Confused about the million dollar+ houses and the supposed "upper-middle" class factor associated with it (Boston: rent, credit card)
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...The only way to buy a house in these towns are 1) borrow really unreasonable and foolish amounts of money; 2) be born rich: 3) get yourself a time machine and go back to 1994. Because 1970-1985 and 1990-1995 were brief, fleeting windows of affordability for these towns, and we may not see another for a generation.
...or be someone with a $200K+ income. There are lots of them around in this area, and many parts of the Boston area have simply priced out people with more modest incomes. It's basic supply and demand: the supply of housing is limited, demand is high, and there are people with money willing to pay the price because the quality of living is very good.
Syracusa, I'm not sure if you are unnecessarily limiting your search.
My interpretation is that your husband has obtained a position in Boston. Does this mean actually IN Boston or somewhere in the surrounding area? Also, that you will be searching for an academic position?
If this is the case, there are many higher education institutions outside of Boston, such as Stonehill to the south or Endicott to the north. Also don't forget the several UMass campuses. There are several cities/towns, other than Newton, that may meet your criteria and are more affordable inbetween. These may provide a midpoint for commutes, etc.
It is a bit simplistic to assume because someone has a degree, even from an Ivy League school, with a good job, that would automatically one could live in one of the towns you mentioned (Newton, Lexington, Andover, Weston, Concord). I have a good friend who lives in Westwood, off Summer Street which features homes which begin around 1.8M. All of these residents didn't necessarily go to Ivy League schools, or inherit money. As a matter of fact, my friend and his wife, do not know of one single lawyer or doctor who live in the neighborhood.
Keep in mind, Boston and NYC are tied in together with Wall St. Manhattan on the "buy side" and Boston on the "sell side" so there are a lot of finance people floating around. Also, keep in mind route 128 (the nations original technology highway) has numerous talented, and successful employees. the computer industry has been very strong in years past too in the area. To be a doctor or lawyer, is really not enough to say you've "made it" by Bostonian standards. Also, your comment regarding a "snob" appeal is not usually evident with the "natives", usually this type of snob attitude is more apparent with a transplant. Bostonians, or baystaters for that matter are usually a bit more down to earth, regardless of their socio-economic status.
I would not focus on the towns you've mentioned, such as Newton, Lexington, Andover, Weston, or Concord. You can add, Needham, Wellsely, Brookline, Carlisle, Belmont, Swampscott, Dover, Cohasset, Marblehead, as well. Focus on the areas more affordable, then seek recommendations. Areas such as Quincy, Braintree, Waltham, Everett, Malden, Weymouth, Walpole, Norwood, Dedham, Revere all have decent areas worth considering.
Yes, perhaps you'll have to settle for a house that is smaller, not as desirable a style (a ranch or a split-level), or in need of cosmetic updates in order to afford one of the "it" towns. Or you can choose a nicer house in a town that may not have the schools with the best rep, but has very good schools and great character. I live in one of those "it" towns. One of my new friends here is a teacher, and her husband works in high tech. They live in a modest house. It is not falling down or in disrepair. It is, perhaps, smaller than they'd like. The kitchen isn't something out of a magazine. But they cook great food there and live a loving, fun-filled life. You may need to be patient. You may need to be open-minded. You may need to be creative. It can be done.
I hear you. I have NO IDEA how people do it. The state of housing, at least in the Boston area, is ridiculous. My husband and I are both professionals. Right now we have a condo in a not-so-great (schoolwise) town close to Boston - hoping to move before our child goes to elementary school into a town with a better school system - but to be close to Boston you literally have to pay at least $500,000 and that gives you a falling down tiny fixer upper with no yard. No thanks. For a half a million dollars you would think you could at least be able to put a swing set somewhere . . . I have come to the sad realization that having a much longer commute is the only way to have space/yard and decent schools. But it is going to be a squeeze - even for two professionals with graduate degrees who make about $200k. I see people who live in these big houses, the women stay home, etc. and I have no idea how they do it.
I think a lot of people bought property a long time ago, like decades. Or else they were well positioned as real estate went up to trade up.
I do know a lot of people who have inherited money/property, ordinary working people. Your father's poor-mouth triple-decker in Somerville that was working-class housing now sells for serious money. If someone inherits, say, $60K from a retired ordinary working parent (thinking here of a friend) it's a huge kickstart. Can end student loans, be a down payment or partly pay for cash for housing, etc.
There are also certainly a lot of high-paid jobs around Boston/Cambridge and eastern Mass. in general, with the scientific and technology businesses.
