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Passages Malibu claims they have the cure for alcoholism via a non-12 Step Method because they do not believe the disease concept of alcoholism.
Do you believe they have invented the cure ?
Passages Malibu claims they have the cure for alcoholism via a non-12 Step Method because they do not believe the disease concept of alcoholism.
Do you believe they have invented the cure ?
What does "cure" mean?
Can a person who has been "cured" of alcoholism drink only two beers at a baseball game or party easily, comfortably, and like "normal" people?
Can a person who has been "cured" of alcoholism drink only two beers at a baseball game or party easily, comfortably, and like "normal" people?
I guess if you are cured you should be able to drink like a regular earth person. If a diabetic was cured then he could eat sweets like anyone else and not need to use insulin to maintain healthy blood sugar levels - that's what a cure means IMO.
I saw their ad on TV and then googled them. They don't seem to be very specific, other than to say they reject the disease concept of alcoholism. The son of the founder claims to be "Cured" for 10 years and the father claims to have written a book which contains "The Cure."
Passages Malibu claims they have the cure for alcoholism via a non-12 Step Method because they do not believe the disease concept of alcoholism.
Do you believe they have invented the cure ?
The "original" 12 Step process has never used nor have they condoned the "disease" concept. They draw a line between the alcoholic and the different types of drinkers.
Hard drinkers who have not crossed the line into alcoholism can either drink two drinks and stop... OR they can drink and get drunk, but then walk away from booze and stay away from the next first drink... given a sufficiently strong reason.
A real alcoholic cannot do either of the above. They cannot control the amount once they start and they will drink again... usually for some trivial reason like, "I can control it this time. Just watch." or "Maybe if I put some whiskey into milk and drink it on a full stomach." or "I've never drank in Texas before."
The 12 Step process says you can get recovered from alcohol, but not cured. Being recovered puts you into a state of neutrality over booze... a state where you do not even want a drink of booze, as you've found a sufficient substitute.
That Malibu process has a 20 dollar book and an $80,000.00 treatment center.
What they mean by cured, I do not know. Where they draw the line on being an alcoholic, I don't know. Where they draw the line on other drug addictions, I don't know.
I've been sober for going on 7 and a half years. I don't think about what life would be like if I could drink two bourbon and cokes and stopping. That's something I just wouldn't want to fathom. Why would someone want to drink booze and not get drunk? To some of you, you don't understand my question. But you might understand this; Why would you want to go snort a line of sweet n low? What's the point?
You don't need to waste your 20 dollars to operate on this reasoning.
I'm a little skeptical of any and all of the "cure treatments" from various sources for anything from advanced cancer to things like this....especially with an 80k price tag attached.
The "original" 12 Step process has never used nor have they condoned the "disease" concept. They draw a line between the alcoholic and the different types of drinkers.
Hard drinkers who have not crossed the line into alcoholism can either drink two drinks and stop... OR they can drink and get drunk, but then walk away from booze and stay away from the next first drink... given a sufficiently strong reason.
A real alcoholic cannot do either of the above. They cannot control the amount once they start and they will drink again... usually for some trivial reason like, "I can control it this time. Just watch." or "Maybe if I put some whiskey into milk and drink it on a full stomach." or "I've never drank in Texas before."
The 12 Step process says you can get recovered from alcohol, but not cured. Being recovered puts you into a state of neutrality over booze... a state where you do not even want a drink of booze, as you've found a sufficient substitute.
That Malibu process has a 20 dollar book and an $80,000.00 treatment center.
What they mean by cured, I do not know. Where they draw the line on being an alcoholic, I don't know. Where they draw the line on other drug addictions, I don't know.
I've been sober for going on 7 and a half years. I don't think about what life would be like if I could drink two bourbon and cokes and stopping. That's something I just wouldn't want to fathom. Why would someone want to drink booze and not get drunk? To some of you, you don't understand my question. But you might understand this; Why would you want to go snort a line of sweet n low? What's the point?
You don't need to waste your 20 dollars to operate on this reasoning.
You are correct about AA and the "Disease Concept of Alcoholism" - the phrase was coined by Jellnik in 1946 based on studies and his identification of 5 types of alcoholics. What Passages states in their tv ad is that they are "Not a 12 Step program" their program works. This implies that 12 Step Programs don't work, which is an outright lie.
The other fact is that Dr. Silkworth, who worked in an alcoholism wardfor most of his career stated in the foreword of Alcoholics Anonymous, that alcoholics have an "allergy which differentiates these people, and sets them apart as a distinct entity." To me, this is just like a diabetic who cannot have sugar like other people without developing an allergy, and diabetes is a disease. What "Passages" is saying is that they have a "CURE" This is interesting, since they don't believe in the "disease concepy." So what do they have a cure for ?
Finally, you are spot on about recovery, as opposed to a "cure." Recovery is freedom from the urge to drink, it is removed so that a former alcoholic is not even attracted to or desirous of getting loaded or drunk. It is not even a part of his life anymore.
You are also right when you say it isn't necessary to spend $80K for "The Cure" when AA is free and it does , in fact, work. I can attest to that fact since I have not found it necessary to take a single drop of alcohol for the last 26 years because of my membership in AA. Its OK though, if anyone wants to go to Passages for $80K and they find out its a snake oil program, thay will always be welcome to come to AA afterwards. If Passages does work for anyone and keeps them sober forever, my hats off to them.
The "original" 12 Step process has never used nor have they condoned the "disease" concept. They draw a line between the alcoholic and the different types of drinkers.
Hard drinkers who have not crossed the line into alcoholism can either drink two drinks and stop... OR they can drink and get drunk, but then walk away from booze and stay away from the next first drink... given a sufficiently strong reason.
A real alcoholic cannot do either of the above. They cannot control the amount once they start and they will drink again... usually for some trivial reason like, "I can control it this time. Just watch." or "Maybe if I put some whiskey into milk and drink it on a full stomach." or "I've never drank in Texas before."
The 12 Step process says you can get recovered from alcohol, but not cured. Being recovered puts you into a state of neutrality over booze... a state where you do not even want a drink of booze, as you've found a sufficient substitute.
That Malibu process has a 20 dollar book and an $80,000.00 treatment center.
What they mean by cured, I do not know. Where they draw the line on being an alcoholic, I don't know. Where they draw the line on other drug addictions, I don't know.
I've been sober for going on 7 and a half years. I don't think about what life would be like if I could drink two bourbon and cokes and stopping. That's something I just wouldn't want to fathom. Why would someone want to drink booze and not get drunk? To some of you, you don't understand my question. But you might understand this; Why would you want to go snort a line of sweet n low? What's the point?
You don't need to waste your 20 dollars to operate on this reasoning.
LOL, I have an alcoholic friend who said almost the same thing: "What's the point of going out and having A drink?" To which I replied "What's the point of drinking so much that you pass out over the open dishwasher and break off the top rack?"
The answer to her question is "you get a pleasant mild buzz at a place where you have social interaction with other people." She didn't remember how she cut her head or how the dishwasher got broken, so my question was kind of lost on her.
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