Another Prospective MA resident with questions! (Somerset, Swansea: for sale, homes, neighborhoods)

[Katrina91001]

Hi All,

I am considering moving to MA, and have a couple of questions for you locals. What is the property tax rate? Any opinions on the most desirable cities on the North Shore? I grew up in So. California, and would like to be near the water.

Also, what is the average class size for elementary school students, say fifth graders? I teach in East Los Angeles, and I love the kids, but I'm feeling really burned out. I'd like to teach in a system that works, and I noticed that MA has relatively higher test scores.

Thanks in advance for any info you can provide.

[professorsenator]

Originally Posted by Katrina91001

I am considering moving to MA, and have a couple of questions for you locals. What is the property tax rate?

Property taxes vary from town to town (and taxes are levied entirely by the city/town). A rough rule of thumb is that your annual property taxes will be about 1 to 1.5% of the market value of the house (i.e. taxes on a $400,000. house would be about $4000-6000.)

Also, don't forget about the dreaded excise tax--it is effectively a local property tax levied upon the value of your car. Higher value car = higher tax. The excise tax varies from town to town, and is probably the most despised tax in Mass. since it provides a disincentive to drive a nice, new car.

[Katrina91001]

Great! Thanks for that. I pay 1.25% here in Pasadena, so at least the taxes wouldn't be much more for property. Hmm, the excise tax explains why I didn't see as many nice cars when I visited last summer.

Any thoughts on why public school test scores in MA are better than other states? Do more children come from high SES backgrounds or does the system provide more for children in need? I appreciate your insight.

[holden125]

Originally Posted by Katrina91001

Great! Thanks for that. I pay 1.25% here in Pasadena, so at least the taxes wouldn't be much more for property. Hmm, the excise tax explains why I didn't see as many nice cars when I visited last summer.

Any thoughts on why public school test scores in MA are better than other states? Do more children come from high SES backgrounds or does the system provide more for children in need? I appreciate your insight.

The excise tax might play a part but the culture in Mass. is much less flashy and prone to conspicuous consumption than in some other places. Things are often understated here so I would not really go for that expensive of a car myself, excise tax or not. One thing you'll see a lot of is people who keep their old (pre-1988) white and green tags even beyond the point of legibility, mostly to show (1) yes, we've been here that long, and a lot longer; (2) there's no point getting fancy new license plates when this one works just fine.

On schools, Mass. has a lot of well-to-do towns with a highly educated population and a long tradition of valuing education, leading to higher scores in the aggregate, mostly due to SES backgrounds. The schools vary widely from town to town so the system is not always great for a lot of children in need in the less affluent districts, but there may be more in place to help kids who are having problems in school move forward in some of the more affluent districts.

With respect to your other question, it depends on how far you want to be from Boston. Closer in, nice N. Shore towns on the water are Swampscott and Marblehead, with Beverly, Manchester, Rockport further north. Newburyport is a small city/large town with a great historic downtown. A bit far for an easy commute to Boston, but if you're working in a school district closer to there it's a nice place.

[Katrina91001]

holden125,

Thanks for your reply. Yes, I lived in Needham for a couple of years back in the mid-1980s, so I have a little bit of a feel for MA attitudes. That's one of the aspects that attracts me to the area, but people are great here in CA, too.

Thanks for the info about desirable towns on the North Shore. Swampscott might be a possibility. I'm a little partial to Salem. What do you think? I have a distant relative in Lynn. He calls it, "Lynn, Lynn, the town of sin."

Do you happen to know what the limit is for elementary class size?

Thanks for your time. (You, too, Professor.)

[holden125]

There are great people everywhere, I was just saying that in the aggregate things happen elsewhere that would be frowned upon back in Mass. I am in NYC right now and see it every day, so I was thinking more of NY than California though some people in California do like their nice cars.

I like Salem a lot. It has some beautiful sections and some nice restaurants and bars downtown in addition to shopping and museum, but it generally gets passed over when naming nice north shore towns since there are some rough pockets and the schools are lower rated, etc. For that reason it's less desirable in terms of resale value if you buy something there; some of our posters here are big on the idea that you should buy what you can afford in a sought-after town since those places will be sought after regardless of the market, and there's a lot of truth in that. But someone could live quite happily in Salem.

There's more than sin in Lynn but there are some rough patches there too. The area near the beach isn't bad but too much of Lynn is bleak.

My issue with all of the North Shore towns is traffic and the lack of a direct and fast driving route to Boston. You can make it to Boston from Hopkinton almost more easily at rush hour than from Marblehead, and it's twice the distance. All the towns I named except Marblehead do have commuter rail stops, though.

I'm sorry, I don't know about class size since I don't yet have kids but I haven't been an elementary school student in over 15 years.

[Katrina91001]

Yes, you're right about that. We are partial to our cars here in L.A., but we spend a lot of time in them! tee hee Our public transportation system leaves something to be desired.

I didn't know that about Salem, but yes, location is everything with real estate. I did notice that it was a Title I district, however, which should have tipped me off. I didn't get that vibe when I visited the historic section last summer. Do you know if one can purchase a 3 bedroom single family home in those other towns for around $400,000? I know Marblehead is out of the question, but what about Swampscott, for instance?

[rc0018]

Wow - That's all a lot of information to be digesting.

Here's a scary thought. My wife may not be able to make it up with me on my house hunting trip, so I may be going solo to find a house. Ahhhh!

Another question/thought - We've been on Boston.com and looking at local MCAS score listings by district...are we splitting hairs by looking at MCAS scores as a metric/guideline as to the quality of school/district? In the effort to find totally objective data - Is there really that great a difference between a district with an average of 92 vs 87? We've also been looking at Greatschools.net, but now we're looking at a somewhat subjective opinion type poll of school districts. Yikes. I geuss the answer is somewhere in between...

[jayrandom]

Originally Posted by professorsenator

Property taxes vary from town to town (and taxes are levied entirely by the city/town). A rough rule of thumb is that your annual property taxes will be about 1 to 1.5% of the market value of the house (i.e. taxes on a $400,000. house would be about $4000-6000.)

Also, don't forget about the dreaded excise tax--it is effectively a local property tax levied upon the value of your car. Higher value car = higher tax. The excise tax varies from town to town, and is probably the most despised tax in Mass. since it provides a disincentive to drive a nice, new car.

The winters, the roads, and the crazy drivers also provide a strong disincentive to driving a nice, new car around here

[Katrina91001]

Hi rc0018,

You're absolutely correct to question if there is really a difference between test scores that deviate by a few points. It's not a big deal. Furthermore, test scores are not an indicator about the school's program quality per se as much as they are an indicator of the SES background of the children who attend the school. There's a direct correlation. As long as the schools seem decent, it's not going to make or break your child's education. If anything, make sure they still have art and music education, and are not spending an inordinate amount of time on test prep. I'm sure you've done the right things to set your children up for success, reading to them as youngsters and so forth. Relax and choose the town with the most appeal for you.