Mass stagnancy and limbo (Boston, Cambridge: sales, apartment, homes)

[meltinjohn]

I will start this post by saying that Massachusetts is stagnant for many reasons.
One reason is the fact that it is a nice state and has a bit more a close knit feel in certain communities but you just cant see a future here for yourself unless you plan to stay on benefits from the government. I find if your a responsible american in MA, your ****ed.
Its like this limbo like for instance. I moved back to MA a month ago. Billerica to be exact.
I am glad Im back to MA since South FL was hell, but at the same time, I cant really feel like I can build a future in MA due to the taxes since I want to be a responsible american, and the inflated home prices + The T has gone up and the fact that the winters might be iffy, but we'll see when that time comes, however I feel my calling is to move to the pacific northwest.
As far as taxes tho, your always gonna have em no matter where you are, but my main thing with taxes is, I want to support the things I am paying tax for. I am not a current taxpayer but down the line when I am, I am considering this.
NH is usually an escape point for those who feel they have little hope to make it in MA, but that also could be out for me due to the fact the winters are bad or even worse in say Manchester where I would normally consider, and theres even a farther ride to the T. Not really many options in that regard ntm, I feel this whole free state thing is hype since NH clearly does have restrictions and high tax in other areas.

My final summation, MA is nice, it has many real nice towns, but COL so high and public transportation is to the point it puts a damper on things.
Thoughts?

[DreamworksSKG]

Would you rather have no services?

At least with taxes on the wealthiest americans we have services.

The wealthiest people in society should give back more than they do ...half the wealthy people dont even pay their taxes because they think they dont have to.

its ridiculous that the burden gets shoved on the middle class and the wealthy got tax breaks under george Dumbya

I'd rather have a few taxes on the richest companies, and people -
and be able to have services

than have to keep cutting back services

I am doing just fine here in Mass. and I think if you don't like it go somewhere else

[neil0311]

Originally Posted by DreamworksSKG

At least with taxes on the wealthiest americans we have services.

The wealthiest people in society should give back more than they do ...half the wealthy people dont even pay their taxes because they think they dont have to.

its ridiculous that the burden gets shoved on the middle class and the wealthy got tax breaks

You need to get your facts straight. First, let's look at the local and state services in Massachusetts. As I mentioned in the sales tax thread, most towns in MA have little to no services. Volunteer Fire Departments, understaffed Police Departments, part time or no libraries, roads and bridges in terrible condition. The state spends oodles on projects for Boston like the big dig, and oodles for the poor and illegal aliens, but if you're just an ordinary taxpayer who lives outside of Rte 495, you get soaked.

As far as your erroneous rant about "the wealthy" and "tax breaks"....do you know who pays the taxes in this country? Not the so-called middle class, but the wealthy. You need to take a look at the facts here:

The Tax Foundation - Summary of Latest Federal Individual Income Tax Data

The top 5% of wage earners pays 60% or the federal income tax burden. The top 10% of wage earners, that's anyone who makes more than $109,000, pays nearly 71% of federal income taxes. In contrast, the bottom 50% of wage earners, those who make $31,000 or less, pay only 3% of federal income taxes.

Who do you think pays both federal and state taxes? The people who make and spend the money....the hated and dreaded "wealthy" people. Stop listening to the leftist propoganda and learn the facts.

[meltinjohn]

Originally Posted by DreamworksSKG

Would you rather have no services?

At least with taxes on the wealthiest americans we have services.

The wealthiest people in society should give back more than they do ...half the wealthy people dont even pay their taxes because they think they dont have to.

its ridiculous that the burden gets shoved on the middle class and the wealthy got tax breaks under george Dumbya

I'd rather have a few taxes on the richest companies, and people -
and be able to have services

than have to keep cutting back services

I am doing just fine here in Mass. and I think if you don't like it go somewhere else

I have to back Neil although I havent read the exact stats. I know that the middle class in MA fare pretty well and many are still keeping their homes and arent anywhere near getting bankrupt even if things tighten up for them in the pocketbook.
Its the people in Lexington and Winchester feeling the heat I would say.
You Dreamworks, seem like someone who is content paying taxes for a bunch of nothing and crappy 2 lane roads and overlapping 2-3 lane rotaries near Boston.
You also act like I was totally badmouthing MA by saying if you dont like it, leave, but you're clearly clueless.
If saying that a place is overtaxed and have taxes that amount to nothing is an actual great thing, then you are right, but IT IS NOT!!
Schools are closing here.
I will admit. MA could have so much government control that it could end up restarting from the ground up again and be in a capitalist state again.

[LeavingMA]

Originally Posted by neil0311

You need to get your facts straight. First, let's look at the local and state services in Massachusetts. As I mentioned in the sales tax thread, most towns in MA have little to no services. Volunteer Fire Departments, understaffed Police Departments, part time or no libraries, roads and bridges in terrible condition. The state spends oodles on projects for Boston like the big dig, and oodles for the poor and illegal aliens, but if you're just an ordinary taxpayer who lives outside of Rte 495, you get soaked.

