taxes better in NH or MA (Boston, Lowell: fit in, hair salon, real estate)

[Arbre12]

Hi, we're considering locating to somewhere close to Westford. Would it be cheaper to live around the border of NH or somewhere close to Westford?
We love rural country living, so it's no biggie to not live close to town,
thanks!

[katzenfreund]

It depends on where you work. If you work in MA, might as well live there, since otherwise you will just pay your income taxes in MA anyway, even if you live in NH. If you work in NH, or don't work at all, taxes in NH are lower, no income tax, higher property tax, but still cheaper even with all the taxes combined.

[Arbre12]

Ouch! Well, we're coming from Indiana, where, even though the taxes have gone up, they are 100& better than MA.. the taxes there are scary..... what else would we need to know, coming from a rural, christian community to somewhere in northern MA? Would farm-people like us feel out of place? We are planning on homeschooling our kids and I also speak French (to our children) for half the day... is that accepted there? The fact that I speak French here has huge negative connotations... yet I've read that people in MA are more educated where here, they're lucky to have a diploma. I have a BS in French and would never, ever be able get a job that fits my education level here. We are a strong christian family but believe in more of an multi-ethnic community, if that makes sense. I'll quit rambling for now... but would love to hear more replies,
Thanks

[Arbre12]

sorry, it's a BA.

[professorsenator]

Originally Posted by Arbre12

Ouch! Well, we're coming from Indiana, where, even though the taxes have gone up, they are 100& better than MA.. the taxes there are scary..... what else would we need to know, coming from a rural, christian community to somewhere in northern MA? Would farm-people like us feel out of place? We are planning on homeschooling our kids and I also speak French (to our children) for half the day... is that accepted there? The fact that I speak French here has huge negative connotations... yet I've read that people in MA are more educated where here, they're lucky to have a diploma. I have a BS in French and would never, ever be able get a job that fits my education level here. We are a strong christian family but believe in more of an multi-ethnic community, if that makes sense. I'll quit rambling for now... but would love to hear more replies,
Thanks

Most Boston 'burbs folks are live-and-let-live types. Speak French? Tres bien! That said, the evangelical/fundamental/conservative Christian community in Mass. is smaller compared to other parts of the country, and homeschooling (though it exists, of course) is quite rare. The predominant religion is Catholicism (with a large smattering of mainstream protestants) and the vast majority of people do not wear their religion on their sleeves. There is wide variance, of course, but most people here are not very devout.

Most multi ethnic communities in the state are pretty liberal, which means your home-schooling devout Christianity would probably stick out like a sore thumb. But Mass. is diverse enough that you could probably find a place to call home.

[wickedripeplum]

Like professorsenator said the strong Christian family thing (by which I also assume you mean you're Evangelical) is going to stick out way more in the land of Catholics than them being bilingual. I feel utterly unqualified to make recommendations what would be a good community for you that way. Perhaps you can contact someone at Grace Chapel which is really the only large Evangelical Church I can think of in eastern MA. Lexington itself seems like it would be too close to the city and probably too expensive for you though. Westford's not super far away, so maybe that's where you'll end up.

Westford by the way is lovely. I wouldn't really call it the country, especially compared most of the US, but it's a nice town. If you're so inclined it should be fairly easy to get involved in town government. And if the weather stays below freezing (and that's a big if) you can go skiing all the time in winter. It would be a totally fun and not Indiana thing to do.

As for homeschooling, I don't know if it matters to you (since you seem to have yourself well sorted out) but I know Massachusetts does have stricter homeschooling laws than New Hampshire. I had some contact with homeschooling support in the town I grew up in and while it wasn't outrageously uncommon to have kids homeschooled in lower grades almost all kids went to a regular high school. Which is to say that by 9th grade there were only 2 boys my age being homeschooled and by 11th there was only 1. My understanding was that pressure from the state was at least a factor in that decision. I have no idea what the situation in NH acually is, just that (to the surprise of absolutely no one) the guildelines are more leniant.

