Actual Employment Info on Maine (Rome: job market, college, taxes)

[Acadianlion]

Originally Posted by forest beekeeper

I see things which confuse me about 'employment in Maine'.

[long post, so bear with me]

I work part-time in a grocery store stocking shelves on contract with a couple distributors. My Dw works for the store. I have seen contracts there go open with nobody stocking their products since January.

My pension is fine for Maine living, going in to the store 5 days a week gives me something to do which is not on our property. Which is nice.

Both of our sons have stocked shelves there when each of them were living at home with us.

These contracts range from little stuff like butterball turkeys which only move during the holidays, so most weeks a person could come once a week in for 10 minutes, glance at the turkeys and leave. To contracts like Kraft or Yoplait which takes each of those people 4+ hours every night. We have some folks who have 6 or 8 contracts at a time, and manage to spend 6 to 10 hours each day stocking.

One contract that I was doing, I dropped, it was 3 to 4 hours each night, mostly frozen food, dinners and ice cream in their -15 freezer which I did not like doing. I notified everyone that I was dropping this contract on the first of July. I posted the opening on their bulletin board, and I have mentioned it here on CD, a full 2 weeks before the opening occurred so if anyone wanted to step in they could. I stopped stocking that product line on 15July.

Today, 29July the first person to ask about this opening approached me. I walked her through the store and showed her which products are included on this contract. To print out the list of product lines takes 3 pages of paper [like: Banquet, Kid's Cuisine, Gordon's Fish, Armour meats, Breyers ice cream, etc ...]

Then she told me that it was not for her, but rather her boyfriend. He has been out of work for 6 months and she wants to convince him to start doing something.

In the past, I have mentioned these contracts to some of our neighbors, but "No thanks".

I have mentioned them here on CD. I get an odd response. I tend to get a couple rep points, and a couple DMs from folks telling me they wish I would die.

I am confused. Clearly there is work to be done. I know these are small odd jobs, a person could add them up, into being a full-time job.

Most of the other stockers already have full-time jobs, they are stocking after their normal jobs for the extra cash.

But then so few people want these jobs.

I know posting this, I will get the usual reps and the usual flames. Some folks will agree and some folks will add this onto their list for why they hate me.

I still don't get it.

Unemployment is 'high', so logically folks should be fighting over what jobs exist. I have lived in countries where this does happen. and where bribery is rampant. Yet here unemployment is 'high' and folks do not care.

They live with their parents, or with their GF/BF, or they get a gubbermint check, they drink Allen's and play the lotto.

So how is it that unemployment is 'high' when nobody wants a lob?

Excellent question. I have watched the unemployment and underemployment situation here in Maine since I first moved here in 1977. In those first days of my residency here people I knew suggested that I go to the Maine Job Service and register so that I could interview for jobs that were posted there. I have previously indicated that there were few jobs that called for my skill sets, or job that required different skill sets than I possessed.

I remember the interview with the jobs counselor. The first thing that he wanted to help me to do was to fill out the unemployment application. The conversation went like this:

Job Counselor: "First I think you should fill out the unemployment application. You may be eligible for benefits."

Me: "As I have explained to you, I refused to accept my new contract in Massachusetts, and have chosen to move to Maine. I am certain that I am not eligible for unemployment."

Job Counselor: "Yes, I understand that. But you should still apply because there are ways that the system can provide benefits for you sometimes, even though you know it won't. You should apply."

So in order to go to step three of the interview, I filled out the form. Two weeks or so later I got confirmation of what I already knew: no benefits for me. When I was offered a job digging a trench for an electrician who was installing an electrical service at a gas station for five bucks an hour, I jumped at the chance. That was four day's work, and I learned to handle an electric jackhammer, which I had never handled before. I considered my self enriched by the experience in all ways.

The next job was sanding the brightwork on a contractor's boat. He needed to hire someone to prep his 19-foot lapstreak boat so he could go fishing. In May, he was simply too busy getting his sand and gravel business moving after the long hard winter to do the work himself. I think I was four days there at $4 per hour.

What I heard when I told people what I had been doing was, "Oh, we NEVER can find someone to do a little job. Everyone is working straight out or "collecting unemployment so the little jobs don't get done.

Sounded like my future to me, so I started my own "company" doing odd jobs.

Today I think the situation is pretty much the same. It would be harder to earn much of a living doing odd jobs in this economy, but there are certainly jobs available. Some of the jobs that I got back then were not pleasant, and had I been married with children, I doubt that I could have done things the way that I did them. But there are part time jobs available, and if someone wanted to piece together a living, I think it could be done.

