Western Mass (Boston, Worcester, Framingham: jobs, hospital, housing)

[WestMass79]

The ones that have fallen fully (Springfield, Holyoke) are not coming back for decades, if ever.


If you are talking strictly about education xenos, I'd fully agree. The challenge to our public schools across the state is not easily fixed.

If you are talking about health and finances of the community, I'd disagree. Springfield is doing pretty well, considering the economy.

[Xenos]

That is good news about Springfield. Still, I would think that a couple more large employers would be needed to return the city to the relative prosperity of 40 years ago.

I don't have any idea where you go to get a decent-sized industry to invest into any medium-sized city. Maybe Columbia or Yale would relocate there once sea levels rise. Much as education is a state-wide crisis, industrial revival is a nation-wide crisis. Maybe by getting their affairs in order Springfield is laying the groundwork to be ready for the next opportunity.

[lprovo]

Originally Posted by DCtoMA

thanks so much for the comments, both good and not so good...this is potentially a big move, and we would obviously need to get out there again. we visited northampton a few months ago, and did not see many families, but it was school vacation time.

Is anyone aware of any pending development projects in western mass?

There are always development projects in Western Mass....could you be more specific?

Looking at the current census material that was just released for Western Mass, it's interesting to note the number of very small communities that are experiencing 8 - 10% growth, a sign that home buyers are looking at more rural lifestyles. The affordability of land and homes can tend to increase if you are willing to look outside the major communities of Longmeadow, Northampton, and Amherst, to name a few.

If you are seriously looking at moving into the area, you should begin receiving new listings from MLS listed properties as well as for-sale-by-owner properties. This will often include new developments.

[DCtoMA]

thanks for the info- I was really thinking about commercial development - the kinds of projects which would bring jobs and more money to the area. Thank to everyone for the lively and informative chat.

[VlyRoadKid]

Originally Posted by Bostonian08

Western Mass (west of Worcester) is a fairly depressed and IMO depressing place. Coming from DC, I'm not sure you understand how much more impoverished those more remote places in America are. Dive bars, mud trucks keggers and dirtbikes are primary in the culture. Ther's a reason why it's so much cheaper.

DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS PERSON: He/she clearly hates W.Mass and does not know anything about it! This description may be true of the Ozarks or Rockies or Alabama...but NOT a place Mark Twain deemed to be one of the most beautiful places in the world!

Springfield is no prize, but WORCESTER? Please! It''s a total DUMP! There's nothing to do and all the college kids party in Boston, Springfield or Amherst! I taught there for 4 yrs. and hated it. All my relatives live there and are dull as dishwater.

The best thing I ever did was attend UMass/Amherst (1970). I and dozens of my friends loved the Valley (as we call it) so much, we stayed, partied more, settled down & have raised families amidst stunning beauty.

There is SO much to do here, with all the colleges (UMass, Smith, Hampshire, Amherst, Mt.Holyoke, just to name a few); you've got concerts of all kinds, films, art exhibits, festivals, the Connecticut River, Berkshires in easy reach and Southern VT about 30-45 minutes away. There IS a reason why educated celebs like Bill Cosby decided to live here! There is also a thriving film & Graphics industry, FYI, Mr. I-Only-Love-Eastern-MA!

If you need cheaper housing, look NORTH. The towns of S. Deerfield, Williamsburg, Whately, Leyden and Bernardston are ALL beautiful, affordable and right next to I-91. Greenfield is quite nice too...much better than Springfield or the surrounding towns. Yes, the commute is roughly 45 mins. Greenfield, but if you lived in the VERY expensive Northampton or Amherst (a town I LOVE, btw), you'd have to fight an hour of traffic just to get ON 91!

I don't know WHERE the above poster gets the idea that this is hicksville, or that everyone drives pickups and has keggers all day! He/she has obviously never been here, or sped through on the way to someplace much less beautiful. Sure there are rednecks, esp. up in the hilltowns, but they are PALE imitations of the real ones in most of N. America. As my husband, who grew up outside Columbus OH, said, "You guys" (people in Mass) "don't even KNOW what a real redneck is!" In his town, their idea of a good time was shooting out rear windows in cars and no Blacks were allowed to live in town...seriously! You will NOT find that here!

Don't stick your head in the sand, like this person above...come out, visit for a week if you can and I guarantee, you'll find PLENTY to do and fall in love w/the scenery!

Sign me -- 38 happy years here and counting...

[VlyRoadKid]

Addendum re: Schools -- If you have kids, stay away from towns like Greenfield. Their schools are currently facing bankruptcy (not sure why). Amherst & S. Deerfield have good public schools, but let's face it:in the current economy, ALL schools are suffering to some degree. Kids are really getting the shaft, unless they're rich! Time to take some money away from the war and focus on our kids' future!