I think whether you choose Westford, or you end up in NH I think you'll find a much more cohesive towns in New England. Not because people are better or friendlier or anything, it's just they way they're set up. It's something miss in the midwestern suburbs I find myself in.

[litlux]

Based on what you have shared with us, you will likely find a better fit in New Hampshire which is pretty rural, and more like Indiana than Massachusetts.

[holden125]

Originally Posted by litlux

Based on what you have shared with us, you will likely find a better fit in New Hampshire which is pretty rural, and more like Indiana than Massachusetts.

In Massachusetts, at least the parts I've been in, it is the exact reverse of your situation in Indiana. Teaching the kids French will not stick out at all but being evangelical and home schooling will stick out more. I don't think anyone will have problems with it and be unwelcoming, but as people have said most in Mass. are pretty uncomfortable with wearing religion on one's sleeve, perhaps because we've moved pretty far from Puritan roots and look back on the Puritan intolerance as representing a negative aspect of the state's history. A deep aversion to overt religiousity is a main reason I wouldn't really want to live in the U.S. outside New England and NYC.

There might be less culture shock from secular liberals in NH or western Mass. I know people who are pretty strongly Christian who live in Buckland, near Shelburne Falls. The area is rural and very pretty, and the village of Shelburne Falls is pretty (though small). They have the Bridge of Flowers there which is nice to check out. Anyway, that family feels just fine out there and that is generally the most conservative or religious part of the state.

Due to migration from Quebec over time there is something of a French twist to some parts of New England. Not to say that people walk around speaking French, which they don't, but the signs on the highway entering New Hampshire say "Bienvenue" and there are a lot of French surnames in parts of NH, Maine, Rhode Island, and Mass as well (Lowell, etc.).

[holden125]

Originally Posted by Arbre12

Ouch! Well, we're coming from Indiana, where, even though the taxes have gone up, they are 100& better than MA.. the taxes there are scary.....

I frankly don't understand the way this idea persists but maybe that's because I live in New York City right now, where taxes are much higher than in Massachusetts. According to this website, people making $30,000, $50,000, and $70,000 take home in Massachusetts within $50 a month or so of what they take home in Indiana.

PaycheckCity.com - Paycheck Calculator

I personally bring home many hundreds less every month living in New York City than I would at the same taxable income level in Massachusetts.

If you own real estate, property taxes in some parts of Massachusetts (especially affluent towns closer to Boston) are probably higher than in Indiana, but even they seem like a steal to me compared to the NY area. And property taxes for a small house in any town with decent schools within an hour/90 minutes of NYC seem to start at $10,000 and get up to $15,000 or over $20,000 very quickly.

Just wanted to say that despite grumbling from some I think "Taxachusetts" is an outdated idea.

[CityGirl52]

It's not uncommon to home school in New England. There's just not a whole lot of it going on down near downtown Boston, that's all. As one of the previous posters mentioned? There's a huge huge population of Catholics, Protestants, Methodists, Baptists etc...especially the further out of the Boston area you go. TONS of various religions and I never really knew there were so many until I moved out of the Boston area! I always thought all through the years every one was either Catholic, Protestant or Baptist! I never knew any Methodists before in my entire life, how's that one for you! Now I know some though, after all these years! AND I found out through a couple of them, that are really good friends of mine to this day, that a lot of them in their congregation think that all Catholic schools are like a "cult" or something and they'd never send their kids to one! Well, I couldn't stop laughing when I heard that one, we went all through the years and we survived it all! What a hoot that was hearing that one. I really in all honesty thought in this day and age, in our society and life that we lead in America that people would have gotten beyond that kind of talk so it was hysterical and it was said in all seriousness; that's what we couldn't stop laughing about when we were told this fallacy! Also, one time my mother was in a hair salon in southern NH and the woman having her hair done next to her said to her, oh yes now I know who you are, you're the "Catholic Lady" that lives near me, "NOW I know who you are?" My mother turned to her with her serious, straight face on and said "Why, do I have a cross over my door or out on the lawn or something?" She couldn't believe her ears with what she was hearing, because she never had that happen in all her years on this earth down around the Boston area, you'd never hear that type of a comment! The woman we found out afterwards, guess what? She was a Methodist! So of course I told my Methodist friends THAT one! Too funny to hear that type of a comment!

