Another Tree Growth question... (Franklin: purchasing, closing, subdivisions)

[BoundtofindME]

Here it is Forest..

Title 36, §572: Purpose

[retiredtinbender]

Originally Posted by forest beekeeper

I am having difficulty finding: Maine Tree Growth Tax Law, Maine Revised Statutes, Title 36, section 572.

Does anyone have a link?

I have posted the link to this page a few times before:
Maine Revenue Services: Property Tax -

That's the link Forest. Just scroll down to the bottom and look fro bulletin #19. It also has the other exemption law links.

[RANGER.101ST]

every year a forester stops by and asks me if i would like to place my forested land in tree growth and every year i tell him no .he tells me it will save me a cpl grand in taxes every year and i tell him i dont care becouse the wood i cut pays my taxes.once you go that directios your in and to get out will cost you.

[retiredtinbender]

Originally Posted by RANGER.101ST

every year a forester stops by and asks me if i would like to place my forested land in tree growth and every year i tell him no .he tells me it will save me a cpl grand in taxes every year and i tell him i dont care becouse the wood i cut pays my taxes.once you go that directios your in and to get out will cost you.

Yeah, youre right it will cost to get out. But that was the idea I think behind tree growth. To stop acreage from being cut up and cut down for subdivisions like they are in NJ and other places. The whole idea is to keep it in T/G and saved. Too many people want to carve it up and do a cookie cutter landscape job on everything. But you seem to be wanting to hold onto it and the woods make you money. You are all ready doing what our great legislature (sacrasm added) wants done. So you don't need the program. And if the state pulls out of the T/G business youre none the worse off.

[dmyankee]

Why would anyone in their right mind want the gubmint telling them what to do with their land? Land ownership is the cornerstone of the American Dream. Granted, you might only be leasing it from the powers that be for the annual tax nut, but what the hell.

Just my 2 cents.

[retiredtinbender]

The gov. tells you what you can do anyway in the form of zoning, building, plumbing. Only natural that they would offer incentives like tree growth, open space and farm to add more $$$ to the coffers. After all, if you're gonna spend you need money. It does knock your taxes down tho. And if you're going to do these things ayway why not get the writeoff?

[forest beekeeper]

Originally Posted by retiredtinbender

The gov. tells you what you can do anyway in the form of zoning, building, plumbing.

True.

You can only 'lease' land from the government anyway, even though you may hold a deed. The government can walk in a take it at their pleasure.

Both sets of my grandparents lost their farms in the 1930s, due to banks and the courts.

And one set lost their second farm in the 1960s due to 'eminent domain', and a water reservoir that was built 20 miles away.

Also if you stop paying your property taxes they will come in and take it too.

... Only natural that they would offer incentives like tree growth, open space and farm to add more $$$ to the coffers.

These programs [tree growth, open space and farm] lower the over all amount of tax money going into government coffers. Lower taxes means lower tax revenue.

The benefit as I see it, is this allows large tracts of land to remain forest. If that land was taxed at the same assessed values and mil rates as residential properties, no body would be able to afford to have forest.

Folks commonly pay $1,000 per acre, or $5,000 per acre for property taxes. Just read the posts here on CD. If you paying taxes of $3,000 per acre, what happens when you own 1,000 acres of timber? Can you afford to pay $3,000,000 property taxes each year? when you have another 20 years to go before it can be harvested? In 20 years you could have an accumulated tax bill of that times 20years [$60million]. Harvesting timber will never bring in enough money to equal that kind of a tax bill.

Without a system of protecting treegrowth land, it would disappear.

... After all, if you're gonna spend you need money. It does knock your taxes down tho. And if you're going to do these things anyway why not get the writeoff?

My land was already in 'Treegrowth' before I bought it.

I knew the limitations before I bought it.

To me: factoring the limitations, and the low land prices, and the low taxes; made the purchase well worth it.

I like living amidst a forest.

[thenewNewEnglander]

Aren't some people people paying $1000 per acre in property taxes because some people are paying $1.05? Maybe everyone should pay $300, or whatever the average would be.

Doesn't Maine cry about not having money for services? Dont you have old roads and bridges too?

