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Old 04-21-2012, 03:21 PM
 
Location: America
6,704 posts, read 10,813,879 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polo89 View Post
The only thing that seperates West Indians and Black-Americans, are they were enslaved by different European countries, thus absorbed different European cultures. That's what REALLY separates everyone. Blacks and people of West Indian descent come from the same countries in West Africa. Same genes.
I don't believe a lot of people allow this point to absorb into their thick heads. Africans on the continent and in the diaspora are not as far apart as some would think. When i see aggressive Africa Americans it reminds me of Nigerians lol. When I hear patois I know it belongs to pidgin English spoken in W. Africa. When I see peas and rice, this reminds me of the continent. Even when you see these films with the strong black mother, people do not realize but Africans are matrilineal not patrilineal (that is a European thing).

Now yes, there are certain segments of all the different populations of the African Diaspora that act unsavory but, that is a issue of CLASS and isn't a indictment against an entire group. You get a bunch of poor whites, poor afro american, poor Jamaicans and they have depressed situations i.e. bad socio-economic conditions and you are going to see the same types of behavior. for instance for poor Whites its meth, for poor Afro-Americans in the 90s it was crack, in Jamaica you see drug dealing and many of the same ills in the lower class, and you see this same stuff in socio-economically depressed areas in Africa.

I am not saying the diaspora is 100% the same as people on the continent. Due in part to slavery, and European domination, but there are still enough Africanisms there to bind the groups.
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Old 04-21-2012, 07:11 PM
 
Location: Dallas, Texas
1,891 posts, read 2,475,739 times
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Excellent thread. I lived in Miami for several years and knew some of the background but not all the details as expressed here.
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Old 04-21-2012, 07:30 PM
 
4,194 posts, read 2,284,547 times
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I lived in a neighborhood with Miami residents who dated to the 1940s-1960s. They would mention when the conversation turned to Overtown that it was quite a nice neighborhood and where white folks could go without fear unlike at the time of our conversation. Another mentioned the residents took pride in having a low crime neighborhood where visitors would be safe. Police force for the area used black patrol officers.
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Old 04-22-2012, 02:24 AM
 
13,339 posts, read 13,502,193 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
I don't believe a lot of people allow this point to absorb into their thick heads. Africans on the continent and in the diaspora are not as far apart as some would think. When i see aggressive Africa Americans it reminds me of Nigerians lol. When I hear patois I know it belongs to pidgin English spoken in W. Africa. When I see peas and rice, this reminds me of the continent. Even when you see these films with the strong black mother, people do not realize but Africans are matrilineal not patrilineal (that is a European thing).

Now yes, there are certain segments of all the different populations of the African Diaspora that act unsavory but, that is a issue of CLASS and isn't a indictment against an entire group. You get a bunch of poor whites, poor afro american, poor Jamaicans and they have depressed situations i.e. bad socio-economic conditions and you are going to see the same types of behavior. for instance for poor Whites its meth, for poor Afro-Americans in the 90s it was crack, in Jamaica you see drug dealing and many of the same ills in the lower class, and you see this same stuff in socio-economically depressed areas in Africa.

I am not saying the diaspora is 100% the same as people on the continent. Due in part to slavery, and European domination, but there are still enough Africanisms there to bind the groups.
EXACTLY!!! I'm Haitian, and I know so many Haitians who scoff at the thought of being African descendants. They get so offended when called African. They'd easily claim French ancestry and European ancestry, or even Indigenous Indian ancestry before African. And it seems so silly. It's like Look at your HAIR!!! Look at your skin!!! Always trying to claim a small fraction of European ancestry they have and act like it's makes the up the majority of their genes. You're an African descendant. All of us Haitians are African diaspora. And another thing that irks me, is the refusal of West Indians to be associated with Black-Americans. They come from the same West African countries that our ancestors came from. Making fun of Africans as if that's not where we came from. A GOOD portion of Haitian culture comes from Africa, while another portion comes from France. They need to recognize that ALOT of the cultural traits, music, instruments, food, religion, that we Haitians have that didn't come from our French side, didn't come out of a void!!! It came from somewhere, and that place where they came from is AFRICA!!!
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Old 04-22-2012, 02:58 AM
 
8,289 posts, read 7,310,830 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by straight shooter View Post
Actually in the beginning Overtown was a working class African American community that had a theater, pharmacy, doctors office, and many small locally owned businesses. Crime wasn't a problem up until the 50's.
Yes who ever thought "blacks" would have such "things"! Can you imagine! A "grocery store", a "pharmacy", a "theatre", a "doctor's office?""
My God? They must have been "civilzed"!
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Old 04-22-2012, 04:47 AM
 
2,237 posts, read 1,767,140 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiRob View Post
Yes who ever thought "blacks" would have such "things"! Can you imagine! A "grocery store", a "pharmacy", a "theatre", a "doctor's office?""
My God? They must have been "civilzed"!
I am not saying that they don't deserve them, I am saying that they don't have them anymore. Have you driven around Overtown lately? Do they have a Publix or Winn Dixie? Do they have doctors offices? Do they have a theatre? Do they have a Target or K Mart? Do they have a Best Buy, Brandsmart or electronics store. Do the have a Macys, Sears or department store? The only thing they have are lousy convenience stores and check cashing stores. Again I am not saying that it is right I am just pointing out certain facts.
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:57 AM
 
