Move to Maine (Portland, Kennebunk, Wells: fit in, rent, condominiums)

[Beullah]

My husband and I and our two children 7 and 9 are in the process of selling our home. My husband and I took early retirement, and we're interested in purchasing a home further away from the city. We've been along the East Coast (in winter), and really love it. We've considered moving to somewhere in York County: The Kennebunks, Wells, or York (maybe Cape Elizabeth).

We currently live in Contra Costa County, in the San Francisco Bay Area. Our desire is to have access to a good public school district, live in a safe community, and have some recreational opportunities.

But, in trolling these threads, some folks make Maine sound frightening. It sounds like the people and environment would be very unwelcoming.

I have lived in Idaho and often visited Colorado (Gunnison and Montrose) during the winters visiting my grandparents. We've spent time in Connecticut in winter, and didn't have a problem with the cold. CT doesn't get that much snow. Maine has higher humidity but lower summer temps. Our current area's summer highs tend to be in the 88 to 105 degree range, but we have lower humidity. Our most interesting weather is to have an 75+ degree day in the middle of January.

I wouldn't say that folks here in the SF Bay Area are overly friendly. Some are, but most friendships revolve around kids, school, and that sort of thing. Because California is so populated and resources are scarce right now, so people can be pretty ugly to each other.

The activities we like are: swimming (my kids are on a swim team), bowling (they bowl on a league), bike riding, fishing, skiing, visiting national and state parks, etc. Of course, the kids like play dates.

I guess I'm wondering if we'd fit in. And, are the Southern Maine winters really that bad? Do folks really spend seven months out of the year in their homes?

We took early retirement, so we've got a great deal of flexibility regarding where we live. I was a civil service employee, so I have retiree medical coverage under a very large group plan.

Any feedback would be appreciated.

[forest beekeeper]

You have pensions, medical coverage, and from selling your previous home you will have a handful of cash.

You can buy a home here without fear of lacking for income or healthcare.

The schools are great, crime is very low, and you might really enjoy yourself.

We have known a few folks who visit Gunnison Co, so we may have mutual friends.

Welcome to Maine

[Beullah]

Thank you, Beekeeper. My mother was born in Lake City, CO, and raised on the Powderhorn. Gunnison is as cold as any place I've been. I've heard that it's the coldest place on earth (joking). We might have mutual acquaintances except that my grandparents have been gone for many years.

My mother's family came to CO from Cornwall, UK as tin miners, I believe.

We're very excited to do something different, and we love the rich history the East Coast provides. We were in CT last Christmas and drove through MA, NH, up to Maine. We stopped at Gloucester, MA, and the folks were friendly, and their kids shared sleds with our kids.

My son was at the Naval sub school @ Groton, CT. He was in school with several young people from Maine and Vermont, and they were very kind to him. One young man had him over for Thanksgiving dinner as he couldn't travel home. Because the drive to VT and ME is not long, many of his Navy buddies took him to their homes during Liberty.

[Acadianlion]

Originally Posted by Beullah

My husband and I and our two children 7 and 9 are in the process of selling our home. My husband and I took early retirement, and we're interested in purchasing a home further away from the city. We've been along the East Coast (in winter), and really love it. We've considered moving to somewhere in York County: The Kennebunks, Wells, or York (maybe Cape Elizabeth).

We currently live in Contra Costa County, in the San Francisco Bay Area. Our desire is to have access to a good public school district, live in a safe community, and have some recreational opportunities.

But, in trolling these threads, some folks make Maine sound frightening. It sounds like the people and environment would be very unwelcoming.

I have lived in Idaho and often visited Colorado (Gunnison and Montrose) during the winters visiting my grandparents. We've spent time in Connecticut in winter, and didn't have a problem with the cold. CT doesn't get that much snow. Maine has higher humidity but lower summer temps. Our current area's summer highs tend to be in the 88 to 105 degree range, but we have lower humidity. Our most interesting weather is to have an 75+ degree day in the middle of January.