[in_newengland]

Originally Posted by Bostonian08
Western Mass (west of Worcester) is a fairly depressed and IMO depressing place. Coming from DC, I'm not sure you understand how much more impoverished those more remote places in America are. Dive bars, mud trucks keggers and dirtbikes are primary in the culture. Ther's a reason why it's so much cheaper.


I second the opinion that this person doesn't know a thing about Western MA.
Go out to Westhampton on rte 66 in the fall. Driving back towards Northampton, be sure not to miss the breathtaking view of hills as you come down into the valley again. Drive up rte 5/10 to Deerfield and walk down The Street and look at 18th century houses, picturesque from the outside and furnished with authentic period antiques. Drop into their museum, check out their gift shop, stay at their Inn.

Eat at the restaurant on top of Mt Tom near where the Log Cabin restaurant used to be and tell me you aren't taken aback by the gorgeous view. Climb up Mt Holyoke to the Summit House -- bring your camera.

Take in a concert at the Iron Horse or maybe you'd like to visit the Academy of Music where opera singer Jenny Lind proclaimed Northampton "the paradise of America."

Stroll through the Smith College art museum -- and it's FREE and easy to get to (unlike anything in Boston) and so is the parking. Oh, their magnificent arboretum is free too -- go and enjoy.

And, if you can't find enough international and exciting restaurants in Amherst or Northampton and you can't find enough culture with FIVE colleges -- and THREE of them are quite prominent (Smith, Mt Holyoke & Amherst) IF you still believe it's hicksville then you deserve to be banished to the previously mentioned area of Columbus Ohio.

[WestMass79]

Probably one of the most culturally and architecturally significant spaces in New England is the Museum Quadrangle in Springfield. Take a seat in the Suess sculpture garden in the inner courtyard, look around at the buildings, tour all the museums.....and I don't think you'll think Western Mass is all dive bars and trucker joints.

Springfield Museums

[Bostonian08]

Originally Posted by VlyRoadKid

DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS PERSON: He/she clearly hates W.Mass and does not know anything about it! This description may be true of the Ozarks or Rockies or Alabama...but NOT a place Mark Twain deemed to be one of the most beautiful places in the world!

Springfield is no prize, but WORCESTER? Please! It''s a total DUMP! There's nothing to do and all the college kids party in Boston, Springfield or Amherst! I taught there for 4 yrs. and hated it. All my relatives live there and are dull as dishwater.

For the record I went to high school in a Springfield suburb and lived in the area for 5 years. I don't hate Springfield or anyplace. I'm just telling you what I know having lived there for 5 years and comparing it to other places I have lived or visited in my extensive subsequent travel.

In 1950 Hartford CT was the most affluent city in the USA. Now it is the third poorest. A similar affliction befell Springfield, Albany (my home town), and the whole line of little cities along the I-90 in the snow belt and the rust belt. Having been south and west I'd take the Ozarks, AL, and certainly the Rockies over SPFD anyday.

I'll bet when Mark Twain lived there it was nicer than it is now, and if he can see what has become of it he would have also moved out by 1975.

Originally Posted by VlyRoadKid

There is SO much to do here...

After I graduated High School I got my own car and drove every nook and cranny of metro Springfield and Hartford looking for anything that to me could resemble culture or beauty or sophistication. Nothing. I went to every night club, scoured the Valley Advocate, nothing. Growing up in Albany, another culturally and economically graveyard, by the time I graduated high school living in SPFD, despite being a perennial optimist, I looked at the world as just a bleak hopeless dark age. Going to NYC or BOS to me was just out of the question since I assumed they would be just like ALB/BOS only bigger and badder.

So one day when my car died and I was walking through 2.5 feet of drifting snow looking for a job, I decided to take my credit card, catch a flight, and go find a job somewhere where the snow wasn't so deep. I landed in Miami that night, and the next day I had a job and place to live. Just a few months after living in MIA, I realized that I was right after all. There is culture, beauty, and sophistication in the world. Miami dazzled me with its gorgeous people, beaches, vibrant economy and endless amenities. What a contrast from stinking filthy ruins of SPFD.

Given that and my subsequent life in other cultured cities such as Boston and NYC, I can't imagine anyone from DC ever being happy in Western Mass. Some of the residents there think they are living in nirvana, but frankly I think everything from Worcester to Gary IN is a dump. The whole river based factory economy died in the eighties and there never was any truly developed culture. Sorry SPFD, the Suess Museum is not the Smithsonian.

