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Yup, Massachusetts is pretty good for the highly educated, and even then they mostly live like the middle class. But imagine if you have no degree here or just a college degree from a noname school. It's hard to get by here.
Well, I would think (and hope) that most places are pretty good for the highly educated.
Imagine if I had no degree or just a college degree from a no name school anywhere else...would I be better off? Maybe...maybe not.
And an of course the right advanced degree can help but it's more than that. I don't think one needs an advanced degree to do OK. I've never really sat around thinking "I can work but nobody will hire me". My attitude has always been a pretty anxious one with the thought of "I'd better learn to do and be someone who people need and like so they have a good reason to need to hire me". That separated me from the mob of people who think they should have jobs just because they are alive and want one, and put me into the smaller group of people who organizations/people need because we provide something valuable to them. It's not by any means all me though, my wife has been a bedrock of encouragement and confidence in who I am. Her support (and that of others) has been critical - it takes a village right?
As I grow older I tend to think it's less a where issue and more a who issue. Sure, there is definitely more opportunity in different areas but I think primarily it's the person. And remember that although I have an advanced degree, there are many here in MA who have advanced degrees from better institutions than me. It's not all about education.
MA seems fairly in between to me. No lack of Republican Governors have been elected here.
My preferred state, Wisconsin, has decidedly gone right wing in State politics and has had the expected reduction in quality of life issues.
What would be an example to you of an in between state? Maine?
Really? The Democrats have held a super majority in the legislature for years and years. When Romney was in office, he had very little power to do anything (because of the veto-proof majority). And as time goes on, the MA Democratic Party gets further and further to the left. A lot of them are pretty "out there". Most of our Republicans would be Democrats in other states, as they have many liberal views. Since Patrick got elected, it has been one-part rule on steroids. There is no debate or discourse. It's all "nothing to see here, move along" and the only winners are the Beacon Hill elite and the welfare class. If MA is "in between", I would be terrified to see a place that is "left leaning".
Maine leans pretty far left as well. A more "in between state" might be NH. Perhaps PA, VA, OH, MO, CO? All the usual "swing states". MA and RI are about as far to the left as you get outside of Sweden.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,937 posts, read 36,943,649 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by massnative71
Really? The Democrats have held a super majority in the legislature for years and years. When Romney was in office, he had very little power to do anything (because of the veto-proof majority). And as time goes on, the MA Democratic Party gets further and further to the left. A lot of them are pretty "out there". Most of our Republicans would be Democrats in other states, as they have many liberal views. Since Patrick got elected, it has been one-part rule on steroids. There is no debate or discourse. It's all "nothing to see here, move along" and the only winners are the Beacon Hill elite and the welfare class. If MA is "in between", I would be terrified to see a place that is "left leaning".
Maine leans pretty far left as well. A more "in between state" might be NH. Perhaps PA, VA, OH, MO, CO? All the usual "swing states". MA and RI are about as far to the left as you get outside of Sweden.
We obviously see things different. Our Democrats of today are really center right Republicans. All of U.S. politics have taken a hard shift to the right. Heck, Reagan wouldn't be conservative enough for Reps nowadays.
Columbus OH and Dayton are ok. I could deal with Columbus.
NH? Ugh, if it wasn't for CT, NH would be the worst state around... Crazy libertarian crud that makes ZERO sense in the real world.
NH? Ugh, if it wasn't for CT, NH would be the worst state around... Crazy libertarian crud that makes ZERO sense in the real world.
What???
Because they sell fireworks and respect the 2nd Amendment? Are you referring to the "Free Staters" (a small fringe group that just happens to be located there)? "Live Free or Die" is a thing of the past, if anything NH has become too polluted by the MA Disease over the years. It's still probably the most sane state around here though, I always feel my blood pressure drop when crossing the border. In NE, it's second only to ME in natural beauty. The stress is lower, generally the people are nicer (than MA). Could just be me though.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,937 posts, read 36,943,649 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by massnative71
What???
Because they sell fireworks and respect the 2nd Amendment? Are you referring to the "Free Staters" (a small fringe group that just happens to be located there)? "Live Free or Die" is a thing of the past, if anything NH has become too polluted by the MA Disease over the years. It's still probably the most sane state around here though, I always feel my blood pressure drop when crossing the border. In NE, it's second only to ME in natural beauty. The stress is lower, generally the people are nicer (than MA). Could just be me though.
Well, maybe I've been skewed by the NH people I've met over the years. Respect the 2nd amendment? LOL. I don't like the cities there much though. Just preference.
I'll take VT over NH any day, myself. Maine is lovely though.
Well, I would think (and hope) that most places are pretty good for the highly educated.
Imagine if I had no degree or just a college degree from a no name school anywhere else...would I be better off? Maybe...maybe not.