I have to tell you, I know of one family living right IN Boston that home schooled through the years, now they're in college and it definitely paid off for them. Do you know that quite a lot of the Ivy league schools want the home schooled kids to apply to their colleges? They want these kids like you wouldn't believe; because they're so well taught. So, if I were you? I'd keep up the good work, because somethings certainly being done right. You have to make sure you follow the regulations and laws that go with home schooling, evidently. Like one of the previous posters mentioned? Each state has different requirements with it, so that's about the only thing you have to be pretty concerned with and I think it's every single year they require certification or every couple of years, just the same way as the school teachers, if I'm not mistaken.

There's a couple of other families that I am related to distantly that home schooled their kids, one lives in upstate New York (farm country AND they have a farm, by the way!) and the other one lives in rural Connecticut in the northeast corner of the state. All are such good kids and very well behaved, and each and every one of them were/are home schooled. We're sure, that in NH near us, our next door (1/4th of a mile of woods separating us, mind you!) neighbor with 6 kids home schooled for a long time when these kids were all younger. Now they're older and they're in private high schools and colleges, so it's another case where it paid off extremely well. So it's whatever "floats your boat" with it all I guess, so remember that!

I just wanted to make sure you knew that upstate New York and rural parts of Connecticut there is definitely home schooling and tons of Christian families through out that region of the country from what my cousins kids have told us about it all, that's where they settled down and are quite content living there with their lifestyles. Also I wanted to make sure you knew that Christian families are living right next door to all of us and right down the road from every single one of us without any of us even realizing or knowing this, some times! Take me for instance, I didn't even realize that family right next door to us in NH home schooled, until years later! Probably because I don't have kids, where members of my family & every one around here with kids knew right away! You know how? Because the kids weren't getting on and off the bus when all the other kids in the neighborhood were! So being a parent you would be more observant of those type of things! I'll tell you, I certainly didn't care or know it at all, where I don't have kids, that's for darn sure! So come on up to New England, we welcome you with open arms. I know you're going to really enjoy living here, no matter where you live, but I think you'd be better off either in one of the states mentioned here above or NH or may be the western part of the state, out in the Berkshires? Check it out to see what you think. I'll tell you, it's absolutely beautiful out by Williamstown and Shelburne where one of the previous posters mentioned! We were there a few years ago, we spent Thanksgiving in Connecticut's Litchfield country area (that northeast corner of the state!) and couldn't believe the stunning "Mohawk Trail! When you come here to explore where you're going to live? You have to make sure you check out that Mohawk Trail, it's awesome all through there. Wait till you see that region of Massachusetts:

Berkshires Official Travel Planner-Western Massachusetts-Berkshire County Vacations

I was never out there until I moved to New Hampshire and when we drove through there? I really, seriously thought I was up in the White Mountains or something, it was absolutely beautiful through there, especially in the Fall, it's just SO awesome being out that way!

I thought about moving to another part of the country and I toss it around and toss it around back and forth all the time, as I'm probably going to make a move eventually any way. BUT, as Holden125 mentioned, and he hit the nail right on the head with his post; and I'm going to make sure I click on his post again to give him a compliment about it, by the way! See I also was never one to wear my religion on my sleeve either, that's a good way of putting it; and it's just SO SO weird to me and my family & close friends, when people bring that stuff up! Because it's just not done at all and it actually never was through the years around here that I know of. It's extremely "uncouth" or something to me, I don't know, I just find it so weird, always remember, religion and politics are a no no at group gatherings, it's just not a good idea, there's way too many view points with these two subjects! My previous comments above about what my mother went through and all that; in the hair salon, with that one particular incident? We'll never get over that comment in our family! AND, that only happened right in southern NH about 40 to 50 miles out of Boston; where you would just never hear that type of talk going on! EVER! So what, pray tell, would the rest of the country be like, out there? Well thank you very much, but NO thank you! I'll stick with my roots, my heritage, my values and respect for people right here in New England and the Boston area! Where I was raised a Catholic all my life? I really really like New England, I'm realizing this fact more and more as I'm living and breathing on this lovely earth we have here AND especially being around the greater Boston area and now of course, southern NH, (but I'd like to be a little more closer to the City eventually!) I doubt if I'd be happy living in another part of the country at all, so now I'm giving up on that thought process for a while. I think I'd really miss the 4 seasons, friends, family. It's a huge decision, I give you guys a LOT of credit for picking up and going. Remember, the pioneers did it, so I guess every one in this day and age can pick up and go as well!

