Brookline Multi-family, Housing Discrimination (lawyer, home, landlords)

[tamajane]

Originally Posted by jayrandom

Common Forms of Housing Discrimination - MassLegalHelp

I think you must have missed the half dozen posts where this was mentioned. The claim is that by offering the apartment through a broker that the landlord's right to refuse to rent to children disappears. It's not clear if that is true and no authoritative source has been provided to settle such a dispute.

Yes, it is here Massachusetts Commission Against Discrimination (MCAD) which the OP posted earlier.

It is an exception to that protection and the landlord should have done his research. The broker sounds like an idiot with a big mouth anyway who is not properly representing his client. Mistake 1) listing this rental with a broker, Mistake 2) Broker failing to show the property and yapping about roommates and families to a person inquiring about it. It was unprofessional of both so in that way, I don't empathize with them so much, although the regulations are tough on landlords. Still I think OP should just move on and find a suitable apartment.

Also, the laws are always changing and tightening, so at any time people who are already in the rental business can be blindsided by major expenses and jumping through hoops. Some of the newer laws are kind of crazy and damaging to landlords and renters.

[tikaram]

I agree that it is not a level playing field, and there is discrimination going on, however not in this particular case with a 2 unit house. There is more leeway for landlords who own 2-4 unit buildings, if landlord resides in one of the units. And it is understandable, IMHO. If apartment complex in question would be a bigger one (or much bigger one), than yes, totally get after them in terms of discrimination.
I think that OP is unhappy that this particular (very nice? and well priced? conveniently located?) unit is getting away from them, because landlord doesn't want them.
Even though I am parent myself (have 3 kids), I personally don't think that small time landlords are committing a crime when they don't want to have tenants with children. It's not only noise etc, but a huge liability as well. Would I be frustrated if that happened to me? You bet! Would I feel offended? Discriminated against? Nope. But it's me. Even if I "won" the unit through court, how would I live there, knowing that landlord doesn't like having my kids around?
I agree with what miu said earlier, it was my choice to have kids, and it is somebody else's choice not to have any of their own or even around.

On another note, I had friends looking for a rental, they had a 5 y.o. child. They just said their child is already 6...

[tikaram]

Originally Posted by tamajane

Yes, it is here Massachusetts Commission Against Discrimination (MCAD) which the OP posted earlier.

It is an exception to that protection and the landlord should have done his research. The broker sounds like an idiot with a big mouth anyway who is not properly representing his client. Mistake 1) listing this rental with a broker, Mistake 2) Broker failing to show the property and yapping about roommates and families to a person inquiring about it. It was unprofessional of both so in that way, I don't empathize with them so much, although the regulations are tough on landlords. Still I think OP should just move on and find a suitable apartment.

Also, the laws are always changing and tightening, so at any time people who are already in the rental business can be blindsided by major expenses and jumping through hoops. Some of the newer laws are kind of crazy and damaging to landlords and renters.

well said!
cant rep you again so I just publicly agree

[lexi12]

Originally Posted by tikaram

I agree that it is not a level playing field, and there is discrimination going on, however not in this particular case with a 2 unit house. There is more leeway for landlords who own 2-4 unit buildings, if landlord resides in one of the units. And it is understandable, IMHO. If apartment complex in question would be a bigger one (or much bigger one), than yes, totally get after them in terms of discrimination.
..

Interestingly, the complaint that I filed that ended up to Attorney General was about a 3 unit home and the landlord lived in the house. He used a broker to advertise.

[lexi12]

Originally Posted by miu

Interestingly enough, for us buying a two-family house in Newton was much cheaper than buying a single family or three-family house. we didn't make any profit on it. The monthly rent was only to defray the mortgage payments, building maintenance, and high property taxes on the whole property.

Renting out the unit allowed you to afford a larger mortgage and live in Newton with it's high property taxes, and you didn't have to work extra 20 hours/week to cover the difference. It allowed you to make the choice to live where you would otherwise could not afford to live. I would call that a profit, maybe not monetary but in other ways.

Originally Posted by miu

Anyway, I'm so tired of so many people crying victim and protected class. For some reason, they seem in the majority these days.

Well, I would be embarrassed to write that if I were you. Do you have the same attitude about disabled people, veterans with mental health issues because they were in combat to protect your right to complain about people crying victim, and people on section 8 housing, that you know nothing about?

