Spanish in Miami (Doral: college, salary, law)

[vpcats]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

TO ME, it seems like the more front-line people (Accounts, BizDev) tend to be Hispanic. I don't know if this is coincidence or designed, just what I noticed.

Planet......where I work, the front line people are 98% hispanic, or at least bilingual.

Here's my thought. The front line personnel (receptionists, secretaries, clerks, etc.) are usually lower paid (which is totally wrong in my book because they can make or break your company) but they are lower paid because they USUALLY don't have as much formal education or there is a lack of true fluency in one of the languages. They may not have the Bachelor's or the MBA or the CPA, etc. but they are the first connection to the company.

Those with the alphabet after the name usually get stuck in the back end for the real important stuff.

[vpcats]

Originally Posted by sav858

Do latinos that fall into that 5% category have issues with not being able to speak spanish? Just curious if you know of any experiences with people like that since that is the category I fall under pretty much.

I think it's probably more of an issue with those latinos who do speak Spanish and can't comprehend why a latino would not speak Spanish.

I know people who think those people are clowns.

Personally, I think two languages are better than one and if you have the opportunity to be bilingual, you're much better off in the long-run. Someone with a hispanic/latino background, if Spanish was spoken in the home where he/she was raised, I think you should know Spanish and if you don't, it should be very easy to learn it even after the fact if you heard it spoken as a child.

[planetsurf]

Originally Posted by vpcats

Planet......where I work, the front line people are 98% hispanic, or at least bilingual.

I was refering to the more professional jobs vs people answering the phones, EVERY one of them is ABSOLUTELY bilingual (actually I think tri-lingual).

My point was that there is a difference between some Spanish, fluent Spanish and REALLY fluent Spanish. In my DW's current job, every "front line" person in there is comfortable in Spanish (there are some back-room people who I'm sure aren't). Some of them are "native speakers," some learned later. Some need to (and do) speak "perfect" Spanish, some can and do get by with ok Spanish. That was the experience in 4 other companies she worked for too.

And when I say front-line, I'm talking about people who work in Marketing, supply, BizDev, sales, etc ... I don't want to say WHO she works for, but it's a name everybody would have heard of. They are a California based company and the office here is in charge of LatAm opperations - everything from logistics to marketing to sales. I don't believe there is ANY retail customer contact, it's all their sales channel and partners who call in - ALL of them in Spanish or Portugues.

And to some comments, no, you can't tell a "Hispanic" just from their last name so it's isn't a "race thing" (I think we are over the "does Hispanic mean short and brown" thing -- at least in Miami).

In MY experience, when someone is looking for a "native speaker," they are looking for someone who is TRULY fluent and/or someone who needs to get the subtleties of the culture. Maybe they really need to speak "perfect" Spanish, maybe they just don't want to deal with any perceived potential "weirdness." Who knows?
Not saying there aren't exceptions or prejudice, OF COURSE there is ... but I'm referring mostly to the larger companies here.

[big mean bear]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

I was refering to the more professional jobs vs people answering the phones, EVERY one of them is ABSOLUTELY bilingual (actually I think tri-lingual).

My point was that there is a difference between some Spanish, fluent Spanish and REALLY fluent Spanish. In my DW's current job, every "front line" person in there is comfortable in Spanish (there are some back-room people who I'm sure aren't). Some of them are "native speakers," some learned later. Some need to (and do) speak "perfect" Spanish, some can and do get by with ok Spanish. That was the experience in 4 other companies she worked for too.

And when I say front-line, I'm talking about people who work in Marketing, supply, BizDev, sales, etc ... I don't want to say WHO she works for, but it's a name everybody would have heard of. They are a California based company and the office here is in charge of LatAm opperations - everything from logistics to marketing to sales. I don't believe there is ANY retail customer contact, it's all their sales channel and partners who call in - ALL of them in Spanish or Portugues.

And to some comments, no, you can't tell a "Hispanic" just from their last name so it's isn't a "race thing" (I think we are over the "does Hispanic mean short and brown" thing -- at least in Miami).

In MY experience, when someone is looking for a "native speaker," they are looking for someone who is TRULY fluent and/or someone who needs to get the subtleties of the culture. Maybe they really need to speak "perfect" Spanish, maybe they just don't want to deal with any perceived potential "weirdness." Who knows?
Not saying there aren't exceptions or prejudice, OF COURSE there is ... but I'm referring mostly to the larger companies here.

If current immigration trends continue, and if people continue to not assimilate, there will probably be legislation to protect English speakers written into law. This will be bad for everybody, and if it happens, it certainly won't be because of Miami, it will be because of the Southern border with Mexico. Nobody cares about how people 'feel' in Miami anymore. All those folks already caught the train out. Miami should get ahead of the ball and figure out these stupid language issues (Learn English) before laws are created that shake up the fiesta down here. That might disrupt our little consumption economy...