One big issue is travel and transportation. I wrote about young Mark and his wife and two children. She is a CNA and can work as much as she likes. Unfortunately, the nursing homes are all twenty-five miles from home, which means that it takes a car and fifty miles of commuting....ONE HOUR of driving and car running per day...to earn minimum wage. AND when she works her husband must be available to provide child care. IF he is nailing shingles onto a roof top in Somesville, 45 miles away, it becomes really difficult to cover the miles. Working for eight hours at minimum wage to pay someone $8 per hour to baby sit makes NO sense. This scenario is repeated for many, many times every week here in Maine, so unemployment becomes more than just a safety net, but becomes the ONLY net at least for a while.

I think it isn't so much that there are NO jobs, but that the jobs that exist are all pretty much uniformly low pay. I have just shut down a stone business. That company paid $13 per hour without benefits, and the foreman made well over $20 per hour in total. Not really enough, but it was competitive, considered it was straight salary, and paid rain or shine during the season. I know of a comparable business, many times larger than mine was, that pays its mason tenders $9 per hour, straigt time by the time clock.

And it also depends on where you live. If you live within 20 miles of large town, jobs are more readily available, but the small population will NEVER yield high paying hourly jobs unless there is a specific skill set that is needed, and even then, the competition will be pretty tough for what there is.

While Maine may have a unique spin to put on it, I don't think the issue of low paying jobs or poor employment climate is Maine's alone. I think it is a national issue: disregard for the small business. I think that Maine has made a critical error thinking that Maine's highest and best use is to be a tourism playground. Rather I think that Maine should put more emphasis on the benefits to the economy of the small business...less than 25 employees, and there should be vigorous and direct attempts by Maine to get more people to hire one, two or three people in an attempt to develop wealth by production. This is to say, Maine should promote small, VALUE added industry on a micro economic level, consistent with the nature of the population in Maine. One such encouraging method might be the elimination of the state employer withholding contribution or other tax relief for the small employer. Just the reduction in paper work load to the small employer would provide a great boost to the creation of employment at the local level. Perhaps some sort of commuting tax benefit to the worker who must travel more than, say ten miles each way to find employment would help take the sting out of lower wage scales also.

I believe that tourism is a bogus industry in Maine. Tourism pays benefits to the land owner or the business owner primarily, or to the person who can take advantage of tourism because of his capital position. But by far it appears that tourism related industries pay primarily minimum wage and no additional benefits, because by nature, most tourism industries do not retain all employees all year, nor year in and out. Much like more and more big box stores make little real contribution to the local economy, since most of the jobs provided are minimum wage, or entry level positions that do not provide sufficient income to workers to enable them to buy a home, and become a permanent member of the community. Thus although this is employment, this is not adding value, and far too much of the economy has become like this.

I remember when there were shoes being made here. I remember when there were fish being processed, and I remember well when there was a huge poultry processing business centered around Belfast. Before that there were textile mills and additional lumber related industries in Maine. Pretty much all gone now, and not replaced by similar VALUE ADDED industries, and without value added industry, high wages are simply not possible.

Thus unemployment becomes the bench mark for an employer to compete with. If unemployment benefits are "X" dollars, then an employer paying "X plus 1 dollar" will get the worker who values that one dollar more than staying home. Unemployment is easier, and the results will be predictable.

[JC3]

Acadianlion, well put.

[reloop]

An excellent reply.

Originally Posted by Acadianlion

Excellent question. I have watched the unemployment and underemployment situation here in Maine since I first moved here in 1977. In those first days of my residency here people I knew suggested that I go to the Maine Job Service and register so that I could interview for jobs that were posted there. I have previously indicated that there were few jobs that called for my skill sets, or job that required different skill sets than I possessed.

I remember the interview with the jobs counselor. The first thing that he wanted to help me to do was to fill out the unemployment application. The conversation went like this:

Job Counselor: "First I think you should fill out the unemployment application. You may be eligible for benefits."

Me: "As I have explained to you, I refused to accept my new contract in Massachusetts, and have chosen to move to Maine. I am certain that I am not eligible for unemployment."

Job Counselor: "Yes, I understand that. But you should still apply because there are ways that the system can provide benefits for you sometimes, even though you know it won't. You should apply." That seems to be the standard, scripted response - the process of hoop-jumping has been made so complicated that I won't even go there.

