusta has a long memory and they want their pound of flesh.

-break-

It will take 80 years at least to grow a black walnut saw log. Plant them anyway. My family has managed forests for over 600 years and it is generations between planting and harvest for some of those trees.

Hey NMLM...The Government checks start going out tomorrow! Still planning to buy that wood splitter?

[Northern Maine Land Man]

It may have to wait. Wifey decided she needed a trailer to haul the ATVs so she bought one. It takes 2 ATVs, one behind the other.

[Maineah]

Originally Posted by Northern Maine Land Man

It may have to wait. Wifey decided she needed a trailer to haul the ATVs so she bought one. It takes 2 ATVs, one behind the other.

Sorry to hear that! Trailers are important too. As long as you find something to stimulate the economy you're doing your part!

[boonelsewhere]

i agree with you if the town value land at $250 per acre and only save $ 2.50 per acre per year then no reason to put land on tree growth.
but if the normal value land at $2500 per acre, tax saving is $48 / acre, 100 acres that is $4800 per year saving, that number will make you think about.

The penalty is some thing i most concern about, i read the rule for some time now still could not figure out.
this is what i think the rule said.
let say the normal value is $2500/ acre, treegrowth is $ 100/acre, mil rate is .00200 that is 2% and assume the normal land value and the tree growth value stay the same for the last 6 years.

i want to take 5 acres out from tree growth after under plan for 6 years, that is 30% penalty, the diff between three growth and normal value is $2400.

yr 1 2400 x .02 x 1.30 = 62.4 (plus 10% int for 6 yrs) 99.84
yr 2 2400 x .02 x 1.30 = 62.4 (plus int for 5 yrs) 93.60
yr 3 2400 x .02 x 1.30 = 62.4 (plus int for 4 yrs) 87.36
yr 4 2400 x .02 x 1.30 = 62.4 (plus int for 3 yrs) 81.12
yr 5 2400 x .02 x 1.30 = 62.4 (plus int for 2 yrs) 74.88
yr 6 2400 x .02 x 1.30 = 62.4 (plus int for 1 yrs) 68.64
penalty per acre 505.44

tax save 1 acre for 6 years ($48 x 6) $ 288.00
penalty 1 acre $ 505.44

with out knowing how to calculate penalty, it would be difficult to make decision.

Originally Posted by Northern Maine Land Man

"

You can put anything over 10 acres into the tree growth program. The higher the alternate value of your land the more you will save. Many incorporated towns value "back land" at $250 an acre. The difference in tax between tree growth and not is about $2.50 an acre per year. I am happy to pay the extra $250 on my 100 acres and not risk having Augusta tell me I can never build on my land because I have a contract with the state to grow trees for sale. Don't laugh. This proposed on a regular basis, All it will take is the right gang to be elected and we kiss it goodbye.

You do have options within the tree growth program, but the bottom line is that you must be growing trees for harvest. By entering the program you are building a huge bill to be paid by somebody when a better opportunity arises for that land. I have some land that gets cut on a regular basis. Maine grows 1/3 cord per year forever on average ground. I can take 33 cords a year off my 100 acres forever and not diminish the resource.

I also have a piece that has not been cut for over 100 years. It has just about every kind of tree that grows in Maine. I have not found a butternut yet. I don't intend to cut that ground so I can't put it in tree growth. If you put land into the tree growth program you are borrowing from your kids. They will end up paying the penalty. Augusta has a long memory and they want their pound of flesh.

-break-

It will take 80 years at least to grow a black walnut saw log. Plant them anyway. My family has managed forests for over 600 years and it is generations between planting and harvest for some of those trees.