[planetsurf]

Originally Posted by big mean bear

If current immigration trends continue, and if people continue to not assimilate, there will probably be legislation to protect English speakers written into law. This will be bad for everybody, and if it happens, it certainly won't be because of Miami, it will be because of the Southern border with Mexico. Nobody cares about how people 'feel' in Miami anymore. All those folks already caught the train out. Miami should get ahead of the ball and figure out these stupid language issues (Learn English) before laws are created that shake up the fiesta down here. That might disrupt our little consumption economy...

I don't disagree but I'll stick to my position that EVERY kid born here to parents that don't speak English WILL and DOES speak English. It's just what happens to immigrants.

Just to clarify -- not sure you meant to "quote" my post or you misunderstood -- EVERY single person there speaks perfect English, a few are even Ivy Leaguers. This is a VERY big, VERY well known company that very qualified people go out of their way to work for that has operations globally. The entire hiring process is in English (other than some "testing" of language ability) -- DW even had to fly out to California for orientation. Day-to-day stuff is in English -- some of the staff are more comfortable in English, some Spanish but the lingua franca in their office is mostly English with some Spanglish. I KNOW some folks talk to each other in Spanish, but unless they are dealing with a customer, most things are in English.

Their office HERE (about 50 people) deals EXCLUSIVELY with LatAm companies IN LatAm, NOT Miami companies other than some support stuff (MarCom firms for example). If a customer is calling, they are calling from, Santiago, Bueno Aires, SP, Panama, Mexico City...

THIS example is NOT your typical Import/Export business in a warehouse behind MIA or some restaurant in Hialeah -- that's an entirely different set of examples.

[big mean bear]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

I don't disagree but I'll stick to my position that EVERY kid born here to parents that don't speak English WILL and DOES speak English. It's just what happens to immigrants.

Of course... it's what happens... Trust me, most my friends here are a product of this

I just think it sucks when you can't get a job in the Miami, which is arguably U.S. territory because you can't speak Spanish. This happens at companies where managers feel you might 'disrupt the culture' of the workplace by not being able to hold your own in Spanish. The thing about this situation is that it is shameful for gringos and gringas to fight this or vote for politicians who will protect thier rights... Anybody who actually cared about this subject has either left or they are too rich living on Star, Palm, or Hibiscus Islands to care if everybody speaks Spanish...

[planetsurf]

Originally Posted by big mean bear

Of course... it's what happens... Trust me, most my friends here are a product of this

I just think it sucks when you can't get a job in the Miami, which is arguably U.S. territory because you can't speak Spanish. This happens at companies where managers feel you might 'disrupt the culture' of the workplace by not being able to hold your own in Spanish. The thing about this situation is that it is shameful for gringos and gringas to fight this or vote for politicians who will protect thier rights... Anybody who actually cared about this subject has either left or they are too rich living on Star, Palm, or Hibiscus Islands to care if everybody speaks Spanish...

You CAN get a job without Spanish, but it IS harder, sometimes MUCH.
You're right, it sucks and it isn't right in MANY (not all, never all) examples.

Personally I've been VERY frustrated in the past b/c of this but I've never failed to get a job.

BUT I would have been able to get VERY cool jobs in the past if my Spanish was better -- but that's MY fault and weakness, not Miami's. (Again, jobs dealing with LatAm. They were HQed in Miami BECAUSE they could find qualified bilingual folks, not the other way around.)

[vpcats]

Well guys....My employer employs about 8,000 employees (run on words there).

You can bet your last dollar that there are quite a few, a lot, many many, here who don't speak a lick of Spanish.

[Luiso]

Originally Posted by vpcats

I think it's probably more of an issue with those latinos who do speak Spanish and can't comprehend why a latino would not speak Spanish.

I know people who think those people are clowns.

Personally, I think two languages are better than one and if you have the opportunity to be bilingual, you're much better off in the long-run. Someone with a hispanic/latino background, if Spanish was spoken in the home where he/she was raised, I think you should know Spanish and if you don't, it should be very easy to learn it even after the fact if you heard it spoken as a child.

I must admit I am one of those people.
I can not comprehend being Hispanic and not speaking Spanish and I am from PA have only been here 2 years.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by vpcats

I think it's probably more of an issue with those latinos who do speak Spanish and can't comprehend why a latino would not speak Spanish.

I know people who think those people are clowns.

just for clarification, the latinos who don't speak spanish are percieved as "clowns" by some? Or is it the people who look down on latinos for not knowing spanish are percieved as clowns?

Personally, I think two languages are better than one and if you have the opportunity to be bilingual, you're much better off in the long-run. Someone with a hispanic/latino background, if Spanish was spoken in the home where he/she was raised, I think you should know Spanish and if you don't, it should be very easy to learn it even after the fact if you heard it spoken as a child.

I agree and really do want to learn it except it won't be easy for me b/c nobody in my family speaks spanish. So it might take a while to learn it and I was just curious to the experiances of latinos like myself, hoping it wont be too much of an issue.