I wouldn't say that folks here in the SF Bay Area are overly friendly. Some are, but most friendships revolve around kids, school, and that sort of thing. Because California is so populated and resources are scarce right now, so people can be pretty ugly to each other.

The activities we like are: swimming (my kids are on a swim team), bowling (they bowl on a league), bike riding, fishing, skiing, visiting national and state parks, etc. Of course, the kids like play dates.

I guess I'm wondering if we'd fit in. And, are the Southern Maine winters really that bad? Do folks really spend seven months out of the year in their homes?

We took early retirement, so we've got a great deal of flexibility regarding where we live. I was a civil service employee, so I have retiree medical coverage under a very large group plan.

Any feedback would be appreciated.

I think you are talking about two different kinds of moves to Maine. You have pretty much decided to live in Cumberland or York County, which are in the southwestern most part of Maine, and where the greatest population density is. So also are the greatest number of "city like" conveniences. Most people who live in Maine consider this to be more like a suburb of Boston, than like the rest of Maine.

The closer you live to the New Hampshire/Maine boundary, the more you will find living conditions to be more like whatever other urban, semi-urban, or sub-urban area in the country you are coming from. The term is "Generica".

But the vast majority of Maine is rural, to extremely rural. Most cities are not larger than five or six thousand people, and many, many towns have fewer than a thousand citizens. This means that many, many "services" and "conveniences" of what is called "modern" life, are simply not present.

Whatever stories you have read or heard about Maine being unwelcoming to people who move here "from away", are simply not true. Mainers who are FROM Maine, or who have been here for a long time are generally very welcoming and friendly people. But they are also apt to guard their privacy quite fiercely, and in general, there is a considered resistance to being told what to do, how to do it, and when to do it. When folks from away move in to an area and begin to try to change things...or are perceived to try to change things...to be like whereever they came from, there is often resentment and hostility. Very often this takes place in the form of people running for public office, such as school boards after living in a town or small city for a few months.

A lot of this resentment stems from financial concerns. Maine's economy is very, very small compared to many, many states. When people move to rural Maine "from away" and are perceived to have made a killing financially where they came from before there can be resentment that comes from a fear that "improvements" that they advocate will raise taxes, or otherwise financially impact those people who have been here longer and who struggle to make ends meet.

Does all of this mean that Maine is a hostile place to people who move here? The simple answer is "No". It does mean that people need to understand that this is a very small community...1.3 million people mostly scattered over a very large area (for an eastern state). When people move to Maine's small areas it is good for them to learn their new territory and people. This means spend some time living without trying to [b]lead.[b]

I have an example to give you from personal experience. I moved here permanently in 1990, although I had lived here once before in the mid 1970's and had lived in Maine permanently since 1977. I have lived in the greater Portland area, in west central Maine and here in Hancock County, near Ellsworth. Along with a group of other people, some of whom had lived here for generations, I became actively involved in opposition to issues here in town, spoke out in Town Meeting and was a part of an activist group.

At one selectmen's meeting a comment was made by one of the selectmen about people who had not lived here for very long trying to make administrative changes in the town. His comment was directed at me personally after I spoke from the floor at the meeting. I didn't let it go, and asked for a definition about citizenship that might qualify people in town to take an active interest in the town. I pointed out that I had lived on this property since 1990. I also pointed out that this property had been in my family since the subdivision was formed in 1900. I then explained that my family roots were in this part of the county since before the town was formed, and that one of my relatives had been a mill owner in one of the original mills on Ellsworth's waterfront. I asked him if that was sufficient lineage to be involved. I knew full well that he could not trace his ancestry in the area back further than a generation, and I made my point.

And my point here is that the one thing that Mainers will resent most are people moving here from _______________(fill in whatever town and state you wish), who quickly proceed to explain why this or that is SOOOOOOO much better where they came from than it is here in Maine.

