Howard County used to be ranked #1 wealthiest county

[NJ2MDdude]

I've noticed that home values outside of Columbia have not decreased substantially since the RE bubble burst several years ago (or at least that's my perception). Are home sellers in HoCo in denial or can the market actually support the current asking prices of the homes on sale?

Given the recession and the return of traditional methods of determining how much one can borrow, I thought home prices should've tumbled by now.

[ChosenGSR]

Originally Posted by NJ2MDdude

I've noticed that home values outside of Columbia have not decreased substantially since the RE bubble burst several years ago (or at least that's my perception). Are home sellers in HoCo in denial or can the market actually support the current asking prices of the homes on sale?

Given the recession and the return of traditional methods of determining how much one can borrow, I thought home prices should've tumbled by now.

I think they have fallen, but not as much as other areas. Supply and demand is always in play. Checkout zillow.com and it'll definitely show price depreciation.

[cpterp]

Howard County is actually the 3rd wealthiest county now. Loudon and Fairfax Counties in Northern Virginia are 1st and 2nd respectively.

2007 CB data released last year
The top 10 counties with populations >250,000:

1. Loudoun County, Virginia
2. Fairfax County, Virginia
3. Howard County, Maryland
4. Somerset County, New Jersey
5. Morris County, New Jersey
6. Douglas County, Colorado
7. Montgomery County, Maryland
8. Nassau County, New York
9. Prince William County, Virginia
10. Santa Clara County, California

The top 10 counties with populations 65,000-250,000:

1. Hunterdon County, New Jersey
2. Calvert County, Maryland
3. Arlington County, Virginia
4. Stafford County, Virginia
5. Fauquier County, Virginia
6. Forsyth County, Georgia
7. Putnam County, New York
8. Marin County, California
9. Charles County, Maryland
10. Carroll County, Maryland

Obviously Maryland and Northern Virginia dominate the rankings.

Originally Posted by TuborgP

What I don't accept is that Maryland is truly the wealthiest state in the country. It is so expensive that salaries are inflated.

I don't find it hard to accept. The state also has the lowest poverty rate, the highest median income, and the best educated residents in the country. If you look at the second and third wealthiest state (New Jersey and Connecticut) you'll see that the cost-of-living in those states is also very high. In fact property taxes in Northern New Jersey are higher than they are in Montgomery County. Not to mention a 7% sales tax (compared to MD's 6%). Same thing goes for Connecticut and the states ranked 5th, 6th, and 7th (Hawaii, New Hampshire, and Massachusetts). Alaska which is ranked 4th, is probably the only exception.

[Chris-Kim]

The average household income published by the government is misleading because the number doesn't necessarily include big bonuses.

I've moved from Westerchester, NY to Howard, MD. There is no way that the wealth of Howard is even close to that of Westchester or Fairfield, CT, where many people work in the financial sector. A typical mid-level guy at WS receives a salary of $150 or so. His bonus, in a decent year, can easily exceed $500k. I know a guy at Citi, whose 2006 salary was $150k. His bonus was reportedly bigger than $10M.

[cpterp]

Originally Posted by Chris-Kim

The average household income published by the government is misleading because the number doesn't necessarily include big bonuses.

I've moved from Westerchester, NY to Howard, MD. There is no way that the wealth of Howard is even close to that of Westchester or Fairfield, CT, where many people work in the financial sector. A typical mid-level guy at WS receives a salary of $150 or so. His bonus, in a decent year, can easily exceed $500k. I know a guy at Citi, whose 2006 salary was $150k. His bonus was reportedly bigger than $10M.

The government numbers (particularly the median income data which are used to rank the counties) aren't misleading. Fairfield County includes some large low-income cities such as Bridgeport. Howard County is virtually devoid of large low-income communities. The federal government pays its employees very well since they don't have to worry about minimizing costs to turn a profit, and is a primary reason nearly all of the wealthiest counties are in Maryland and Northern Virginia. Also, there are some large financial institutions in Baltimore such as M&T/Provident Bank, Legg Mason, T. Rowe Price etc.

[TuborgP]

Originally Posted by cpterp

Howard County is actually the 3rd wealthiest county now. Loudon and Fairfax Counties in Northern Virginia are 1st and 2nd respectively.

2007 CB data released last year
The top 10 counties with populations >250,000:

1. Loudoun County, Virginia
2. Fairfax County, Virginia
3. Howard County, Maryland
4. Somerset County, New Jersey
5. Morris County, New Jersey
6. Douglas County, Colorado
7. Montgomery County, Maryland
8. Nassau County, New York
9. Prince William County, Virginia
10. Santa Clara County, California

The top 10 counties with populations 65,000-250,000:

1. Hunterdon County, New Jersey
2. Calvert County, Maryland
3. Arlington County, Virginia
4. Stafford County, Virginia
5. Fauquier County, Virginia
6. Forsyth County, Georgia
7. Putnam County, New York
8. Marin County, California
9. Charles County, Maryland
10. Carroll County, Maryland

Obviously Maryland and Northern Virginia dominate the rankings.



I don't find it hard to accept. The state also has the lowest poverty rate, the highest median income, and the best educated residents in the country. If you look at the second and third wealthiest state (New Jersey and Connecticut) you'll see that the cost-of-living in those states is also very high. In fact property taxes in Northern New Jersey are higher than they are in Montgomery County. Not to mention a 7% sales tax (compared to MD's 6%). Same thing goes for Connecticut and the states ranked 5th, 6th, and 7th (Hawaii, New Hampshire, and Massachusetts). Alaska which is ranked 4th, is probably the only exception.

Maryland has a tremendous gap between the upper and lower quartile of income. The wealth is not spread out across the population and it would be interesting to see where the wealthier counties stand when it comes to disposable income per capita.

[cpterp]

Originally Posted by TuborgP

Maryland has a tremendous gap between the upper and lower quartile of income. The wealth is not spread out across the population and it would be interesting to see where the wealthier counties stand when it comes to disposable income per capita.

The gap is far too large I agree, but small compared to other states (California for instance). This is one of the reasons Maryland is the wealthiest states by median income and not by per capita income (which is skewed by large or small numbers). The federal government also lends a hand in reducing the gap since wages are more equal than in the private sector.

[aneftp]

Originally Posted by NJ2MDdude

I've noticed that home values outside of Columbia have not decreased substantially since the RE bubble burst several years ago (or at least that's my perception). Are home sellers in HoCo in denial or can the market actually support the current asking prices of the homes on sale?

Given the recession and the return of traditional methods of determining how much one can borrow, I thought home prices should've tumbled by now.

Prices have fallen around 10%. Not like 20-40% like some parts of Florida or Arizona, Las Vegas.

But a 10% decrease on a 600k property plus 6% real estate comissiom to sell is going to cost the homeowner a lot.

That's why I suspect a lot of homeowners who brought at peak 2005-2007 in Howard County are holding off putting their homes for sales. Those who purchased before 2004 had a signifcant gain in values so they can unload if needed.

Homes selling for less than $350k are moving well especially with the 8k tax credit.

I had realtor from remax run a anaylsis of home sales and those in the lower price ranges are selling very well. The homes higher than 700k are not moving and just sitting on the market. Probably has to do with the jumbo loan markets and lots of move up buyers unable to sell their own homes.