And an of course the right advanced degree can help but it's more than that. I don't think one needs an advanced degree to do OK. I've never really sat around thinking "I can work but nobody will hire me". My attitude has always been a pretty anxious one with the thought of "I'd better learn to do and be someone who people need and like so they have a good reason to need to hire me". That separated me from the mob of people who think they should have jobs just because they are alive and want one, and put me into the smaller group of people who organizations/people need because we provide something valuable to them. It's not by any means all me though, my wife has been a bedrock of encouragement and confidence in who I am. Her support (and that of others) has been critical - it takes a village right?
As I grow older I tend to think it's less a where issue and more a who issue. Sure, there is definitely more opportunity in different areas but I think primarily it's the person. And remember that although I have an advanced degree, there are many here in MA who have advanced degrees from better institutions than me. It's not all about education.
Uh, have a cookie? This isn't about you. This is about the fact that the economy of Massachusetts is geared towards the highly educated and the few lucky union members with family connections. The rest are kind of left in a post-industrial retail sales wasteland with incomes that cannot possibly afford the high COL here.
My wife and I are both physicians and we live a pretty middle class existence after decades of schooling. But I look at my relatives who aren't academically inclined and struggling to pay rent with roommates, and I worry. The person might be responsible greatly, but not everyone can be in the top 10% like Lake Wobegon.
A man approached the City Gates and asked the keeper "Where I live the people are disagreeable, the government is corrupt, the weather is awful, the politics are hideous and generally, I am so unhappy. What says you about the place you guard?" The Gatekeeper replies "Same here, sir, not a happy lout among us...I'd consider living someplace else where you can find people more like yourself." THE END.
It's a very unbalanced state. Boston and Metro vs everywhere else, but everywhere else is close enough that we all pay inflated real estate prices while working and middle class opportunity remains flat. Meanwhile our many decrepit mill towns still sport hefty population densities of suffering suckers left behind by the old economies. I'm vaguely proud to have found one of the few places a sucker like me can afford my own apartment without a throng of equally desparate roommies on a $40k salary - the "thriving" town of Orange, MA! Snoozeville
At least many other states have multiple vibrant metros instead of one that sucks the life out of everywhere else. TN has Memphis, Nashville, Chattanooga, Knoxville. OH has Columbus, Cincinnatti, Cleveland, etc. MA has Boston and its affluent burbs, which gets to smugly **** on the rest of the Commonwealth from Lawrence to Fall River to Fitchburg and Athol to Springfield and Pittsfield. Great.
There's a certain Boston centrism that seems to paralyze any investors from ever considering a place outside the Hub bubble for development of new commerce, despite a relatively highly educated workforce statewide.
We're not the only state like this (NY comes to mind) but it sure does suck for those of us who have worked hard, but grew up in, say, Fitchburg (ie prior to adulthood didn't realize that much of MA was becoming unfathomably filthy rich and calls all the shots), chased some ideals, got into college ponzi scheme loan debt, and not realized how far out of reach ever owning a home here will probably be in this wretchedly pleasant little state. Fitchburg to Orange - what socioeconomic mobility (LOL)! At least I'm not working retail!
This is about the fact that the economy of Massachusetts is geared towards the highly educated and the few lucky union members with family connections. The rest are kind of left in a post-industrial retail sales wasteland with incomes that cannot possibly afford the high COL here.
Oy vey. OK, ya got me...MA is geared towards the highly educated, so what? Does that mean there are no opportunities for those who are not? Very far from it. Besides, most any economy will reward the highly educated.
I don't care enough to look up the % of those with a higher degree but I could safely guess that it isn't the majority, let's go high and assume it's 20% though. What are those other 80% doing if they can't afford the COL? They are affording it in a literal sense right? They aren't all homeless or working retail sales type jobs? It just isn't as pleasant as those who have larger incomes. I don't see everyone without an advanced degree walking around in tattered clothing and sleeping under bridges. There are plenty who have a BA/BS and have great careers (even here!) - software engineers, nurses (and other medical allied professionals), accountants, engineers, the list goes on.
I guess my point all along was that it's more (not all, but definitely much more) about the person rather than the place. I made it in a variety of economies. And I didn't always have a grad degree and was doing OK before I got one - in a depressed part of the country where I started as an admin assistant on a temporary basis making peanuts (and I had a BS) and eventually made project manager (making good $) before leaving the company for grad school. It's about the person. One should shoulder their own situation, blaming an economy that is more geared towards the highly educated is an excuse. There are good careers in MA for those without a grad degree, plenty of them. And it's not like it's a piece of cake for those with grad degrees - I was and am competing with people who have similar educations and from better Uni's than me. My point again: it's about the person.
All that said, I agree with what many others said. The OP is clearly not happy here. OK, I have zero reason to be defensive about that. I personally think he should research other places where his life may be a better one and wish him luck in doing so. That's what we did and here we are. We were doing well in a depressed area, still decided to make a change for our own many reasons, and it was the right move (in some respects). Yes, the COL is better in many other places and may be better for him so he should do his own assessment, but making excuses about the MA economy not being conducive because he isn't among the top 10% isn't accurate or helpful IMO.
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