For half a million (as you mention) one could certainly buy quite a nice house in a town like Arlington, and have great community, good schools, and be very close to town. Or Wakefield, or Winchester, all great places.
Let's just bottom line this discussion and call it what it is:
Champagne taste on a beer budget.
I think we all have it at some point in our life. Everything from college education, to wedding costs, to vehicles to homes. Sometimes life just deals you a financial reality slap.
I think a lot of people bought property a long time ago, like decades. Or else they were well positioned as real estate went up to trade up. I do know a lot of people who have inherited money/property, ordinary working people. Your father's poor-mouth triple-decker in Somerville that was working-class housing now sells for serious money. If someone inherits, say, $60K from a retired ordinary working parent (thinking here of a friend) it's a huge kickstart. Can end student loans, be a down payment or partly pay for cash for housing, etc.
Sure is true. I had a friend whose father inherited a 3-family house just outside Davis Square in 2003. The father's parents had bought the house in 1948 for about $10,000. They went condo, my friend bought the ground floor from his dad for a very low price, they sold the two top units to well-employed lifetime friends of my friend, and my friend's dad walked away a year after inheriting with about $600,000 net. My friend had a great condo for a song and his best friends as neighbors. So far nobody's moved out and they've had no problems.
I used to work with two people who made the same income and were born the same year. One had the good fortune to marry a woman with pretty well-off parents in 1992. Her parents gave them a $50,000 "wedding present" and they bought a Back Bay condo for about $200,000, then sold it in 2005 for $665,000 and bought a big house in Newton for $875,000 with a quite manageable mortgage.
The other didn't get any big gift back in the day, so scraped and saved to put together $50,000. Problem was that by 2005 the $50,000 was only 7% down on their $700,000 two-family in JP. They wound up with an interest-only ARM, were frantically trying to renovate the rental unit to get some money coming in. At first they were getting rental income and their share of the payment was managable. Then the interest rates went up for a bit, and their payment went up too. The tenant didn't pay for a bit, then left. No rental income for two months and they had to take less when they got someone in. They've had a bad few years. My advice was not to buy a $700,000 house with only $50,000 down and an ARM, but they were afraid the same house would be a million or two if they waited any longer. As it turns out they bought at the height.
Sometimes it's the luck of the draw but it sure helps to have a big pile of cash to get started with, or inherit a property that's now worth a lot more than it was when bought.
Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover
For half a million (as you mention) one could certainly buy quite a nice house in a town like Arlington, and have great community, good schools, and be very close to town. Or Wakefield, or Winchester, all great places.
Sadly, half a million wouldn't get much in Winchester and not that much in Arlington these days either.
Let's just bottom line this discussion and call it what it is:
Champagne taste on a beer budget.
I think we all have it at some point in our life. Everything from college education, to wedding costs, to vehicles to homes. Sometimes life just deals you a financial reality slap.
True. The one thing people are missing is how much the money supply has been inflated in this economy and especially over the last 10 years. If you bought a house about 10 years or more ago you don't notice it as much, but these places that are going for $500k+ are ridiculous. Even if your making $200k and then add your all your expenses and your "new" mortgage to the mix you shouldn't be buying some of these homes. The government has made it so a 400k mortgage is normal or nothing.
People talk about supply and demand but the Boston area doesn't have the supply of these jobs to afford these homes. This is why so many middle-class people have moved out of MA and left MA for more affordable places. It is the same reason why many jobs have left also. People get sticker shock moving here no different than New Englander's do when they move to the south and see what they can get for a house.
People also forget that the same people that lived in these towns 20+ years ago only had one head of household working a lot of the time and were still able to put away money, pay the bills, and pay what needed to be paid. It isn't like that anymore. Yes, part of it revolves around the fact we are used to a certain lifestyle, but money does not go as far as it used to. We have an interesting issue right now...the government is printing money making money worth less but yet jobs are few so they are now starting to pay less, making it more and more difficult to afford things.
The government will tell you inflation isn't a problem but just look at the cost of gold and also what I notice in the last 7 years. I graduated in 2002 and started working. Even with 2 car loans in 2003 I was fine and had money I could save, invest, and spend. With no car loans in 2006, 2007, and 2008 I noticed my money doesn't go nearly as far. This is with the same spending habits. Everything is more expensive and salary or commission doesn't keep up with it. People will pay a premium to live in some of these Boston suburbs, but if you don't have any money to enjoy it what good is it.
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