Maine is not perfect. Most Mainers will tell you that they KNOW it is not perfect. But we have low crime, basically small and good schools, and enough medical care to provide most basic services for most people's needs on a day to day basis. For most Mainers this is pretty much life the way it should be. And they will welcome you from Colorado, or San Francisco, or Ft Worth, or Newark so long as you embrace your new life as just that, and not make it sound like you are just dying to go back to whereever you came from and if you can't you will try to change everything here to be like that.

[atardie]

Acadianlion says it right. Enjoy Maine the way it is. If you are coming here to do that you will love it. If you want it to be West Coast, You won't like it. Come and enjoy the new life you and your family are starting and embrace Maine... Welcome!

[forest beekeeper]

Originally Posted by Beullah

... Thank you, Beekeeper.

You are welcome.

... My son was at the Naval sub school @ Groton, CT. He was in school with several young people from Maine and Vermont, and they were very kind to him. One young man had him over for Thanksgiving dinner as he couldn't travel home. Because the drive to VT and ME is not long, many of his Navy buddies took him to their homes during Liberty.

What boat did he serve on?

We have taken sailors home for Thanksgiving a few times as well.

I was also a submariner.

Maine has a couple chapters of 'SubVets' so it is possible that your son's friends may be here.

[Robert1955]

Hi-Your post really sounds like my family. We are goiing thru the same process. We have children 10 and 13 and we're thinking of moving from suburban CT to the areas of Maine you looking at. We're going up this weekend (at least we're closer than CA!). I'll be interested in reading your future posts to see what you decide and where you end up! By the way, the people we have met seem exceptionally nice! Best of Luck-

[Deborah Caldwell]

Well. This might seem unwelcoming. But. After due consideration, it seems that Boston might be the most wonderful place for you. Boston is really a very manageable small city. It really is true that Maine, even Portland, does not have the grid that other cities have when offering the real depth of choice of academic lives. But Boston offers real and very close access to the countryside. You can get out of the city in half an hour to buy apples on an apple farm. Boston is safe. Boston is a fine place to live downtown, as long as you do not live in the suburbs, whereby you will be generic, as A Lion has said. If you live right in downtown Boston you will find the most wonderful activities for the kids, playdates all over the place, real depth in the variety of schools, and the East Coast, and one-dollar sailing lessons on the Charles in the summer for the kids, and Maine to visit for skiing, just a very few hours away. You can either rent or buy a place near skiing. You will have places for beautiful city gardens, and access to farm fresh food, and every kind of educational thing in the world. The museums ... the schools. Or even better, you could live in Cambridge in Harvard Square and enjoy the Peabody museums for the kids, and all the wonderful Eastern academic pursuits that Cambridge and Boston have to offer. Talk about satisfaction and gratification, and cities that still have neighborhoods... nice little old houses that are pricey, or good condominiums, but affordable if you have a good base, as you do have. I have grandchildren in Portland who are the same age that your children are, and they have a wonderful life there. It is, however, all revolving around their very specific age group of music, making music, children, making more children, and hard hard work. Theirs is rather a closed group, and when considered by those of us who have seen quite a variety of groups, it is one of just a few groups. Boston. That's my vote.

[Maineah]

Originally Posted by Deborah Caldwell

Well. This might seem unwelcoming. But. After due consideration, it seems that Boston might be the most wonderful place for you. Boston is really a very manageable small city. It really is true that Maine, even Portland, does not have the grid that other cities have when offering the real depth of choice of academic lives. But Boston offers real and very close access to the countryside. You can get out of the city in half an hour to buy apples on an apple farm. Boston is safe. Boston is a fine place to live downtown, as long as you do not live in the suburbs, whereby you will be generic, as A Lion has said. If you live right in downtown Boston you will find the most wonderful activities for the kids, playdates all over the place, real depth in the variety of schools, and the East Coast, and one-dollar sailing lessons on the Charles in the summer for the kids, and Maine to visit for skiing, just a very few hours away. You can either rent or buy a place near skiing. You will have places for beautiful city gardens, and access to farm fresh food, and every kind of educational thing in the world. The museums ... the schools. Or even better, you could live in Cambridge in Harvard Square and enjoy the Peabody museums for the kids, and all the wonderful Eastern academic pursuits that Cambridge and Boston have to offer. Talk about satisfaction and gratification, and cities that still have neighborhoods... nice little old houses that are pricey, or good condominiums, but affordable if you have a good base, as you do have. I have grandchildren in Portland who are the same age that your children are, and they have a wonderful life there. It is, however, all revolving around their very specific age group of music, making music, children, making more children, and hard hard work. Theirs is rather a closed group, and when considered by those of us who have seen quite a variety of groups, it is one of just a few groups. Boston. That's my vote.