So in order to go to step three of the interview, I filled out the form. Two weeks or so later I got confirmation of what I already knew: no benefits for me. When I was offered a job digging a trench for an electrician who was installing an electrical service at a gas station for five bucks an hour, I jumped at the chance. That was four day's work, and I learned to handle an electric jackhammer, which I had never handled before. I considered my self enriched by the experience in all ways.

The next job was sanding the brightwork on a contractor's boat. He needed to hire someone to prep his 19-foot lapstreak boat so he could go fishing. In May, he was simply too busy getting his sand and gravel business moving after the long hard winter to do the work himself. I think I was four days there at $4 per hour.

What I heard when I told people what I had been doing was, "Oh, we NEVER can find someone to do a little job. Everyone is working straight out or "collecting unemployment so the little jobs don't get done.

Sounded like my future to me, so I started my own "company" doing odd jobs.

Today I think the situation is pretty much the same. It would be harder to earn much of a living doing odd jobs in this economy, but there are certainly jobs available. Some of the jobs that I got back then were not pleasant, and had I been married with children, I doubt that I could have done things the way that I did them. But there are part time jobs available, and if someone wanted to piece together a living, I think it could be done. Unpleasant jobs - I've had many -working for a local cleaning company doing fire jobs (cleaning after a house fire) comes to the forefront of my mind when I think of what motivated me to find a better job... Also an excellent point about being married with children. Childcare is cost-prohibitive in many cases. I've always managed to keep my kids out of it by working evenings/nights while the DH took over, but I'm certain it plays a significant role for many families. I had a friend whose husband ditched her and their 2 children. She went back to school and was able to secure a full-time job in an office. She took advantage of childcare assistance as she had no relatives to help her out with that, but she really didn't get ahead much because she ended up taking a fairly significant cut in pay (so-to-speak) when the daycare voucher program was cut in the early '90s as I recall. Sighh...the state program that goes after deadbeat parents has helped her immensely, but she's still owed back child support pay from years ago. Fortunately, she's extremely resourceful and a hard worker to boot.

One big issue is travel and transportation. I wrote about young Mark and his wife and two children. She is a CNA and can work as much as she likes. Unfortunately, the nursing homes are all twenty-five miles from home, which means that it takes a car and fifty miles of commuting....ONE HOUR of driving and car running per day...to earn minimum wage. AND when she works her husband must be available to provide child care. IF he is nailing shingles onto a roof top in Somesville, 45 miles away, it becomes really difficult to cover the miles. Working for eight hours at minimum wage to pay someone $8 per hour to baby sit makes NO sense. This scenario is repeated for many, many times every week here in Maine, so unemployment becomes more than just a safety net, but becomes the ONLY net at least for a while.

I think it isn't so much that there are NO jobs, but that the jobs that exist are all pretty much uniformly low pay. I have just shut down a stone business. That company paid $13 per hour without benefits, and the foreman made well over $20 per hour in total. Not really enough, but it was competitive, considered it was straight salary, and paid rain or shine during the season. I know of a comparable business, many times larger than mine was, that pays its mason tenders $9 per hour, straigt time by the time clock. That would be considered by many circles as excellent pay for the area.

And it also depends on where you live. If you live within 20 miles of large town, jobs are more readily available, but the small population will NEVER yield high paying hourly jobs unless there is a specific skill set that is needed, and even then, the competition will be pretty tough for what there is. Reality isn't really all that rosey is it? This is the type of statement that I consider reality, not "doom and gloom." Sorry if it seems that way, but really, how can we spin it into something that sounds any better?

While Maine may have a unique spin to put on it, I don't think the issue of low paying jobs or poor employment climate is Maine's alone. I think it is a national issue: disregard for the small business. I think that Maine has made a critical error thinking that Maine's highest and best use is to be a tourism playground. I couldn't agree more. I'll add that nationally, IMHO, bringing some of the manufacturing jobs back to the US would go a long way to help alleviate the dearth of decent jobs. Will we have to pay more for things? Oh, more than likely we will, but from my simple observations, we are paying just as much if not more on the other end when we save that 5 cents on our rolls of toilet paper - made in China or Canada or wherever...Small businesses do need help growing into bigger ones - therefore allowing stronger buying power into health plans, etc.