For you moving here? I think you're going to really really enjoy our 4 seasons. Give it a couple of years though, be patient with it all!
Also, before I forget, one of my really good friends from work is from Terre Haute, Indiana and moved up here, she's not in to religion at all, neither were the rest of them in her family. The brother & sister moved here eventually too, then another sister followed them; THEN a few years after that, both their parents came up to live near them all. They LOVE it up here, then they all met their various spouses, bought their houses, had the kids and settled in just fine. It took a couple of years for each one of them, but they did it, now they wouldn't move back at all, if you paid them. They've been here now for over 15 years.

I really think too, if you got in touch with other Christian Church members that you hang out with, that they might be able to direct you to where you might enjoy living in New England. I just wanted you to see that there's definitely Christians living amongst the flock, even up here in New England!

Good luck wherever you settle down, I know you'll enjoy New England, keep an open mind with it all that's all you have to remember to do and you'll survive it, I'm sure. I think it could be like a little culture shock at first for you guys coming from another part of the country, but once you settle in? and once you get to know different people, then you'll start to understand where we're all coming from up through here, it takes all types remember! Yet, that's life in a nutshell, for all of us these days everywhere!

Also Arbre12, YES speak & learn French as much as you can, the more languages your kids learn and can speak? The better off they will be with jobs, college and all around well being; especially for their future careers, always remember that and don't ever ever lose that quest and don't ever ever let any one tell you different because it's NOT intelligent on THEIR part to come out with comments like that, they're the ones losing out, NOT you or your kids. Education IS important in New England and it always was #1 here, no matter what part or area of New England you decide to live in and also there will be chances and many many opportunities for you to get your family right up to Quebec, Canada where fluent French is spoken. It's only about a 7 hour drive up from Massachusetts and it'll be a wonderful opportunity and a fun trip some day with your family from here, we've all done it at least once, some of us more often than that. Montreal is right over the border of Vermont, not a bad drive at all, straight run up I-89 and before you know it you're there. Oh I guess you need a passport now, so remember that!

I personally think taxes end up equaling out to be the same in the end with all the expenses you have with a home, and it's no matter what state you live in; and that's the bottom line I think. YES, the car insurance is cheaper in NH, there's no doubt about that. My 6 cyclinder SUV is considered a station wagon in NH with my insurance company, so therefore my insurance was cut like you wouldn't believe, when I first bought this rig, I thought for sure I'd be paying at least 1500 and it's only 700 a year, not bad considering I paid close to 2000 in Boston! It definitely was close to double in Mass. YES, the property tax is definitely higher in various towns in NH and notice I said in various towns in NH because it depends on exactly what town you decide to live in, some are more expensive than others, some are nicer than others don't forget, but that's the case in Mass. too and it always was like that down there. So it's not anything new, just the facts with how it is to living through here. It all depends on what type of property you want to live in and where you want it to be located, that's your big decision when you get here. I'm on the seacoast, our taxes are considered high, yet one of my brothers is living 20 minutes from us and there property tax in their town is MORE than ours. You know why? There's more industry in MY town than theres, so our towns paying less. That's all we can figure out, any way with it, may be I'm wrong, and taking a wild guess with it, but the towns with industry, definitely pay a little less than the towns that don't have any at all...

Just my two cents...