Comparing Camden ME/ Newburyport MA (Kittery, Rockland: real estate, condo, houses)

[Outwalkingthedog]

Background info: Spouse and I are planning retirement/ next chapter. A multitude of factors weigh heavily, but we have settled on Mid-Coast Maine, most specifically the Camden area. For the naysayers, yes we have visited many times over many years in all seasons, yes we have lived as residents through Colorado mountain winters, yes my spouse’s family is originally from MA and ME and we still have family in those places so we know what we are getting into. We have visited fairly recently, have a good feel of what areas and type of house we are looking for, just waiting for the right one to come along. This market’s a hard one to crack into for sure. This was the plan pre-pandemic, and the pandemic has certainly made things harder to see and harder to buy. So far we haven’t been on the winning side of competing offers!

For a plot twist, after deciding on Camden and in a lull with this winter market, we found Newburyport. There are certainly some things we like better than Camden, and some concerns that we have about Newburyport. We are just trying to finalize our place selection. Unique pros to Newburyport: more inventory, more inventory in our price range which is admittedly higher than entry-level, more dining options, nice sandy beach close by, perhaps a milder temperature average by about 5-7 degrees at any given time, looks to be more goings on with more residents, and great accessibility to Boston for cultural offerings, high level medical care if needed, sports, day trips, and airport access. Unique cons to Newburyport: lots look much smaller in many cases, has a more dense, grittier urban feel, traffic looks much heavier on all streets, and it looks like it doesn’t have the feeling of space and openness that one gets in Camden. We have admittedly not visited Newburyport yet, and it might be awhile before we feel it’s safe and appropriate to do so.

There are a number of people who have posted that have great familiarity with the two places here. Any chance we can solicit some specific comments or opinions on these pros and cons to the two places? Any comments on the general vibe of one compared to the other, the level of density, noise pollution, air pollution, people pollution in the two? Does one feel to be friendlier for middle-aged folks who are empty nesters but still interested in being active members of the community? We have loved the dining options and quality in Camden- is Newburyport more options that aren’t necessarily as good, or is it as high quality and also has more options? Please note, we are not considering other locations in Maine or Mass. We’ve been a lot through both states and have narrowed it down to these two for a variety of reasons.

Thanks very much for your time and thoughts!

[OutdoorLover]

Hi, I live in Newburyport and visit the Camden area regularly, bought a village lot there to build a second home (still working on that ;-)). There are a lot of similarities between the two towns, so I don't think it's a coincidence you like them both as well.

Both towns:
- Are attractive colonial era towns in northern New England, first settled in the 1600s, centered on their harbors
- Have a nice walkable downtown, with lots of well-maintained 19th century buildings, and numerous interesting dining options
- Somewhat upscale, generally older buildings, and most homes and businesses are well maintained
- Have a good library in town, and a bit of culture/arts going on
- Have practical shopping - not just tourist joints
- Have a community hospital within 15 minutes drive
- Have outstanding parks close-by for enjoying nature and outdoor recreation.
- Get a fair number of visitors and are bustling near the harbor in summer months
- Have plenty of year-round residents too, not just visitors and seasonal residents.
- Have farmer's markets and some area festivals in summer.
- Have other points of interest in the area within an hour's drive for convenient daytrips
- They're a bit less than 3 hours apart driving, and weather is very similar too, Camden just a wee bit colder, I'd guess 2-3 degrees on average
- Have similar real estate tax rates

Some contrasts:
- Newburyport has more area medical care options
- Newburyport has more area transportation options
- Newburyport has more area employment options
- Newburyport has more area higher education options
- Maudslay State Park and Parker River National Wildlife Refuge, which flank the town, while not wilderness parks, are pretty exceptional - a lot of people come down from NH and ME to visit these two parks, despite those being more rural states
- Newburyport real estate is significantly more expensive, I'd guess at least 60% more. Cost differences more pronounced at the lower end for a stand-alone house, where Newburyport may be 100% more. Normally there is more real estate demand there, and places sell far quicker. Nbpt has perhaps 25% duplex houses and condo-fied multi-families, whereas Camden is almost all single family homes. Nbpt has natural gas infrastructure in town for heat and hot water.

- Camden has rocky coast, while Nbpt has sandy coast
- Camden has more and nicer lakes and ponds nearby
- Camden has a nearby hill for skiing, snowboarding and tubing in winter
- Camden topography is generally more rugged and hilly
- Camden isn't dead in winter by any means, but it's the quieter of the two in winter and I'd say has a somewhat lower % year-round residents
- Camden area waters less crowded with recreational boats
- Night skies a little darker around Camden
- Air and water quality are actually quite good in Newburyport, but I'd say both a little better in Camden

I think they're both outstanding locations, and you really can't go wrong with either one, and as noted above, there are a *lot* of similarities. In my view, they are two of the nicest towns on the Atlantic coast. While not isolated, Camden is the more isolated of the two, and the general region is a little quieter. Newburyport, while having good proximity to Boston, offers a laid-back community lifestyle and surprisingly nice nature and outdoor recreation options - its main downside is really price. Camden has many standalone homes in the $300Ks, while in Newburyport they're starting more in the $600Ks.