I love Maine. I don't live there, yet.
I understand the need to preserve Maine's space, natural beauty, and culture. But I also think that some development, in a way that respects all of the aspects of Maine, would be beneficial to everyone.

Wouldn't some jobs be great? Wouldn't more housing and opportunities for young people be great? New England is doing a terrible job of keeping its young people at home. How many of us have to move down South before people wake up? New England will not survive long if the average age just keeps creeping up. Sooner or later all of the residents will be old, the population will dwindle away, we'll have no say on a Federal level, federal law will find a way to supercede, and we'll lose everything.

There'll be a massive real estate glut because there wont be any family to take over property ownership, tax revenues will fall and rates will rise. Compounding all of the problems.

Growth- its not so bad. Look at Colorado or Montana.
We're not likely to see a metropolis, heavy traffic, smog, or all the other urban problems anytime soon.
Maine is the most sparsely populated state east of the Mississippi....
There's plenty of room. But in New England its always not in my backyard... a massive culture of obstruction. "I moved here cuz it was the woods" well news flash, ya shoulda bought the woods.

Maybe think of the struggling young families, the young creatives that really want to come be a part of this great place, the people that want to get away from the less desirable parts of America... The people that love and value your awesome culture of 'keep it local'
I wanna move there, build my guitars there, buy my wood there, wear clothes made there, eat food grown there, spend my money there, play there, and help the world know the name Maine.

Do you really think if you get rid of 'treegrowth' that the whole world is gonna rush in to live in the Maine winters?

Maine's great, but it is never gonna have the appeal of southern California, or Florida. And its not likely to offer the jobs of Manhattan anytime soon.

The country is melting into financial insolvency and we're worrying about maintaining some forest tracts?

At the rate we're going we'll all be bartering soon.

If we aint growing, we're dying.

[forest beekeeper]

Originally Posted by thenewNewEnglander

Aren't some people people paying $1000 per acre in property taxes because some people are paying $1.05? Maybe everyone should pay $300, or whatever the average would be.

Doesn't Maine cry about not having money for services? Dont you have old roads and bridges too?

You have never heard my 'cry' about not enough money for socialist municipal services.

...Wouldn't some jobs be great?

No.

... Wouldn't more housing and opportunities for young people be great?

No.

... New England is doing a terrible job of keeping its young people at home. How many of us have to move down South before people wake up? New England will not survive long if the average age just keeps creeping up. Sooner or later all of the residents will be old, the population will dwindle away, we'll have no say on a Federal level, federal law will find a way to supercede, and we'll lose everything.

Your in Mass right?

I thought so.

... Growth- its not so bad.

Ick.

... Maine is the most sparsely populated state east of the Mississippi....
There's plenty of room.

Yes, I love it

... Maine's great, but it is never gonna have the appeal of southern California, or Florida. And its not likely to offer the jobs of Manhattan anytime soon.

Good

... The country is melting into financial insolvency and we're worrying about maintaining some forest tracts?

At the rate we're going we'll all be bartering soon.

Could be, hopefully it happens sooner, rather than later.

... If we aint growing, we're dying.

I disagree.

[retiredtinbender]

Forest, you're just yanking his chain now. I agree with some of what you say. But yes we do need services and no, they're not all "socialist municipal services". If some guy is racing up and down the street out here I want cops to come get him, I want EMS if I fall off the roof, and I want trained firemen if I need them. I want these kids in town to get and education and be productive adults.

BUT, I don't think that all these people drawing from MY tax pool have bad backs and can't work. And I don't think the schools need to have pshyciological sesssions with the kids when little johnny swears at the teacher. I think little johnny shouold get his tail end blistered. I don't like the idea of unemployment office having an outreach program (NYC does I read). I am tired of going to work at 7:30 and seeing the guys next door sitting on their fat butts drinking (Irish?) coffee and being in the same spot at noon. These guys usually have travel brochures too. So I agree with you there.

I'm a firm believer in if you don't work you don't get to play either. I'm sick of pampering people because they know how to work the system. I realize there are those who legitamately can't work. I'm getting on a soapbox and 7th or Cornerguy isd going to say off topic.

These exemptions on this thread do help out some folks whose land has been in the family for generations. With all the social programs that we are told must be funded they get taxed beyond belief. In that case they are good and help folks trying to keep farming or timbering. And now, I step down.