Rather I think that Maine should put more emphasis on the benefits to the economy of the small business...less than 25 employees, and there should be vigorous and direct attempts by Maine to get more people to hire one, two or three people in an attempt to develop wealth by production. This is to say, Maine should promote small, VALUE added industry on a micro economic level, consistent with the nature of the population in Maine. One such encouraging method might be the elimination of the state employer withholding contribution or other tax relief for the small employer. Just the reduction in paper work load to the small employer would provide a great boost to the creation of employment at the local level. Perhaps some sort of commuting tax benefit to the worker who must travel more than, say ten miles each way to find employment would help take the sting out of lower wage scales also.

I believe that tourism is a bogus industry in Maine. Tourism pays benefits to the land owner or the business owner primarily, or to the person who can take advantage of tourism because of his capital position. But by far it appears that tourism related industries pay primarily minimum wage and no additional benefits, because by nature, most tourism industries do not retain all employees all year, nor year in and out. Much like more and more big box stores make little real contribution to the local economy, since most of the jobs provided are minimum wage, or entry level positions that do not provide sufficient income to workers to enable them to buy a home, and become a permanent member of the community. Thus although this is employment, this is not adding value, and far too much of the economy has become like this. I agree. My siblings and I were discussing this just the other day. When my brother graduated from high school in 1978, he secured a position as a night auditor in a local motel. The pay was not a heck of a lot more than minimum at the time, yet the economy was such that he was able to rent a tiny house, own his car, and have pretty much what he wanted in terms of eating out, entertainment, etc. We actually went so far as to run the numbers. It can be done of course - anything can - but by today's standards, he'd need at least 1 or 2 roommates.

I remember when there were shoes being made here. I remember when there were fish being processed, and I remember well when there was a huge poultry processing business centered around Belfast. Before that there were textile mills and additional lumber related industries in Maine. Pretty much all gone now, and not replaced by similar VALUE ADDED industries, and without value added industry, high wages are simply not possible. Many shoe shop workers made then as much working piece work as newly graduated RN's make now.

Thus unemployment becomes the bench mark for an employer to compete with. If unemployment benefits are "X" dollars, then an employer paying "X plus 1 dollar" will get the worker who values that one dollar more than staying home. Unemployment is easier, and the results will be predictable.
Agreed.

[bbb3601]

Originally Posted by Danmac

I haven't read anywhere that anyone has told me to stay where I'm at, and while like yourself making friends is great if it happens good if not oh well. I like any other Human desire and love to meet new and interesting people, but I don't force relationships.

But I appreciate the insight into the Nursing world in Maine it's the first time I've heard of a place passing over an RN for a concern they may not stay long, sounds tough for you. Again thanks for the RN input!

Well this is the reason why I held back for so long. I didn't want to jump your thread, but I didn't post just for you. When I said "stay where you are" I guess that wasn't the correct verbage so for that I am sorry. I just try to be honest because these are the feelings I have encountered. As far as nursing I wasn't passed over...I never applied. I live in Ohio. I was told that day one (yes day one upon feet landing in Maine) I could have a part time or PRN position no questions asked...(I felt lucky) not that uncommon for a new nurse with a new state license unless you are traveling, but then that is just a contract to. That position would be located within 5 miles from the property we are looking at. If I choose to drive I have my pick as you would too. As in other states Maine has a need for masculine male nurses to work in some of the factories, plants, and mills. The men who work in these places are more comfortable with a man than a woman. They are hiring us to cut back on industrial claims etc. I also believe there will come a day where a LMT will be as prevelant in these settings like a nurse for the same reasons. Just like preventative maint on a machine. Do I like to meet new people, and make friends yes...that's a no brainer. But again traveling to Maine as much as I have the people are just different. I liken it more to a.. let them come to you. If you nod your head, or smile in a store or diner great.....if they want to talk... trust me they will, or point blank say.." Who are you? I have never seen you before." One time I smiled at a man in a coffee shop. I then tried to start a conversation about the town. He then looked at me and said.."You must be from away." He then collected his paper and walked out. That is Maine!! People aren't rude just different, and untill they know you they can come off as very rude, but they aren't. Is everyone like this? NO they are not. Sir I know that you haven't read anywhere that someone has suggested you stay where you are.......Once you visit "real" Maine I think you will understand that this is exactly what they are saying, but in their own way. When in Rome..or is that when in Maine??

I have no doubt you will find exactly what you are looking for in Maine so go for it. You won't regret it. Maine has a need for male nurses, and LMT in every capacity. With having two options and your financial position you will have the opportunity to provide needed services to the people of Maine.

