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Old 08-18-2012, 07:01 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
8,087 posts, read 9,778,360 times
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Well, a few points to consider:

The ability to learn a language diminishes with age particularly post-puberty. We see this in one of concerns voiced regarding deporting illegal residents who have spent their developing years in the USA.

I have clients in Chicago and NYC who market in Polish and Italian language respectively to their clients who have been here since the 1950s. This is their language of choice. Similar to Miami save the concentration of Spanish here is larger. I experienced first hand the change from single language to two(+Spanish) to three (+Creole). Local tax payers properly determine where their funds are allocated and if the majority declare for a new language then they are properly exercising their rights. Who can find fault with this? The best manner,lower cost, to grapple with the language issue was to authorize multi-lingual signage rather than invest in ESL courses.

Obviously, the professional class have no issues finding work in Miami if they are only English language only. I doubt any architect, engineer, lawyer, physcian, CEO, CFO, VPs etc will lack for work due to lack of Spanish. I worked for anglo owned companies and Spanish was not needed. All documents are in English.

Trades, para-professional, service level, manual labor well that is another issue but those naturally would be market specific requirements. They only occasions I used Spanish for business in Miami was to direct subordinates who fit the above profiles(they tend to be non-clerical) or to work with international clients from Spanish dominate countries.

Himain was foolish as he was fed up and posted about a particular region where non-English speaking people have thrived as I pointed out and referenced those Spanish language groups who accomplished the same results. The company I worked for was in Wausau and they employed a number of Hmongs. I was acquainted with a few and the language use was similar to Miami.

Miami is the manner it is because Federal immigration allowed an unregulated intake of people who alterted the demographics which later led to changes in local government. These then lawfully enacted changes to placate their multi-lingual constituency. If you wish to blame someone, blame the government not the people for enabling this behavior.

Ironically, I was in Orlando last weekend and meet an Ecuadorian who commented on how she worked for seven years in Miami without needing English but had to learn the language upon relocating to Orlando as that is the common language at all levels of communication.

People will do what is required to survive and thrive but the path of least resistance is taken for simplicity and swiftness.

Last edited by Felix C; 08-18-2012 at 07:28 AM..
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Old 08-18-2012, 06:00 PM
 
Location: Planet Earth
3,921 posts, read 9,092,309 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterNY View Post
Recent studies show that the up and coming (if not already), largest group of minorities is not Latinos, but Asians.
What do you mean? The U.S overall is like 3% Asian, but 16% Latino.
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Old 08-19-2012, 10:21 AM
 
Location: MIA
32 posts, read 109,743 times
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I don't think speaking Spanish is the issue there. It's more important to be "connected". And I don't mean to another County employee. I mean connected to a special interest, politician, commercial contractor or large attorney firm. Get a job there first, then apply at the County.
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Old 08-19-2012, 11:29 AM
 
Location: Mountain girl trapped on the beach
604 posts, read 852,050 times
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I worked for the county for a few years in a professional position and Felix C is right, I didn't need Spanish. But if I had been in a customer-facing position it would not have been worth my while to move down here. I would never have found a job because even though I speak three languages, none of them are Spanish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix C View Post
Miami is the manner it is because Federal immigration allowed an unregulated intake of people who alterted the demographics which later led to changes in local government. These then lawfully enacted changes to placate their multi-lingual constituency. If you wish to blame someone, blame the government not the people for enabling this behavior.
Truer words have probably never been spoken in the Miami forum. I had to rep you for this.
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Old 08-19-2012, 11:39 AM
 
Location: Miami/ Washington DC
4,836 posts, read 11,955,603 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by himain View Post
I'd love to see any of these latins get plucked out of little havana, hialeah, miami in general of where they are catered to and get dropped off in the middle of Wisconsin or something. They would never survive.

That's the beauty of speaking ENGLISH!! I can go ANYWHERE in this country and make it day to day. 80% of people living in Miami today couldn't do that because they have limited themselves to Spanish only in a fully english country.

Not to mention people from around the world in countries I've never heard of actually speak ENGLISH and half of Miami does not. How embarassing!!!
80%? Come on now it's a problem but let's be real here don't go out and start saying ridiculous things it makes you less credible. Miami is 65% Hispanic and I'm gonna guess probably around 20% or so of that 65% don't speak English.
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Old 08-19-2012, 01:22 PM
 
231 posts, read 503,245 times
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Originally Posted by Felix C
Miami is the manner it is because Federal immigration allowed an unregulated intake of people who alterted the demographics which later led to changes in local government. These then lawfully enacted changes to placate their multi-lingual constituency. If you wish to blame someone, blame the government not the people for enabling this behavior.


Not true. The fight against "English only" legislation in Miami started and ended during the last years of the 70's and middle 80's. The Spanish speaking population was fully regulated, so they could vote and impose their own representatives. They voted to defend their culture and boycotted Miami Herald.

