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Unread 06-28-2012, 11:06 AM
 
Location: America
6,583 posts, read 9,719,514 times
Reputation: 1764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coconut1 View Post
I don't know what you're going off about. I made NO MENTION of the homeless problem Downtown. None. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

I agree, there is a homelessness problem in Miami, especially Downtown. I'll even give up a better place to see the vast number of homeless people Downtown- head over to NE 9th, 10th or 11th Streets at night and you will see literally hundreds.

My point is that the outer limits of Downtown are NOT being built up with different projects like you claimed in post #13.

I'm not sure, and this is not to sound rude, you have a good grasp of what's actually going on Downtown.

You're saying Downtown needs big anchors- I pointed out two, but now you're saying those are no good because they close at 9 PM. I hate to break it to you but most retail closes at 9 PM regardless of what city it is.

As I said, the problem is pedestrian activity after work hours. It has been a problem Downtown for years and is continuing to be the problem. With the new residences that have popped up in the last few years and their occupancy continuing to grow it spells good news for the future of Downtown development. Businesses will continue to come Downtown but as you know, Rome wasn't built in a day.

Another thing- I think closing Flagler to traffic and making it like Lincoln Road would be one of the best and easiest things to really designate a lively Downtown core. Putting a large pedestrian bridge that goes from Bayfront Park over Biscayne and Metromover and connects to Flagler (put a large archway of sorts to designate people are going into something special and unique) would also help pedestrians travel the street. Bayfront could be home to nightly, free entertainment. I'm sure there are various groups that would love to get the exposure of playing Downtown. I think in doing something like this you would attract more tourist out of their hotels as well as Bayside and get them onto Flagler. Once you've done that things should organically grow from there.

More people, tourist, residents = more life. More life = more business. More business = better Downtown.
I don't take your statement as being rude, I just think you either don't take your time and read or your first language isn't english and you don't fully understand what is being said, maybe?

What i said in post #13 was, and this is a quote:

Quote:
Miami is trying to build out the periphery of downtown
The topic of this thread is about an area which is on the periphery, the science buildings are the periphery also, as well as the short term park they are proposing which I think they will call "central park", if I remember right, is also the periphery. So not sure what your mean when you stated:

Quote:
My point is that the outer limits of Downtown are NOT being built up with different projects like you claimed in post #13.
Also, I think you don't know what the word Anchor store means so here you go:

Quote:
An "anchor store" is a store that increases, through its name's reputation, the
trafficc of shoppers at or near its location
.

source

Doesn't have to necessarily be a retail store. As I said, the areas in question 1. do not have anything that is open late so there is no reason for people to be in those areas and 2 there is little housing in those areas, so people wouldn't naturally be over there because they have to be (because they live there).

As for the last part of what you said, concerning Flagler, I agree 100%. Not sure if you bothered to read my entire statement and looked at the links I provided but one of them was a .pdf created by the chamber of commerce for downtown Miami or it was from the city, not sure which (i forget). Anyway, they state what you are saying in your last portion of your post, that is the over arching plan. To close down Flagler and make it pedestrian friendly. I think they need to make it a live/work/play investment though. Where they maybe create apartments above the storefronts to get people living there who can support and sustain the business that will come.

My point is though, I don't think they should be building out a tropical 42nd street on the periphery, but instead, focus on the core of downtown, making it lively and user friendly. THEN start worrying about the periphery i.e. building out some electronic advertisement haven.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 11:57 AM
 
2,699 posts, read 1,628,929 times
Reputation: 837
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
where to begin,

Park west is the WEST side of downtown, Crosswinds project is the north/north east section of downtown. My question to you then becomes, what does that have to do with the price of rice in china, given the locations I discussed in my previous statements? So instead of lecturing me on what I need to do, take your time and read next time, and then try and comprehend.
Hello!!!!!! welcome to Miami as I stated the Logik area is in the Park West area and I stated the Crosswinds area would have been for positive growth(middle-class housing) in downtown ,however it met up with opposition, to say there is not or no plans for growth in the central core of downtown and they are focused on Miami Time Square is plain ignorance.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 01:21 PM
 
3,164 posts, read 3,446,831 times
Reputation: 1465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
I don't take your statement as being rude, I just think you either don't take your time and read or your first language isn't english and you don't fully understand what is being said, maybe?

What i said in post #13 was, and this is a quote:

The topic of this thread is about an area which is on the periphery, the science buildings are the periphery also, as well as the short term park they are proposing which I think they will call "central park", if I remember right, is also the periphery. So not sure what your mean when you stated:



Also, I think you don't know what the word Anchor store means so here you go:

.

source

Doesn't have to necessarily be a retail store. As I said, the areas in question 1. do not have anything that is open late so there is no reason for people to be in those areas and 2 there is little housing in those areas, so people wouldn't naturally be over there because they have to be (because they live there).

