U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Maryland
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-18-2011, 04:18 PM
 
Location: Metro Washington DC
12,571 posts, read 18,980,912 times
Reputation: 7206

Advertisements

I just got an email today from Montgomery County schools and it did not sound good. It's looking like big cuts are coming soon.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-18-2011, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Portland, Maine
4,180 posts, read 12,778,686 times
Reputation: 1603
Teaching jobs across the country are in jeopardy. Not sure how it will all end up but if you presently have a job, hold on to it until something for sure comes along.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-18-2011, 07:43 PM
 
21 posts, read 66,005 times
Reputation: 17
Prince Georges is bad. You can get the demographics from Wikipedia, the Census Bureau, Factfinder.org or from City-Data. No other county-level prefixture in Maryland except for Baltimore City has as much crime, corruption, absurdity and declining property values (The slum kind, not the good-bargain kind).

The reason AA is bad is because aside from their superindendant being the highest paid in the entire country they force teachers to take furlough days and put a sub in the classroom, this is for teachers who aren't even sick or have an emergency. Minimal savings at a great detriment to a child's education.

If you want a compromise between salary and cost of living (and semi-country lifestyle) then I'd suggest Frederick and Carroll counties.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-18-2011, 07:49 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
32,176 posts, read 39,325,128 times
Reputation: 40695
Kevin Maxwell is not the "highest paid Superintendant in the country". Hite (PG) and Weist (Montgomery) in MD beat him.

On the furlough days schools were shut down, subs do not go into the classrooms on those days.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2011, 07:54 AM
 
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
82 posts, read 231,541 times
Reputation: 35
There is a good chance my current job in Pittsburgh may be furloughed as well. I will have to bid on it in April to keep it and there is no guarantee. anyone with more seniority can bump me. Even if I stay, I still may be out of a job.

So it looks like Prince George's Co. and Anne Arundel Co. are out.

Can anyone tell me more about Frederick Co. and Carroll Co?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2011, 01:00 PM
 
297 posts, read 1,133,218 times
Reputation: 125
My son goes to special needs preschool in Carroll County and we LOVE the school (Carrolltowne Elementary in Eldersburg), teachers, and the district. I saw in the paper (Carroll County Times) recently that Maryland has the best schools in the country, and Carroll County has the 3rd best district in Maryland. I am not sure what data they used to measure this (test scores?) but it's certainly encouraging. Just from our limited exposure to his school I can say that his teachers are completely committed to making sure that he gets all of the resources he needs, they are willing to be flexible to ensure that he is able to learn the way he does best, they are unwilling to have him settle for "good enough" and constantly challenge him to be better and better. I honestly can't say enough good things about his school and teachers. I would wholeheartedly recommend Carroll County both for the school district and for the quality of life here.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2011, 03:34 PM
 
Location: Cumberland
4,566 posts, read 7,640,867 times
Reputation: 2790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelers10 View Post
If you are looking for a change then don't go to Baltimore or DC. You would likely be getting more of the same. Like Pittsburgh, Baltimore and DC are two independent school districts (let's not even talk about DC which isn't even in a state) that experienced shrinking tax bases for 50 years. School systems just aren't run that well when everybody is on the first thing smoking trying to get out of it.

Unfortunately, some of the "southerness" of Maryland has come out in a couple of the previous comments. You never mentioned your ethnic background nor should you. But I think some of these posters naturally assumed that you are white and would not potentially be offended by a statement of staying away from "Baltimore Blacks".

Yes, avoid Baltimore schools. But not because they're black. Pittsburgh native Dennis Miller once remarked about the Southern legal system: "You can't get justice in a courtroom with a ceiling fan." Something similar could be said about Baltimore (and DC) schools. Has any school district that went through a contentious desegregation effort and been in decline since ever rebounded to become good?

Baltimore schools weren't built to be good. They were built reinforce segregation. Since Baltimore has been in free fall for 60 years it's not as if the schools would magically become better. You were assaulted at your school so it seems like you probably teach high school. There are actually a few good public high schools in Baltimore. City College was built right after the Civil War to essentially be a prep school. However, I just couldn't advocate sending your young daughter to an inner-city public school in Baltimore. Same with PG County. There are a few good high schools but after the contentious busing issue of the early 70s, there have just been no positive stakeholders in the system. The whites that didn't want integration left and the black administration that remained was more interested in consolidating power than actually educating the kids.