[7th generation]

Originally Posted by Danmac

One of the most common statements made on threads here to those wanting to make Maine their new home, is the barrage of responses on how horrible the economy is and how most will fail or be forced to relocate out of Maine.
So lets not listen to all the negative hubbub about the Maine economy, do some research over listening to those that may have an agenda to not wanting any one from out of state to move in

If you come to this state without a good business plan, do not expect to get rich over night.

The helpful members of this forum have given you realistic prospects about your chances of surviving here with your current profession.
I am a 7th generation Mainer, college educated and owned different businesses out of state.

Reason: Because this state is not conducive to fostering new business and the taxes/license fees are criminal.

Mother was ill and I chose to move back, realizing monetarily, I was committing suicide but the trade offs were immense and I will die here happy.

Your attitude toward the help suggested here have given me a headache and I seriously wonder if this was your intent or whether you are seriously interested in moving to the greatest state in the union.

We do want people to move here and create business to support our economy.

[reloop]

bb3601: Thank you for "jumping in" with your perspective .

Hospitals/nursing homes/other healthcare agencies here are hurting just like everywhere else. When they hire, they like to make sure that the endless orientation that they need to provide won't result in a short-lived employee. I'm sure they would prefer to invest in someone who will stay long-term vs. having to contract with a much more expensive traveler company to provide short-term RN's.

I am a per diem office/clerical worker. I've got no shortage of opportunity right now. It works for me because I can say "no" if I cannot for some reason work, and it works for them because I'm not as expensive to employ, and I'm trained in four different areas. I have seen first-hand how Maine can be romantic to those who live in crowed, busy cities, or who just want to live in a calmer (more kid-friendly) area. Many times they come up here, and find for whatever reason, that it's not their cup of tea. This is why I feel it's of utmost importance for anyone wanting to live in Maine (or frankly, anywhere else for that matter) to make sure to come up and visit at least twice per year (winter and summer) in order to make sure that this is a lifestyle that they would enjoy.

[forest beekeeper]

Originally Posted by Danmac

I have a young girl I work w/ who says her boyfriend has been looking for work for some time now but can't seem to find a job. During this time she's supported them w/ her wages as a Therapist and OH she got a 2nd job at Pizza Hut waiting tables, and she was some how under his spell that there is no work. I told her of 2 gas stations within a mile of her home that both had signs up for cashier shifts and they'd been up for some time now.

She tells me he said there wasn't anyone hiring. That's when I mentioned maybe he really wasn't looking or maybe he doesn't want to do that type of work.

Some males are able to find these females who will work to support them. And they seem to be okay doing that.

... Like you said anyday someone can walk into a McDonalds B-King etc and get a job, and from what I've been told an above avg paying job at that, cause last I checked those fast food places are still pretty busy.

But you hit it on the head the jobs are most likely out there they just might be things people aren't willing to do, and for those types they are reaping what they sew.

My pension is really about equal with flipping burgers. My Dw works part-time [35 hours / week], and I started working a couple hours each day stocking shelves. [I do it mostly for the hog-feed, I get to raid their dumpster when they throw out produce that is starting to turn soft.]

We moved here with no house to live in, and we are building our house. Plus planting orchards, and building chicken coops and hog pens and goat / sheep paddocks, etc.

I suspect that when we are finally done building our house and farm; then our expenses should drop a great deal.

We see various families around us: who are not building houses, who are raising children, and who have two part-time jobs [often seasonal jobs]. Maybe a few of them have one full-time low-wage job and the other adult works a part-time job. So either two 20-hour jobs, or a 40-hour and a 20-hour job.

They are making it and raising children in the process.

Yes things can be expensive, and yes taxes can be high.

However things can also be cheap, and taxes can also be low.

[Maineah]

Originally Posted by forest beekeeper

Some males are able to find these females who will work to support them. And they seem to be okay doing that.





My pension is really about equal with flipping burgers. My Dw works part-time [35 hours / week], and I started working a couple hours each day stocking shelves. [I do it mostly for the hog-feed, I get to raid their dumpster when they throw out produce that is starting to turn soft.]

We moved here with no house to live in, and we are building our house. Plus planting orchards, and building chicken coops and hog pens and goat / sheep paddocks, etc.

I suspect that when we are finally done building our house and farm; then our expenses should drop a great deal.

We see various families around us: who are not building houses, who are raising children, and who have two part-time jobs [often seasonal jobs]. Maybe a few of them have one full-time low-wage job and the other adult works a part-time job. So either two 20-hour jobs, or a 40-hour and a 20-hour job.