As for the last part of what you said, concerning Flagler, I agree 100%. Not sure if you bothered to read my entire statement and looked at the links I provided but one of them was a .pdf created by the chamber of commerce for downtown Miami or it was from the city, not sure which (i forget). Anyway, they state what you are saying in your last portion of your post, that is the over arching plan. To close down Flagler and make it pedestrian friendly. I think they need to make it a live/work/play investment though. Where they maybe create apartments above the storefronts to get people living there who can support and sustain the business that will come.

My point is though, I don't think they should be building out a tropical 42nd street on the periphery, but instead, focus on the core of downtown, making it lively and user friendly. THEN start worrying about the periphery i.e. building out some electronic advertisement haven.
No, I understand it clearly and English is not only my first language, it's my only language

When you say "science buildings" are you referring to the construction of Museum Park? As for the Central Park, the plot was an eyesore. Would you rather have an eyesore continue to stay there or something more pleasant? The park is not built to generate revenue, it's to sustain itself and get rid of blight.

Quote:
An "anchor store" is a store that increases, through its name's reputation, the
trafficc of shoppers at or near its location
I'm glad to see we agree on the definition of an anchor store. Of course it doesn't have to be retail, but that's not the point. The point is Macy's and La Epoca are both anchor stores. There's no if, and or but about it.

To answer your #1, if there was traffic at that hour they would be open. 2. Little housing? Really?

We agree on Flagler and the core; however, the government cannot tell businesses where to locate or what they should build. Perhaps the real problem is the city has been too lax in giving that area an infusion of money to improve the streetscape.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 01:30 PM
 
Location: America
6,583 posts, read 9,719,514 times
Reputation: 1764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coconut1 View Post
No, I understand it clearly and English is not only my first language, it's my only language

When you say "science buildings" are you referring to the construction of Museum Park? As for the Central Park, the plot was an eyesore. Would you rather have an eyesore continue to stay there or something more pleasant? The park is not built to generate revenue, it's to sustain itself and get rid of blight.



I'm glad to see we agree on the definition of an anchor store. Of course it doesn't have to be retail, but that's not the point. The point is Macy's and La Epoca are both anchor stores. There's no if, and or but about it.

To answer your #1, if there was traffic at that hour they would be open. 2. Little housing? Really?

We agree on Flagler and the core; however, the government cannot tell businesses where to locate or what they should build. Perhaps the real problem is the city has been too lax in giving that area an infusion of money to improve the streetscape.
Where are there condos or apartments or anywhere to live along that stretch where we are discussing? Name some buildings please. There is little to no housing where that Macy's store is, very little to non along the west side of downtown or in the core of downtown, it is centered along the east and north east. Do you deny that? Development for the sake of development is silly, the idea needs to be sustainable growth. Something downtown sorely needs. Otherwise just slapping things here and there would have worked by now.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 01:32 PM
 
Location: America
6,583 posts, read 9,719,514 times
Reputation: 1764
Quote:
Originally Posted by perry335654 View Post
Hello!!!!!! welcome to Miami as I stated the Logik area is in the Park West area and I stated the Crosswinds area would have been for positive growth(middle-class housing) in downtown ,however it met up with opposition, to say there is not or no plans for growth in the central core of downtown and they are focused on Miami Time Square is plain ignorance.
again, not sure what this has to do with the price of rice in china, but ok.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 04:08 PM
 
3,164 posts, read 3,446,831 times
Reputation: 1465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
Where are there condos or apartments or anywhere to live along that stretch where we are discussing? Name some buildings please. There is little to no housing where that Macy's store is, very little to non along the west side of downtown or in the core of downtown, it is centered along the east and north east. Do you deny that? Development for the sake of development is silly, the idea needs to be sustainable growth. Something downtown sorely needs. Otherwise just slapping things here and there would have worked by now.
I think now you just want to argue for the sake of arguing

There's a plethora of buildings Downtown. You will not have apartments over every store. If you're going to try and claim that somebody that lives at say 50 Biscayne or Vizcayne or Epic or One Miami or Loft I or Loft II or even something as far north as Marquis are not going to make their way to Flagler if they simply want to go to Macy's, need something at Radio Shack, need vitamins at GNC or want to bargain shop at Ross, I would say that's ridiculous.