I honestly don't know much about the school systems on the Eastern Shore, but the schools in Montgomery County are for the most part top notch with a few exceptions. Don't avoid the Montgomery County School System because the kids are diverse. MoCo Public Schools are arguably the best in the country and the driving force behind Maryland's #1 ranking. You would be hard pressed to find a MoCo school without a significant minority population. If you do, you might certainly find a job there but it would probably be in Chevy Chase or Potomac. You wouldn't be living in the zones on strictly a teacher's salary!

In relocating from Pittsburgh, the cost of living (particularly housing) is waaaaaaay more expensive in Central Maryland. Teaching in Montgomery County can be quite lucrative and they pay well. But, on a teacher's salary (once again, I don't know if you have a spouse and I am assuming you have just your daughter), actually living in Montgomery or Howard Counties will consign you to cramped apartment living. And future home ownership would be out of the question. Carroll County is much more affordable but it is still a pretty low-density rural/suburban with not as many housing options. The higher demand but low supply tends to drive up housing costs in Carroll County.

Frederick and Washington Counties are more happy mediums. Frederick is diverse (but nowhere near as diverse as MoCo) in its core and less so in its periphery. However, the schools are mostly good and the district pays teachers fairly well although some salary reductions (yes, reductions not freezes) may be coming down the pipe. There are a few elementary schools that aren't that great within the actual city of Frederick (and I believe West Frederick Middle School is not so hot either) but you can send your daughter to school pretty much anywhere else in the county and feel comfortable. Urbana and Middletown are two of the less diverse areas of Frederick. The schools are great but housing is inordinately expensive. Thurmont/Emmittsburg and Brunswick are the respective north-south poles of the county. They are also not too diverse and are more working-class. The schools aren't as good as Urbana, Middletown, Linganore, or Walkersville but the areas are affordable.

Washington County Public Schools don't have the high-end achieving high schools that you see in MoCo or the few in FredCo but the school system is good all around. Last year the superintendent was named National Superintendent of the Year for the entire country which is no small feat. Being 60-70 miles out of Washington and Baltimore there are really no "urban" issues in WashCo. It is the first county in MD heading west from Baltimore that is unquestionably affordable for someone on a teacher's salary. Almost every school in the county makes AYP every year with the exception of a middle school and an elementary school to the west of downtown Hagerstown. Every other year or so, even those schools make AYP giving the school system 100% attainment. If you are looking for the amenities of suburban Washington or Baltimore it doesn't have them but WashCo being about a 2 1/2 to 3 hour drive from Pittsburgh it is not a landscape that would be completely alien to you and the area's sensibilities and culture are pretty similar to what you would find in PA. WashCo is not overwhelmingly diverse (very few resident Hispanics but about 10% black) but almost all of the schools have been built since the 1950s and they opened integrated. The county is mostly conservative but pretty much completely integrated where you do have minorities and you don't see the racial divisiveness that you have in PG County and Baltimore (and the areas adjacent to Baltimore). Crime is not an issue in WashCo.

I don't know much about the schools in Allegany and Garrett Counties, the two counties farthest west in Maryland. The populations are fairly low and I haven't heard anything bad about the schools academic performance. For some reason every few years some racial slur incident turns up in Cumberland which is odd because there really aren't a lot of minorities out there. It may be possible to get a teaching job out there but there aren't a lot of other jobs in the three "Appalachian" Counties of Maryland. But a lot of people live in WashCo and work in FredCo or live in FredCo and work in MoCo. Carroll County is nice, but kind of a pocket of underdevelopment. It seems like its residents work in FredCo, MoCo, or Howard County.

I hope this dissertation has been of service! If anyone has anything to add about the schools and job opportunities in Southern Maryland and like Harford and Cecil Counties please feel free to jump in. I don't know much about those areas.
The two racial incidents you mentioned in Cumberland were as follows.

1. A black girl whose family transplanted from DC was teasing and tormenting a mentally disabled white child at the local high school. After cutting in the lunch line in front of this child and calling him a "stupid retard", he called her a n*gg*r. Just two kids being as nasty with each other as they knew how. The student that started the trouble was the black girl, and of course she and her family ran right to the downstate media complaining of "racism."

Moral of the story - it is OK to call white kids "retards" and torment them, it isn't OK for the white kid to return the favor. Hopefully the lesson was learned.