They are making it and raising children in the process.

Yes things can be expensive, and yes taxes can be high.

However things can also be cheap, and taxes can also be low.

Hey everyone ......Look what forest said!!!! We've been trying to get him to admit this for how many years ???? LOL!!

[flycessna]

Originally Posted by bbb3601

Well this is the reason why I held back for so long. I didn't want to jump your thread, but I didn't post just for you. When I said "stay where you are" I guess that wasn't the correct verbage so for that I am sorry. I just try to be honest because these are the feelings I have encountered. As far as nursing I wasn't passed over...I never applied. I live in Ohio. I was told that day one (yes day one upon feet landing in Maine) I could have a part time or PRN position no questions asked...(I felt lucky) not that uncommon for a new nurse with a new state license unless you are traveling, but then that is just a contract to. That position would be located within 5 miles from the property we are looking at. If I choose to drive I have my pick as you would too. As in other states Maine has a need for masculine male nurses to work in some of the factories, plants, and mills. The men who work in these places are more comfortable with a man than a woman. They are hiring us to cut back on industrial claims etc. I also believe there will come a day where a LMT will be as prevelant in these settings like a nurse for the same reasons. Just like preventative maint on a machine. Do I like to meet new people, and make friends yes...that's a no brainer. But again traveling to Maine as much as I have the people are just different. I liken it more to a.. let them come to you. If you nod your head, or smile in a store or diner great.....if they want to talk... trust me they will, or point blank say.." Who are you? I have never seen you before." One time I smiled at a man in a coffee shop. I then tried to start a conversation about the town. He then looked at me and said.."You must be from away." He then collected his paper and walked out. That is Maine!! People aren't rude just different, and untill they know you they can come off as very rude, but they aren't. Is everyone like this? NO they are not. Sir I know that you haven't read anywhere that someone has suggested you stay where you are.......Once you visit "real" Maine I think you will understand that this is exactly what they are saying, but in their own way. When in Rome..or is that when in Maine??

I have no doubt you will find exactly what you are looking for in Maine so go for it. You won't regret it. Maine has a need for male nurses, and LMT in every capacity. With having two options and your financial position you will have the opportunity to provide needed services to the people of Maine.

I have been here for 15 years. I have made some good friends here during that time, I even met my wife here and now have an extended family .... but I agree whole heartedly that there is a difference in how people relate to each other. I used to think that Mainers were standoffish and just not friendly, but as I get older I realize that the difference is, when you live out of state you are living in mass humanity... it is very easy to find people with common interests and who are outgoing... here in Maine the entire population of the state is the size of a major city so the area is very loosely populated and people tend to be loosely connected. Add to that the lack of a major population of transplants Mainers are not necessarily looking to meet someone new every time they go to the grocery store, they have been here their whole lives and have their network of friends and family and are content.. So I don't believe that deep down people here are any different then anywhere else, it’s just the nature of living in Maine and being a byproduct of that. I also think there may be some demographic issues playing into this as Maine is a poor state but I am not sure.

[bbb3601]

Originally Posted by flycessna

I have been here for 15 years. I have made some good friends here during that time, I even met my wife here and now have an extended family .... but I agree whole heartedly that there is a difference in how people relate to each other. I used to think that Mainers were standoffish and just not friendly, but as I get older I realize that the difference is, when you live out of state you are living in mass humanity... it is very easy to find people with common interests and who are outgoing... here in Maine the entire population of the state is the size of a major city so the area is very loosely populated and people tend to be loosely connected. Add to that the lack of a major population of transplants Mainers are not necessarily looking to meet someone new every time they go to the grocery store, they have been here their whole lives and have their network of friends and family and are content.. So I don't believe that deep down people here are any different then anywhere else, it’s just the nature of living in Maine and being a byproduct of that. I also think there may be some demographic issues playing into this as Maine is a poor state but I am not sure.

This is exactly the point I was trying to make had I taken more time or chose different words. When I used different that doesn't mean bad or at least it didn't to me it was just the easiest way for me to explain it. We manged to meet many friends during our trips, and we exchange pics and stories about the kids etc almost daily. I am from small town USA, and I like the fact that the larger part of your state is that way. I like knowing people don't change, strong values,your privacy is your privacy, and if you ever need a helping hand it is usually just a phone call away. Thank you for helping me make my point. I am crawling back under my rock now. Look for the old egg (My trusty Previa that I can't part with) cruising the roads in September. Trip number 6, and our first during warm weather...
To us warm is over 50