This is one of the most confusing posts I have ever read!

[Beullah]

To all:

I can't imagine we would want to change anything. The only thing we work on here is improving our public school district, i.e., passing a parcel tax and and trying to bring kids in lower socioeconomic backgrounds into parity with kids from more affluent backgrounds. Our school tax funding is different than most states because we have Proposition 13. It fixes our property taxes at 1% of the purchase price plus ad valorem taxes and assessments. Maine probably funds it's schools at the same level per pupil as California, yet California has a higher cost of living and, let's face it, is a very affluent state. A parcel tax requires a supermajority vote. We've had funding issues since I was in junior high school (in the 1970s).

The reason that we selected Southern Maine is because there is less snow and, yes, because it's less rural. My husband and I are 45 years old, and I'm afraid to get old in an environment in which I can't maintain my independence. I'm trying to think 20 years ahead.

Robert: I will keep you updated. We looked at CT; we really liked it. We looked at the Farmington Valley, but the property taxes are really high.

beekeeper: My son is currently serving on the USS Los Angeles WESTPAC. He's stationed in Hawaii. He was ported in Singapore last week for a few days, and he was able to call me a couple of times. The next time I hear from him, he should be in Los Angeles. The USS Los Angeles is the first class of the Los Angeles class of submarine. They're planning on decommissioning it after this deployment. They're having a small celebration in LA, and then a large 'official' ceremony in Washington. After his boat is decommed, he will his choice of orders: Pearl Harbor (where he's currently stationed), and Washington. He might ask for San Diego, but he's doubtful that he'll get it. He likes Hawaii because he wants to be on the fast attack subs (they travel out of US waters). If he goes to Washington, he'll be on a boomer, and they don't go out of US waters. If it were me, I'd ask to be assigned to the East Coast so I could see more of the world rather than going to the same countries over and over again. Unfortunately, he hated the East Coast. He just could not tolerate the cold weather.

I really don't think we want to make Maine into California. California has far too many problems. The politics here are just crazy. The people are even crazier. There is a self-centeredness here that I haven't seen anywhere else. I've had someone get mad at me because I was walking my kid across the street to school, and we had the right-of-way/crossing guard. This person became very irate because she couldn't make her turn until we crossed.

And, while my husband and I are not necessarily against change, we don't want all of our neighboring cities turned into strip malls. They all look the same and the chain stores move in and drive out the locally-owned establishments. My husband's hometown no longer has the mom and pop sporting goods store, restaurants, and the like.

California just cannot be run effectively as it is. The interests in the three major regions are too disparate. Northern California (where I live), the Central Valley, and Southern California (with the exception of LA and Hollywood). There are always significant competing interests between the three regions. There is also a ton of racism here.

The few good things here is that Disneyland or Lake Tahoe are within a day's drive. The Monterey Bay Aquarium is very nice, but the Mystic CT Aquarium beats it. Driving Hwy 1 North is beautiful. Just like driving the Coastal highway on the East Coast. Yosemite National Park. If you haven't been there, you should go. It's impressive, but very expensive. Go in Spring or Winter. It's more affordable, but cold. During the winter, you can snowshoe and X-Country ski. These are pretty much the highlights.

We thought the East Coasters were very nice, but as tourists, it's hard to tell. I know that we experienced very little in our time in the East, but we loved sledding at Gunstock Resort in NH and at Gloucester MA. We just reveled in US history. It's everywhere there.