2. A D.C. high school football team came up here to play. The momentum of the game was turning against them, they were being pushed around on the line of scrimmage and the Cumberland school was driving to take the lead. So, one of the kids from the DC school claims he was called the N-word, and the D.C team leaves the field and goes home in the middle of the game. Our high schools play multiple downstate teams that are nearly entirely black every year and this is kind of accusation had never been leveled.

The local high school launched an investigation of their own and asked, almost to the point of demanding, that the D.C. sports board launch an investigation of their own. The local investigation spoke to all the players on the Cumberland team, and all of them, even the black players (and yes there are minorities living in Cumberland) heard no slur ever uttered. In fact, their stories were that the opposite was happening. They were being called "honkeys" and one student-athlete was told he was going to the black boy's b*tch for the rest of the game.

The D.C. school and athletic board refused investigate, and refused to comment on the matter at all from there after.

Moral of story - It is easier to cry racism and then run away then it is to try and face the fact that the story was either a lie, or once again, two kids getting ugly with each other.

Our city gets a lot of flack in the downstate media for these kinds of incidents because our community doesn't play the PC game. You know, community leaders making instant statements of regret and condemnation when a accusation is made (but not proven). No candlelight vigils pleading for remorse for 100s of years of racism, no long-winded white guilt speeches about how horrible our community is, no threats and promises to bring the perps to justice for their actions, etc.

Our community tried to ask questions, describe the situations as best we could, and requested help from the DC school in fixing the situation. All we seem to get is grief and bad PR for it.

Last edited by westsideboy; 02-19-2011 at 04:57 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2011, 07:24 PM
 
1,009 posts, read 1,852,903 times
Reputation: 1423
No name calling is appropriate on either side. But racism is racism. The N-word should not be part of the lexicon of a mentally disabled child. The child was not called a retard because he was white. I'm sure the black child had plenty of practice calling mentally-challenged black kids in DC "retard". To call a mentally challenged child a "retard" is a form of discrimination in and of itself (a hate crime if you will). From my understanding (once again information from the media) the issue wasn't with the exchange between the children. The Fort Hill principal handled that. When kids started wearing the Confederate flag and making threats to the black student the principal said it was the students first amendment rights to wear the flag. Ok. I think the problem in question here was when the students wearing Confederate paraphernalia began to organize into gangs and were threatening other minority students and apparently their parents. That is when the principal had to step in and ban Confederate paraphernalia.

The whole Dunbar racism cries were specious in and of themselves.
But it was the same "mob" mentality in the aftermath of the alleged incident that seemed to draw the news. The news really wasn't what was said (or wasn't said) between the players and the Dunbar coach was criticized for being a poor sport for pulling his team off of the field. From my recollection it was about the racial epithets that were screamed by the parents at the Dunbar players. And this wasn't just the Washington Post coverage, this was from the Cumberland Times-News as well. In this forum, I was advising a teacher about relocating. Once again, I have never heard of any academic issues with schools in Cumberland but a transplant may not want to exchange one environment with questionable administrative oversight with another.

The Cumberland community can easily say it has a rich history, was a prominent hub on the Underground Railroad, its Shanty Town was one of the few fully integrated areas in Maryland prior to (and perhaps even after) the Civil War, and never had any contentious administrative issues with busing or desegregation or hiring like those areas further downstate. Heck, In PG County there is actually reverse racism going on in the public school system. So to first deny that the incidents happened and then to actually label the victims as the antagonists is becoming a tired conservative fall back argument. I thought this to be a poignant editorial from a Fort Hill grad. If there is nothing negative going on then the Cumberland community doesn't have anything to explain to anyone. However, I just mentioned this because most Maryland school systems have NO stories like this and the very small Cumberland has a couple. Once again, no teacher looking to change jobs wants to exchange one set of issues for another.


Quote:
Originally Posted by westsideboy View Post
The two racial incidents you mentioned in, Cumberland were as follows.

1. A black girl whose family transplanted from DC was teasing and tormenting a mentally disabled white child at the local high school. After cutting in the lunch line in front of this child and calling him a "stupid retard", he called her a n*gg*r. Just two kids being as nasty with each other as they knew how. The student that started the trouble was the black girl, and of course she and her family ran right to the downstate media complaining of "racism."