As far as your erroneous rant about "the wealthy" and "tax breaks"....do you know who pays the taxes in this country? Not the so-called middle class, but the wealthy. You need to take a look at the facts here:

The Tax Foundation - Summary of Latest Federal Individual Income Tax Data

The top 5% of wage earners pays 60% or the federal income tax burden. The top 10% of wage earners, that's anyone who makes more than $109,000, pays nearly 71% of federal income taxes. In contrast, the bottom 50% of wage earners, those who make $31,000 or less, pay only 3% of federal income taxes.

Who do you think pays both federal and state taxes? The people who make and spend the money....the hated and dreaded "wealthy" people. Stop listening to the leftist propoganda and learn the facts.

Thank you for putting the facts straight. I don't believe in corporate welfare or tax sheltering certain people either, but if someone can tell me if they have ever been offered a job by a poor person, I would like to know. If all people are considered equal under the law, why shouldn't there be a flat tax, or have a national sales tax instead of federal income tax. That way a "rich" person who wants to buy that big yacht or have 7 cars would shovel more of the burden but by choice.

It is not fair for those that create jobs and start companies to be taxed more because they take the risk and make more. They have actually found when you tax the wealthy people more it effects everyone...people who work building yachts, etc. have less jobs and make less money and the government gets less money. Take California where they have spent and taxed people to death and they estimate that about 20,000 millionares have moved out of the state over the last few years.

[DreamworksSKG]

ok then if there aren't taxes, how do you expect to pay for services?

I don't believe in welfare either, but I know there's quite a few wealthier people who don't bother paying taxes because they dont feel they are entitled too. and maybe they give the majority of $$$ ot taxes, but they still should be taxed more--if you make millions of dollars a year, or even hundreds of thousands, does it really make a difference? I fyou make $250K a year, you'll be a millionaire in 4 years. whereas someone like me who makes $10 an hour without benefits, (and I have a 4 year college degree btw)--
will probably never see even $500K in my lifetime

[DreamworksSKG]

Again without taxes, how do you propose paying for services we need?

[neil0311]

Originally Posted by DreamworksSKG

Again without taxes, how do you propose paying for services we need?

We do pay taxes, and the government does provide services. The key is what services does the government provide and to whom, and what money is wasted through corruption and political patronage. In MA, the state budget is much higher than other states when looked at on a per capita basis. There is so much waste and bloat that could be eliminated if someone really want to do so. The sad fact is no one does.

There is plenty of money to fund essential government programs. Look to NH as a guide. No sales tax; no income tax, but yet life goes on and government provides the services that government is supposed to provide. Look to other states like the one in which I now live. We had a budget deficit here, so the legislature and Governor cut spending by nearly $2 billion. Hard choices were made but no new taxes passed. In MA, the answer is usually to just raise fees and taxes instead of eliminating patronage, waste, and making some hard spending choices.

You can provide essential services without being a welfare state. The money has to come from somewhere and from someone. It doesn't grow on a money tree on Beacon Hill.

[DreamworksSKG]

yeah and new hampshire still doesnt have a commuter rail from Boston-Concord.

how do we expect to pay for projects and such?

[meltinjohn]

Originally Posted by neil0311

We do pay taxes, and the government does provide services. The key is what services does the government provide and to whom, and what money is wasted through corruption and political patronage. In MA, the state budget is much higher than other states when looked at on a per capita basis. There is so much waste and bloat that could be eliminated if someone really want to do so. The sad fact is no one does.

There is plenty of money to fund essential government programs. Look to NH as a guide. No sales tax; no income tax, but yet life goes on and government provides the services that government is supposed to provide. Look to other states like the one in which I now live. We had a budget deficit here, so the legislature and Governor cut spending by nearly $2 billion. Hard choices were made but no new taxes passed. In MA, the answer is usually to just raise fees and taxes instead of eliminating patronage, waste, and making some hard spending choices.

You can provide essential services without being a welfare state. The money has to come from somewhere and from someone. It doesn't grow on a money tree on Beacon Hill.

Per Capita, Mass might even be worse than California especially since you got Northern Cal which doesnt have the same mentality as Southern Cal and thats a much larger area than Western MA is to Eastern MA + NorCal is bigger than SoCal. Eastern MA is the bulk of this and just gets spread out to the western part when they are nowhere near Boston. I dont think its a smart move to pick rural western MA thinking you will escape especially seeing you still have to fund Boston crap. I think Vermont or Manchester NH are good choices for New England if you want escapes from MA but only IF you can find work in Manchester/Nashua say. Vermont at least is near Montreal so they dont have to touch Boston lol. Mass is my homestate, I really like it, but it is hard to plan for a future unless you want government assistance for a long time, and then you can get your studio apartment in Boston with their help so ya, you can have it right in a nice east coast city, but is it worth it to know that your only getting it because the government helps you out? I like to think not, but still can be tempting too to refuse it and then pursue out of state options where more bright young americans are moving to. Mass could become the next Michigan in some of the towns only with great seafood and a bustling city in Boston and some of the surroundings like Somerville and Cambridge will survive. The burbs will all be ghost towns tho if they arent already now or heading there as I speak.


Right on on the part next to the last line.
I feel that nobody makes an effort to pick up the waste that people litter in towns like Billerica or Wilmington, but the people will ***** and moan and now they have a 1 barrel law and the rest are recycle bins. Why dont more people just take a bag with them and a trash picker and pick claw the frikken trash?? I did it before. No, I guess ppl are too lazy tho.