Location: America
6,704 posts, read 10,813,879 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polo89 View Post
EXACTLY!!! I'm Haitian, and I know so many Haitians who scoff at the thought of being African descendants. They get so offended when called African. They'd easily claim French ancestry and European ancestry, or even Indigenous Indian ancestry before African. And it seems so silly. It's like Look at your HAIR!!! Look at your skin!!! Always trying to claim a small fraction of European ancestry they have and act like it's makes the up the majority of their genes. You're an African descendant. All of us Haitians are African diaspora. And another thing that irks me, is the refusal of West Indians to be associated with Black-Americans. They come from the same West African countries that our ancestors came from. Making fun of Africans as if that's not where we came from. A GOOD portion of Haitian culture comes from Africa, while another portion comes from France. They need to recognize that ALOT of the cultural traits, music, instruments, food, religion, that we Haitians have that didn't come from our French side, didn't come out of a void!!! It came from somewhere, and that place where they came from is AFRICA!!!
My best friends growing up where Haitian, so I know that culture VERY well. They carve this seat in Haiti with a motif on it generally. You know they have this same wood carving art in W. Africa? But you know, I don't blame people for looking down on Africa. History has been distorted so greatly. Do you know, in many W. African countries they do not teach African history, they teach European history?! Then when Eurocentric researches do talk about African history it is distorted beyond belief. Look at Ancient Egypt and the lies they have invented about it lol.

Back on topic though, its this same mentality that would have people thinking Overtown is some warzone. Couple that with this new phenomenon among blacks in America to glorify ignorance, as if to be black means to be an ignorant hoodlum. I have a friend who was telling me, his younger cousins don't want to go into certain professions because "thats for white people". What the hell is going on with the youth!

I saw a video about overtown that was posted on this very website. To say it was amazing is an understatement. It showed how FDOT ran I-95 through over town via immanent domain. This then pushed out more affluent blacks in the area, and then Overtown went through a decline. Then you have socio economic marginalization which helped to further destroy the area. Very sad what was done to that community. But can't blame everything on govt/city officials. We also have the issue of the youth thinking to be black is to be ignorant and glorify ignorance. I blame this on the fact they are not being taught their history. A lot of non blacks do not understand this point. Anytime you get people who think their people have done nothing to contribute to civilization, they are subconsciously being taught they too are unable to do much. This is only natural. Think about black history month, they teach about slavery, and how people rose up from that. Well what about the THOUSANDS of over centuries where blacks actually had kingdoms and ruled? Like Egypt! Now I know a lot of people want to fool themselves into believing ancient egypt was white or mixed and I am telling you, your lying to yourself. The kingdom started in a area called Qustul which is in northern sudan. That kingdom was called Ta-seti. They were the first to have hieroglyphics, the first to have the white crown and the first to have kingdoms. that kingdom was about 2,000 years OLDER than Ancient Egypt. Then the ruler Namar/Menes went up from there and conquered Egypt, moved the capital there and ruled. Even if there were mixed people in the north (there wasn't, but lets pretend) it wouldn't matter. The king, his culture, writing, religion, principles of governance etc. ALL came from ta-seti/qustul in northern sudan and those people were and still are black. If you go to Southern Egypt today you still have black egyptians. Now some will say these are "nubians", well hate to break it to you but there was NO SUCH THING as a Nubian during ancient times. That was a made up word that Europeans created in the 1800s. If you know mtu ntr (the ancient egyptian language and writing system) you will never find a person or persons being called Nubians. The so called nubians of today are the ancient egyptians, period. Those mixed people in the north are are the result of slaves the ancient egyptians brought in around the IV dynasty from Arabia and the mediterraneans, then later conquerers came i.e. the assyrians then the persians then the greeks, then the romans, then the arabs and then the turks. All moving in there conquering and mixing in. The north of Egypt looks like it does today as a result of mixing which took place WELL after the kingdom was established. The kings of Egypt and the culture and knowledge Egypt possessed all came from the Southern portions of the country and before that in places like Sudan and even further south.

My point in all that is, if you started teaching people who they are, their true history and culture I assure you, they would hold themselves to a higher standard. But as of now, all these people have in these areas are ignorant rappers talking about fictitious scenarios, they themselves dont even live out. Overtown could be great again but it would take a black middle class or upper class coming in and changing the demographics. Not saying to replace the lower classes but provide some balance in there and hopefully the two groups can learn and grow from one another. I mean, you get a middle or upper class group of blacks in there, they will demand better education and hopefully will require their kids are taught more about black history, than some damn jim crow days.
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:35 PM
 
Location: The Present
1,996 posts, read 2,115,692 times
Reputation: 1867
Wild Style, Polo89, Steeler

Great comments +1.
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Old 05-11-2012, 07:06 PM
 
158 posts, read 149,130 times
Reputation: 92
This is a photo essay published by Ebony Magazine in the wake of the McDuffie Riots. Interesting stuff for those of us too young to have lived through Miami during this time. The riots, Mariel, waves of Haitian refugees, English-Only movement - remarkable all that happened in Miami during 1980. (I have to say the dude in the orange in the 2nd pic is looking pretty damn fly all things considered)

Link: Google Books - Ebony Magazine - September 1980




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Old 05-13-2012, 04:22 PM
 
Location: MIA/DC
1,190 posts, read 1,053,861 times
Reputation: 659
Its no where as bad as it was in the 90s
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