[Outwalkingthedog]

Thanks for the great response, OutdoorLover. I’ve really enjoyed your insights in past posts and was hoping you’d chime in. You really outlined some great pros and cons, with some tidbits we didn't know. For example, the bit about Nbpt’s gas infrastructure. I also wonder if Nbpt has better high speed internet, although I don’t recall that necessarily being an issue in Camden proper. Your points about the % of year-round residents, night skies and recreational boat density are insights only a resident would know for sure. I do find it interesting, and worth comment, that you live in Nbpt but seem to prefer Camden as you have dreams of spending more time there. Congrats on the buildable lot, they are hard to come by in walking distance to town in Camden, that’s for sure.

[OutdoorLover]

Sure thing, Outwalkingthedog - they're both beautiful towns with a lot of things to do in the area, well-rounded. I can't really say that one is nicer than the other. It may seem strange, given the pricing differential, but that's mostly reflecting the greater access to high paying jobs from Newburyport vs Camden. For quality of life, Camden is just as nice.

I noted your comments on lot size in Newburyport - I am surprised you noticed that from Google street views or what have you, but that is true, Newburyport, especially in the old town (which is the nicest part IMO) has small lots. It doesn't bother me though, it's kind of idiosyncratic about this area, and I like local flavor. It's not what I'd call a gritty urban area though - far from it, if you explore it in person, I think you'll find it very nice.

Traffic-wise, there's really nothing to worry about in either town - certainly there are other cars, but no "traffic jams". In summer, especially on a weekend, it can be a bit of a hassle to find parking near the harbor in either town - too many visitors. If you know the towns, you just use some rope-a-dope strategies to avoid the busiest spots at the busiest times - I do that in both of them :-).

I haven't tried to use any high bandwidth internet services like streaming movies or doing video conferencing when I have visited Camden/Rockport, it may be just fine tho. Down here in Newburyport, we do have Comcast and Verizon for telecom. Right in town in Camden, Rockport and Rockland, the cell phone signal is fine, but there are certainly areas in the midcoast where you can't hold a cell call and Siri won't work, because your requests are processed "in the cloud", and your cell phone can't access those servers. If you're not living in an outlying area, it's fine up there though too!

[squarpeg]

Curious on either of your thinking on Portsmouth NH vs. Newburyport MA

[OutdoorLover]

Originally Posted by squarpeg

Curious on either of your thinking on Portsmouth NH vs. Newburyport MA

Portsmouth is another great northern New England harbor town, centered around its harbor, a little bit upscale, walkable downtown with shops and restaurant options, some arts and culture nearby. I won't do the whole list of similarities, but again, they're many. While Portsmouth is much closer to Newburyport in geography (~ 20 mins), and also much closer in real estate prices (which are about the same), to me, Camden feels more like Newburyport than Portsmouth does.

Some contrasts:
- While both are small cities, Portsmouth downtown is noticeably larger than Newburyport's. When I looked it up just now, the populations are similar, but Portsmouth *feels* much bigger to me, especially the downtown area. More shopping and dining options there too.
- Portsmouth also has extensive strip and even mall shopping on its outskirts, in Newington, and the outlet malls in Kittery.
- Newburyport has more pleasure boats and yachts in the harbor, Portsmouth has more working boats and accommodates commercial shipping
- For inshore salt water boating, I prefer the Great Bay/Little Bay and five rivers in the Portsmouth area, to the Merrimack and Ipswich rivers. Quieter up there in those extensive protected waters that can all be accessed from one another, plus you have the Isles of Shoals just offshore for interest... When I had a small boat, I actually kept it up there in the Great Bay.
- If you like downhill skiing, it's not close, but it's close-r to the White Mountains from Portsmouth. Maudslay State Park in Nbpt is great for cross-country skiing right on the edge of town.
- For parks, I prefer our Maudslay State Park and Parker River National Wildlife Refuge to Adams Point WMA, Wagon Hill Farm, Odiorne Point and Jenness Beach (my favs up there). Mind you, I still visit those NH parks a fair amount too - very nice!
- While Portsmouth certainly isn't lacking, I'd say medical services and transportation services, plus access to Boston jobs and education, better from Newburyport. When my ankle isn't torn up as it is now, I can just walk up the hill from my house to Anna Jaques Hospital and it's affiliated medical buildings, which is actually pretty good for a community hospital, it's sitting right in a green leafy neighborhood. Several world class hospitals lie in Boston for more specialized needs. Even Newburyport isn't *convenient* to Boston and Cambridge, but Portsmouth is too far for daily commuting access (for work or school), in my view.

I love Portsmouth too, would have no trouble with living there, but I prefer Newburyport. Newburyport is a little quieter, and the surrounding towns - Newbury, West Newbury, Amesbury are quieter than those around Portsmouth as well. The parks are nicer, really special in my view. The neighborhoods feel more like neighborhoods to me. It has more of a small town vibe, and I like that. At the same time, it also has better access to those things that I care more about - the nature, the good medical care, the good jobs. I only need so many shopping and dining options within 15 minutes of my house, and Nbpt already has enough for me. When I want more every now and then, okay, so I have to drive 30-60 mins for that, no biggie, and it's not often.