The unregulated immigration of non-voters arrived much, much later, during the late 90's.
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Old 08-19-2012, 09:09 PM
 
Location: Miami
888 posts, read 880,029 times
Reputation: 658
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unbelievable2012 View Post
Diversity is a great thing and I believe it benefits society overall. I enjoy living in Miami and it is beautiful throughout the different communities in Miami-Dade county. The Latino groups are thriving here and are clearly dominant. I have traveled throughout South America as well and I enjoyed experiencing the different cultures and learning about them. Living here and trying to experience a fair opportunity in the labor market is what concerns me. In most of the government bodies here in Miami and the Miami-Dade county is managed by the Latino community members and it has been obvious to me that if you are a well educated white individual that meets the qualifications that your name is being passed up and not being fairly considered for government positions. When I say well educated, I am talking about having at least a bachelor degree from an accredited college or university. There is no doubt that this is happening in the Miami area and it is wrong.
Since most non-hispanic whites have a history of (a) feeling uncomfortable as a minority and (b) end up leaving town after just a year or two, I might invite them for an interview, but I prefer bilingual (who enjoy speaking Spanish at work), because they would fit in more. Many non hispanic whites who cannot speak Spanish don´t feel comfortable and even get angry about it, and they fall in the above 2 categories. I don´t like the negativity, and I´ve had too many bad experiences of the non hispanic white complaining and trying to impose their own culture on my team, as if spanish speakers are inferior. It´s not like I pass over the CVs of qualified people. I would hire a non hispanic white if they were worldly and could prove they could hack it and not leave in 12 months. The safer bet is to hire a bilingual. African-Americans and Haitians generally seem to fit in well in our organization, and so do people who were born and raised in other countries. Many of these groups love Miami and don´t really have a place to move to up north if they get tired of it, whereas non hispanic whites usually just move back to where they came from. I don´t take too many chances when it comes to hiring, I prefer playing it safe. I rarely get CVs of non hispanic white cadidates who are worldly and see things from a more global perspective as opposed to US-centric. Sure, they say they want to learn, but in my experience, you give them a chance and they still don´t get it.
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Old 08-19-2012, 10:55 PM
 
18,082 posts, read 18,688,177 times
Reputation: 25191
Quote:
Originally Posted by palermodude View Post
Since most non-hispanic whites have a history of (a) feeling uncomfortable as a minority and (b) end up leaving town after just a year or two, I might invite them for an interview, but I prefer bilingual (who enjoy speaking Spanish at work), because they would fit in more. Many non hispanic whites who cannot speak Spanish don´t feel comfortable and even get angry about it, and they fall in the above 2 categories. I don´t like the negativity, and I´ve had too many bad experiences of the non hispanic white complaining and trying to impose their own culture on my team, as if spanish speakers are inferior. It´s not like I pass over the CVs of qualified people. I would hire a non hispanic white if they were worldly and could prove they could hack it and not leave in 12 months. The safer bet is to hire a bilingual. African-Americans and Haitians generally seem to fit in well in our organization, and so do people who were born and raised in other countries. Many of these groups love Miami and don´t really have a place to move to up north if they get tired of it, whereas non hispanic whites usually just move back to where they came from. I don´t take too many chances when it comes to hiring, I prefer playing it safe. I rarely get CVs of non hispanic white cadidates who are worldly and see things from a more global perspective as opposed to US-centric. Sure, they say they want to learn, but in my experience, you give them a chance and they still don´t get it.
So basically you are admitting to hiring discrimination, good job.
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Old 09-09-2012, 08:17 PM
 
36 posts, read 75,188 times
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So, I have a question...Where does one learn Spanish in Miami? I'm interested in learning the proper way to speak and write Spanish. Why do I say proper way, you ask? Well, because I know many many people here in Miami who rely on web translation pages to get their message across whether written or spoken. Yet, they are the same "bilingual" folk who were hired over me. They are second and third generation and have never written a sentence in Spanish their entire lives and speak mostly Span-glish.

I am a Miami native whose father was Puerto Rican and whose mother is American. I did not learn one single word of Spanish from my father. I have suffered growing up in Miami not speaking Spanish and later in life in the workforce. Living here for 30 years, I currently understand 70% of spoken Spanish (depending on the speaker's accent). I would also like to be able to teach my children proper Spanish.
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Old 09-09-2012, 10:23 PM
 
Location: Miami/ Washington DC
4,836 posts, read 11,955,603 times
Reputation: 2589
Quote:
Originally Posted by NATEBEAR View Post
So, I have a question...Where does one learn Spanish in Miami? I'm interested in learning the proper way to speak and write Spanish. Why do I say proper way, you ask? Well, because I know many many people here in Miami who rely on web translation pages to get their message across whether written or spoken. Yet, they are the same "bilingual" folk who were hired over me. They are second and third generation and have never written a sentence in Spanish their entire lives and speak mostly Span-glish.

I am a Miami native whose father was Puerto Rican and whose mother is American. I did not learn one single word of Spanish from my father. I have suffered growing up in Miami not speaking Spanish and later in life in the workforce. Living here for 30 years, I currently understand 70% of spoken Spanish (depending on the speaker's accent). I would also like to be able to teach my children proper Spanish.
Rosseta stone, community college classes, public school and private school will teach your children Spanish also.
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