Try to put into law the last part and see how far it goes. You cannot regulate what somebody wants to do on their land or with their property as far as making sure it's 'sustainable growth.' If somebody that owns a building along Flagler does not want their ground floor to be retail or a service or a restaurant or any other commercial venture, that is their right. Nobody can force them to do something simply because they don't believe it's right for the area.

As I said before, perhaps it's the city that has dropped the ball and not invested enough in the streetscape to make it the more viable and vibrant shopping, entertainment and service destination that I'm sure all Miami residents would like it to be.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 06:32 PM
 
Location: America
6,583 posts, read 9,719,514 times
Reputation: 1764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coconut1 View Post
I think now you just want to argue for the sake of arguing

There's a plethora of buildings Downtown. You will not have apartments over every store. If you're going to try and claim that somebody that lives at say 50 Biscayne or Vizcayne or Epic or One Miami or Loft I or Loft II or even something as far north as Marquis are not going to make their way to Flagler if they simply want to go to Macy's, need something at Radio Shack, need vitamins at GNC or want to bargain shop at Ross, I would say that's ridiculous.

Try to put into law the last part and see how far it goes. You cannot regulate what somebody wants to do on their land or with their property as far as making sure it's 'sustainable growth.' If somebody that owns a building along Flagler does not want their ground floor to be retail or a service or a restaurant or any other commercial venture, that is their right. Nobody can force them to do something simply because they don't believe it's right for the area.

As I said before, perhaps it's the city that has dropped the ball and not invested enough in the streetscape to make it the more viable and vibrant shopping, entertainment and service destination that I'm sure all Miami residents would like it to be.
you are TOTALLY missing my point but anyway. We agree on what flagler needs so lets leave it
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Unread 06-28-2012, 07:44 PM
 
2,699 posts, read 1,628,929 times
Reputation: 837
I think Miami has a beautiful downtown, however it ia a city that is going through growing pains,it is a young city and I guess I can see the point of the residence if they think the Time Squares lights would be an annoyance.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 11:09 PM
 
Location: Shaw.
2,227 posts, read 1,022,690 times
Reputation: 713
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
And that is EXACTLY my point, it has potential but has a long way to go. it would be much smarter for them to focus on building up the downtown as it is the core of the city instead of focusing on trying to recreate Midtown manhattan on some outlier area.
Oh, I agree. I like Wynwood as the Arts District (although Midtown Miami is quite overrated), but that's a nook, not the DOWNTOWN. Some of the other areas are nice as well. But Miami is really missing a downtown that's an attraction in of itself. Bayside is nice, I guess, but it needs a periphery (as does American Airlines Area). It would be great if people would leave these other attractions and walk down Flager window shopping and maybe getting some food.

I'm actually ok with some of those small electronics shops or those places selling cheap luggage (I may go back and get one for $8). But it's not enough to attract people. There needs to be a few flagship stores (like an Apple Store, as was mentioned). There is a Macy's, but that place looks abandoned (I understand that it's a historic building; I think the problem is with the area).

I do like that it doesn't feel modern. Brickell can be the modern downtown. Flager needs to find a way to preserve the historic feel while making it a place people actually want to go.
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Unread 06-28-2012, 11:16 PM
 
Location: Shaw.
2,227 posts, read 1,022,690 times
Reputation: 713
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coconut1 View Post
As I said, the problem is pedestrian activity after work hours. It has been a problem Downtown for years and is continuing to be the problem. With the new residences that have popped up in the last few years and their occupancy continuing to grow it spells good news for the future of Downtown development. Businesses will continue to come Downtown but as you know, Rome wasn't built in a day.

Another thing- I think closing Flagler to traffic and making it like Lincoln Road would be one of the best and easiest things to really designate a lively Downtown core. Putting a large pedestrian bridge that goes from Bayfront Park over Biscayne and Metromover and connects to Flagler (put a large archway of sorts to designate people are going into something special and unique) would also help pedestrians travel the street. Bayfront could be home to nightly, free entertainment. I'm sure there are various groups that would love to get the exposure of playing Downtown. I think in doing something like this you would attract more tourist out of their hotels as well as Bayside and get them onto Flagler. Once you've done that things should organically grow from there.

More people, tourist, residents = more life. More life = more business. More business = better Downtown.
That might be pretty cool. It's hard for me to picture it shut down, though. Maybe they could just shut it down on Sunday's or something to try it out (Ginza in Tokyo shuts down on Sundays, if I recall correctly). I wouldn't want to permanently shut down Flager in order to attract businesses, only to have it flop.

You might be on to something with the archway over Biscayne Blvd. It would really help bridge the two.
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