[tribechamy]

Also, unless any of you sprang from the skull of Zeus fully grown, all of us have once been a protected class (children)

[tamajane]

Originally Posted by tribechamy

Also, unless any of you sprang from the skull of Zeus fully grown, all of us have once been a protected class (children)

No, some of us are just old. I remember when there were adults only apartment complexes, not limited to 55+, just no kids allowed.

[miu]

Originally Posted by lexi12

Renting out the unit allowed you to afford a larger mortgage and live in Newton with it's high property taxes, and you didn't have to work extra 20 hours/week to cover the difference. It allowed you to make the choice to live where you would otherwise could not afford to live. I would call that a profit, maybe not monetary but in other ways.

Actually, in the beginning it was a joint effort with my youngest sister. And the building was a "handyman special". Twenty one years ago, it was the cheapest option for a real estate purchase. Many times single family homes are generally priced higher than two and three-families. And at the time, three families were at a premium because the sellers figured that the next owner would turn them into condominiums and they wanted a piece of the action. Yes, my two-family went up in value, but honestly (and I've this before) I'd much rather the value not have risen since I wanted to just stay put in the house and not move. Plus, in the twenty-one years I've lived here, we've never ever used the Newton Public School system. So the bulk of our property taxes are spent on other people's children and paying off that stupid money pit that is the new Newton North High School.

And how did you know what my work weeks are? I frequently work six and seven days a week. I always have one main full time job and I am on call with several other companies. My car is 20 years old. I don't own a smartphone or a GPS for my car. But my buying power is increased by NOT having children that I didn't want anyway.

Well, I would be embarrassed to write that if I were you. Do you have the same attitude about disabled people, veterans with mental health issues because they were in combat to protect your right to complain about people crying victim, and people on section 8 housing, that you know nothing about?

I am not at all embarrassed to write what I did. In traditional Chinese culture, we turn to the family for support in times of hardship, and it would be an embarrassment to sign up for welfare or Section 8 housing. And if someone had a mental illness in our family, it's private and our own business and not anyone else's to deal with. And we wouldn't go demanding a business or landlord build handicap ramps for a relative. When I was five, my parents were so poor in NYC that for several months us kids slept on a mattress and they slept on the boxspring. Growing up in MA, my parents had a small furniture business that kept them working seven days a week. In the beginning, what my dad sold during store hours would be delivered that night by him in his van. When I was in high school, a few times I would go with him as his helper. His employees always had company health insurance. So I think that I know all about hard work, extra jobs and living frugally, even with kids.

In regards to Section 8 housing, well all the people I know on Section 8 are baby mommas with lots of personal dramas in their lives. What I really don't get is why they have several kids out of wedlock by the same guy floating in and out of their lives. Getting pregnant does not make a bad boy type guy want to marry the mother. And people without kids have great difficulty getting into the program. So yes, I have zero sympathy for baby mommas and the welfare and Section 8 programs.

As to war veteran's with mental health issues... where have I posted about that? If anything, in case I haven't said it yet, I do think that it's terrible that our government doesn't take care of our Vietnam vets better and resists acknowledging diagnoses of PTSD. Many homeless people are vets with mental illnesses and who don't want to live indoors. And I do have sympathy for them, but what does that have to do with my second unit in my Newton house? Do you want me to rent it it to a homeless vet? What does this have to do with the OP with her family and kids?

[lexi12]

Well, veterans (like children and families with children) are a protected class and you said that "many people cry victim and protected class". You seem to dismiss children as protected class and I was asking you about some of the other categories of protected class citizens, that might not be so obvious to everybody.

No reason to get defensive about your choices of how to live, where to live, and how you grew up. We all have different stories and cultural biases. What I am saying is that we need to pay attention to the dominant culture and the laws governing them (LEAD law!), regardless of where we come from. You make generalizations and dismiss other people's life stories without knowing much about it. To say "people on section 8 housing are baby mommas" - well, it might be true, but you don't know if those baby mommas grew up in abusive families, around drugs or childhood trauma, without any guidance and support from their parents. They might be doing their best, you don't know them so you can't judge. The government deemed them worthy of financial assistance, so that's that!

[lexi12]

Originally Posted by miu

And how did you know what my work weeks are?

I have no idea. But you're saying that you needed the extra income from renting to cover the mortgage and taxes. Had you not had a rental, you would have had to work more hours, no? I didn't say "you would have to work 20 hours". I said "EXTRA 20 hours". Rough approximation, I have no idea what you do and it's not relevant anyway.

But yeah, this thread now has nothing to do with the OP's question, I agree with you on that!