Moral of the story - it is OK to call white kids "retards" and torment them, it isn't OK for the white kid to return the favor. Hopefully the lesson was learned.

2. A D.C. high school football team came up here to play. The momentum of the game was turning against them, they were being pushed around on the line of scrimmage and the Cumberland school was driving to take the lead. So, one of the kids from the DC school claims he was called the N-word, and the D.C team leaves the field and goes home in the middle of the game. Our high schools play multiple downstate teams that are nearly entirely black every year and this is kind of accusation had never been leveled.

The local high school launched an investigation of their own and asked, almost to the point of demanding, that the D.C. sports board launch an investigation of their own. The local investigation spoke to all the players on the Cumberland team, and all of them, even the black players (and yes there are minorities living in Cumberland) heard no slur ever uttered. In fact, their stories were that the opposite was happening. They were being called "honkeys" and one student-athlete was told he was going to the black boy's b*tch for the rest of the game.

The D.C. school and athletic board refused investigate, and refused to comment on the matter at all from there after.

Moral of story - It is easier to cry racism and then run away then it is to try and face the fact that the story was either a lie, or once again, two kids getting ugly with each other.

Our city gets a lot of flack in the downstate media for these kinds of incidents because our community doesn't play the PC game. You know, community leaders making instant statements of regret and condemnation when a accusation is made (but not proven). No candlelight vigils pleading for remorse for 100s of years of racism, no long-winded white guilt speeches about how horrible our community is, no threats and promises to bring the perps to justice for their actions, etc.

Our community tried to ask questions, describe the situations as best we could, and requested help from the DC school in fixing the situation. All we seem to get is grief and bad PR for it.

Last edited by Steelers10; 02-19-2011 at 07:39 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2011, 08:42 PM
 
Location: Cumberland
4,566 posts, read 7,640,867 times
Reputation: 2790
The downstate media is quick to jump on any perceived racism up here because it fits in perfectly with their stereotypes about our community. They publish one every 18 months or so whether they need to or not generally of the following sort:

Strange Distant Hillbilly Community bastion of bad whites

They then find the most degenerate local rednecks they can find to interview and publish their comments.

Our community doesn't think the same way you guys do. Downstate it instantly becomes a "race" issue, up here it was a transplant kid with a horrible attitude harrassing a poor disabled kid. Do you think the community would not come together to defend him? That is really my issue with the "race" question. Slur a white person, call them a tard, do what you will, it is forgiveable, but call someone the "n-word" and the world stops on its orbit. Most of the stuff about the racists coming out of the woodwork over this was invented by the parents of this girl.

Was there some intimidation at Fort Hill. Yes, obviously, and it came from both sides. But again, it is OK, or at least forgiveable when a black girl intimidates a disabled white child, but should that intimidation be returned in kind, its time to "call in the FBI" as the link you posted indicated.

BTW, the writer of that story in the Time-News is a Class A doucebag from downstate that hates this area, and was always chomping at the bit to create chaos, and write stories that give our home a black eye. He got fired because of other stories where he ignored facts and instead wrote an editorial under the guise of news.

Yes, the Rebel flag got banned at Fort Hill, because it became a ralling point for the locals that weren't going to sit back and let some outsider tease and bully their friend and then cry when she got called a name back. Was it the right symbol to use? Hell no, and the principal made the right decision to ban it.

But the community, nor those kids should be castigated to a standard of PC from downstate. Most of those kids that flew the rebel flag did so before the incident on their trucks. There are Southerns, sons and daughters of Southern vets living in County.

About the 2nd football incident, it was all bunk. None of it was proven, neither the allegations of the kids or the parents leaving the game. I saw the game on tape, and there was no danger, just booing as the team left the field early. Our school system bent over backwards trying to get the DC sports board to investigate and discuss the issue to come to resolution, they not only refused, they ceased all contact with Fort Hill. Certainly not the actions of people who had a strong case to present.

Last edited by westsideboy; 02-19-2011 at 09:32 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2011, 08:52 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
32,176 posts, read 39,325,128 times
Reputation: 40695
The high school in PG where I am sends its football team to Fort Hill nearly every year, in fact it went a couple weeks after the mentioned incident. Not once have any of our team members ever reported an incident with either the team or fans. In fact our kids like the trip and many end up going to Frostburg for college or across the river to one of the WVA schools.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Options
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2016 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Maryland
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top