That'll show them! (MA state trooper scandal) (Boston: price, law)

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by tysmith95

Bouncers at nightclubs or strip clubs is the first thing that comes to mind. But also private security or private investigators.

Not even the same animal. That is like comparing a Subway sandwich artist to a chef in a nice restaurant, or a medical assistant/tech to a nurse or doctor. Almost anyone with a pulse can be a private security guard, although in some circumstances they do hold higher standards and I generally have respect for them all. I wouldn't want that job even if the pay was good.

But if that is best you can come up with, then you fall way short.

[GeePee]

Originally Posted by massnative71

Another thing that makes that difficult to quantify is the whole detail issue in Mass. As has been discussed to death on this forum, many if not most cops in MA pad their base salary with hours and hours of pretty easy detail work that is often not directly funded by the taxpayers. I personally am a fiscal conservative and don't feel the majority of them are necessary, but realistically a potential cop considers that when weighing the full compensation of the job. So while he/she may work their butt off earning that first 45-80k per/ year base salary, that is made up for by the tens of thousands of dollars he/she will earn "staring at a manhole". So I guess they can be considered overpaid and underpaid at the same time.

these are some very good points.

[robr2]

Originally Posted by massnative71

Not totally sure what the answer is, but I get the impression from my contacts in the law enforcement world that it's a little of both. Most vacancies get a zillion applicants but most wind up not able to meet the qualifications, and of those who are left it is a real challenge to sift through and find suitable candidates. I hear of cases where they have exhausted the original list and have to hold an entire new exam. I know Boston in particular has had a very tough time attracting enough qualified applicants due to its residency requirements. Based on your theory, you might say they are overpaid since a vacancy rarely goes unfilled for a long length of time. But at the same time, there are federal law enforcement agencies that pay higher than most local police and are desperately scrambling to find people (and I believe that outside stuff like Border Patrol, those tend to be relatively cushy jobs compared with working as a street cop).

In Boston, the residency requirement may be an issue but there are other deterrents:

- policing can be a dangerous job and not many are willing to do it
- there's still a distrust between the majority minority population of the city and the majority white police force
- the preference for veterans - who are vastly white - often drops more qualified city residents of any race from consideration
-residency requirement for veterans is only 1 year versus all other applicants which is 3 years.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by massnative71

Another thing that makes that difficult to quantify is the whole detail issue in Mass. As has been discussed to death on this forum, many if not most cops in MA pad their base salary with hours and hours of pretty easy detail work that is often not directly funded by the taxpayers.

Oh pu-leeze. It's either directly funded by the taxpayer or funded by our monopoly utility bills which go up every year. My electric bill pays the cop 'guarding' the Eversource bucket truck.

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

Oh pu-leeze. It's either directly funded by the taxpayer or funded by our monopoly utility bills which go up every year. My electric bill pays the cop 'guarding' the Eversource bucket truck.

And private businesses. And big events...but that is all irrelevant to my main point, which is that extra detail money is certainly factored into the equation for those considering a career as a police officer. Knowing one could earn nothing beyond a $48k starting salary and maxing out at $85k, I think the job would be a much tougher sell. It doesn't really matter where the money comes from. Who knows, maybe that would be a good thing and attract only people who "really want the job" as opposed to those just looking to ride the gravy train (and potentially avoid scandals such as this). On the flip side, the town in ME I live literally pays cops around $30k/yr. The chief makes around $65k. A few of the cops are amazing, the rest I've seen...well let's just say I would NOT want towns in Eastern Mass. replicating those hiring standards. As somebody who leans to the right politically, I have to say that's one thing Mass. does right in that they take care of their public servants. Of course it's public tax dollars, and there are limits. But of all jobs that should be properly compensated and should be attracting the best people, it's those that do the vital things of keeping our communities safe, educating our kids, keeping the infrastructure sound...The scapegoating of public employees is a sickening and just not normal thing. Skyrocketing taxes and state/local budgets are not a result of overpaying our cops, firefighters and teachers. Get a clue. Neither are the electric and utility rates.

[johngolf]

Working a detail is different then not showing up and still getting paid. One is work. The other is theft.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by johngolf

Working a detail is different then not showing up and still getting paid. One is work. The other is theft.

It’s more racketeering than “work”.

[tysmith95]

Originally Posted by robr2

In Boston, the residency requirement may be an issue but there are other deterrents:

- policing can be a dangerous job and not many are willing to do it
- there's still a distrust between the majority minority population of the city and the majority white police force
- the preference for veterans - who are vastly white - often drops more qualified city residents of any race from consideration
-residency requirement for veterans is only 1 year versus all other applicants which is 3 years.

40% of active duty military members are minorities. 44% of Americans from 18-44 are minorities. So slightly underrepresented but not by much. And African Americans are pretty well represented in the military.

[robr2]

Originally Posted by tysmith95

40% of active duty military members are minorities. 44% of Americans from 18-44 are minorities. So slightly underrepresented but not by much. And African Americans are pretty well represented in the military.

But in Boston the percentage of police recruits are white - about 80% - especially former military applicants which tend to be mainly white. It dates back to 2004 when a federal judge overturned a 30 year old consent decree mandating hiring people of color. Since then, the number of non white applicants for the BPD has dropped dramatically and the police force is 66% white in a city that is 47% white.

As More Officers Reach Retirement, Boston's Police Force Is Becoming Less Diverse | WBUR News

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...SkO/story.html

[GeePee]

Originally Posted by robr2

But in Boston the percentage of police recruits are white - about 80% - especially former military applicants which tend to be mainly white. It dates back to 2004 when a federal judge overturned a 30 year old consent decree mandating hiring people of color. Since then, the number of non white applicants for the BPD has dropped dramatically and the police force is 66% white in a city that is 47% white.

As More Officers Reach Retirement, Boston's Police Force Is Becoming Less Diverse | WBUR News

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...SkO/story.html

Yes. I believe this had something to do with a few law suits? They were accepting lower test scores from minorities to fill the spots? Something about this i recall. If this is that case, then I am all for an un-biased testing structure.