Originally Posted by VlyRoadKid

If you need cheaper housing, look NORTH. The towns of S. Deerfield, Williamsburg, Whately, Leyden and Bernardston are ALL beautiful, affordable and right next to I-91. Greenfield is quite nice too...much better than Springfield or the surrounding towns. Yes, the commute is roughly 45 mins. Greenfield, but if you lived in the VERY expensive Northampton or Amherst (a town I LOVE, btw), you'd have to fight an hour of traffic just to get ON 91!

I would probably agree with the above. Although SPFD is a dump, the area up around Amherst is something of its own oasis built around UMass and the three other little colleges up there. If you must go to SPFD which I strongly advise against, this is the better spot.

Originally Posted by VlyRoadKid

I don't know WHERE the above poster gets the idea that this is hicksville, or that everyone drives pickups and has keggers all day! He/she has obviously never been here, or sped through on the way to someplace much less beautiful. Sure there are rednecks, esp. up in the hilltowns, but they are PALE imitations of the real ones in most of N. America. As my husband, who grew up outside Columbus OH, said, "You guys" (people in Mass) "don't even KNOW what a real redneck is!" In his town, their idea of a good time was shooting out rear windows in cars and no Blacks were allowed to live in town...seriously! You will NOT find that here!

Well now you know. I lived there for 5 years and escaped in '85 never to return except to visit family who still live there. I was at the keggers singing sweet home Alabama drinking whiskey, drove in the pickups and dirtbikes and doing all those things rednecks love to do. I searched for culture on Main St, State St, Dwight St, in Hartford, Chicopee, in the projects and in the woods. I found most of the culture was in the woods. I just had this nagging feeling there must be more to life than that.

Originally Posted by VlyRoadKid

Don't stick your head in the sand, like this person above...come out, visit for a week if you can and I guarantee, you'll find PLENTY to do and fall in love w/the scenery!

Sign me -- 38 happy years here and counting...

I agree - go out there. Explore Springfield thoroughly. See how comfy you feel driving down State St or walking around Main St. Drive all around and see if you can find all the wonderful things that I could not. Try every section of town - if you dare. I did. Sure, I like the scenery of the hills north of town, but don't expect to find fountains and monuments or expert Forest Park to remind you of Georgetown. And after you find SPFD is in fact not all that fabulous, come to Boston. Walk down Newbury St to the Public Garden so you can see the difference between night (SPFD) and day (Back Bay).

Sign me out - 23 years gone from there and never going back!

[WestMass79]

Originally Posted by Bostonian08

After I graduated High School I got my own car and drove every nook and cranny of metro Springfield and Hartford looking for anything that to me could resemble culture or beauty or sophistication. Nothing. I went to every night club, scoured the Valley Advocate, nothing.

I guess people have different definitions of culture, beauty, and sophistication. My opinion is those things aren't generally found in a nightclub, but to each their own. If you want good nightclubs, yes, Western Mass might not be for you. I personally wouldn't mix that up with culture though.

Originally Posted by Bostonian08

There is culture, beauty, and sophistication in the world. Miami dazzled me with its gorgeous people, beaches, vibrant economy and endless amenities. What a contrast from stinking filthy ruins of SPFD.

Yes, dazzling and vibrant it is. Not like poor Hartford (third poorest you mentioned?) or the stinking filthy ruins of Springfield - hilarious.

Miami #1 In Poverty In The U.S.A.

Whoops.

Originally Posted by Bostonian08

Sorry SPFD, the Suess Museum is not the Smithsonian.

Err yeah, it's not, because there's no such thing as the Seuss Museum. You are showing that you haven't been here in 25 years, and probably haven't been to the Quadrangle since, because you are too busy telling yourself how cultured you are by going to ladies night at the Roxy.

Originally Posted by Bostonian08

Sure, I like the scenery of the hills north of town, but don't expect to find fountains and monuments or expert Forest Park to remind you of Georgetown. And after you find SPFD is in fact not all that fabulous, come to Boston. Walk down Newbury St to the Public Garden so you can see the difference between night (SPFD) and day (Back Bay).

Sign me out - 23 years gone from there and never going back!

Are you really comparing Boston to Springfield? It's apples and oranges, two very different sized cities. Obviously Boston has more money, is a state capital, all of our tax dollars in western mass go to funding everything in Boston - it's not comparable. It's also not comparable how lovely Boston is for a day trip of shopping, but if you want to actually live anywhere near the swank areas mentioned above you'll pay $450,000 (if you are lucky) for a studio condo in a basement behind a dumpster, a condo that will probably be about the size of the third bedroom of my 2500 square foot house that I didn't pay half of the price for.

Yeah, enjoy Boston. I'll visit when I need to be a tourist, and keep my bank account and spacious home, thanks!