Miami Safety (Hialeah, Hollywood, Kendall: renting, townhouse, neighborhood)

[slough]

Originally Posted by Miss Bentley

I am interested in moving to Miami, but everyone just keeps telling me how "dangerous" it is. Well of course, its a city! Isn't it just like any other big city? Full of crime? Well its starting to get to me so I need to know if its really that bad?

I lived in Miami (Kendall) for 25 years and I was never a victim of a major crime. I had more happen to me in a week in a small town that I visited than I had in all those years. With that said, I knew of many people who were victims of very violent crimes. I've seen shootouts, masked men run through the backyard with guns, cars being stolen, assaults, etc. This "paradise" can get crazy real fast. Most people I know have carrying permits because of this.

The thing that I think separates Miami from other cities is that crime is not concentrated to certain areas. Sure you have parts of the city where most of the violent crimes occur, but even the better parts of town don't "feel" safe and are really not, especially at night. Anything can happen in any city, but most cities have suburbs that happen to be some of the safest places to live in the country. I don't think Miami has that. The first thing I noticed when I moved away to another big city is that I was acting like a thug. That's how I learned to keep safe in Miami, by acting tough. I can now actually relax a bit, smile, and say hello to people in the street without worrying too much about becoming a victim. It's really sad actually.

Another thing I noticed is that burglar bars are almost a necessity in Miami if you don't want to get burglarized. It might take years and years, but you can expect it to happen eventually. In other cities, bars on the windows mean that you're in a bad part of town. Houses in the better neighborhoods generally do not have them.

I guess I would describe Miami as having crime spread relatively even across the map with a few places being more dangerous and a few being safer. On the other hand, most other cities have places that are very dangerous and others that are very safe.

Don't get me wrong, I love Miami and I'll probably end up moving back there someday. Someone suggested living in a secured condo on Brickell, which I think is a good suggestion if you're worried about property crime.

[compelled to reply]

Originally Posted by slough

Another thing I noticed is that burglar bars are almost a necessity in Miami if you don't want to get burglarized. It might take years and years, but you can expect it to happen eventually. In other cities, bars on the windows mean that you're in a bad part of town. Houses in the better neighborhoods generally do not have them.

.

The burglar bars are more of a Latin thing than a burglar thing. Some of Miami's "safest" neighborhoods are loaded with burglar bars and it's worst don't have any.

Anything can happen in any city, but most cities have suburbs that happen to be some of the safest places to live in the country.

Yeah, usually an hour or two outside of the major city in a rush hour commute. What is Weston, Pembroke Pines, Cooper City, Coral Springs, Plantation, Sunrise, Boca Raton, etc?

[slough]

Originally Posted by compelled to reply

Yeah, usually an hour or two outside of the major city in a rush hour commute. What is Weston, Pembroke Pines, Cooper City, Coral Springs, Plantation, Sunrise, Boca Raton, etc?

I totally disagree. All those places are not Miami and they are not even in Dade County. That's like trying to claim that Irvine and the rest of south Orange County is Los Angeles. Let's take L.A. County as an example. Cities and neighborhoods that I would consider safer than almost any place in Miami include Agoura Hills, Calabasas, Malibu, Topanga, Santa Clarita, Sherman Oaks, Santa Monica, Pacific Palisades, Brentwood, Westwood, Beverly Hills, Marina del Rey, Manhattan Beach, Palos Verdes, Hollywood Hills, South Pasadena, etc. I realize that L.A. County is much larger than Dade; however, many of the communities that I just listed are within 10 minutes of very shady areas.

What criminal is going to want to drive from Miami to northern Broward to commit a crime with the way gas prices are these days? Even when gas was $1/gallon, most people I knew in Miami never travelled to Broward, except to go to concerts.

There ARE nice places in Dade County but like I said before, crime tends to spread out in Miami moreso than in most other cities.

[DCkid]

Follow by this rule.

Identify 27th Avenue. Call it the redzone. As you move further from 27th Avenue, in either direction (east or west), the neighborhoods become safer.

[planetsurf]

Originally Posted by slough

I totally disagree. All those places are not Miami and they are not even in Dade County. That's like trying to claim that Irvine and the rest of south Orange County is Los Angeles. Let's take L.A. County as an example. Cities and neighborhoods that I would consider safer than almost any place in Miami include Agoura Hills, Calabasas, Malibu, Topanga, Santa Clarita, Sherman Oaks, Santa Monica, Pacific Palisades, Brentwood, Westwood, Beverly Hills, Marina del Rey, Manhattan Beach, Palos Verdes, Hollywood Hills, South Pasadena, etc. I realize that L.A. County is much larger than Dade; however, many of the communities that I just listed are within 10 minutes of very shady areas.

What criminal is going to want to drive from Miami to northern Broward to commit a crime with the way gas prices are these days? Even when gas was $1/gallon, most people I knew in Miami never travelled to Broward, except to go to concerts.

There ARE nice places in Dade County but like I said before, crime tends to spread out in Miami moreso than in most other cities.

While I don't disagree with your basic point, I'd be careful with FACTS.
Let's compare crime statistics for Santa Monica vs Coral Gables -- VERY central location in Miami.

CGables has a slightly above national average Crime Index of 299, S Monica a 376! Heck, West Miami had an even lower rating, 214 for 2006!

Crime in Santa Monica by Year

Type19992000200120022003200420052006Murders12282242 per 100,0001.12.12.39.22.32.34.52.3Rapes2931233521292126 per 100,00031.933.326.940.223.932.923.829.3Robberies279266313299242244241256 per 100,000307.2285.8365.5343.0275.9276.7272.6289.0Assaults319343316317290282285306 per 100,000351.2368.5369.0363.6330.6319.8322.4345.4Burglaries560603720739761752788733 per 100,000616.5647.8840.7847.7867.6852.9891.3827.4Thefts3,1202,9623,0162,8112,7162,3702,2862,187 per 100,0003434.83182.23521.43224.63096.62688.12585.82 468.6Auto thefts575481515492466418422394 per 100,000633.0516.8601.3564.4531.3474.1477.3444.7Arson7458444848121612 per 100,00081.562.351.455.154.713.618.113.5City-data.com crime index (higher means more crime, U.S. average = 287.3)421.3404.3457.4459.6399.7383.0378.3376.0

Crime in Coral Gables by Year

Type19992000200120022003200420052006Murders00113100 per 100,0000.00.02.32.36.92.30.00.0Rapes7151131044 per 100,00016.92.211.524.96.923.09.29.2Robberies6558855568584035 per 100,000157.0129.2196.1124.5156.6133.492.180.3Assaults114174160117849110879 per 100,000275.4387.6369.1264.8193.5209.3248.8181.2Burglaries526500491485440489471366 per 100,0001270.71113.81132.81097.81013.61124.61084.88 39.6Thefts2,3451,9971,8751,9781,9751,8321,6131,653 per 100,0005665.24448.54325.94477.14549.54213.03715.13 791.8Auto thefts350214221216229176124114 per 100,000845.6476.7509.9488.9527.5404.7285.6261.5Arson44402361 per 100,0009.78.99.20.04.66.913.82.3City-data.com crime index (higher means more crime, U.S. average = 287.3)498.9412.1439.6409.8400.2384.5332.2299.0

Key Biscayne - 142 VS Beverly Hills - 260

Let's go out a bit north in LA to Glendale VS north of Dade to Cooper City!
Glendale - 144 VS Cooper City - 157

You can find lots of examples if you play with actual numbers that go both ways, but I think I made the point that Miami isn't THAT different.

[slough]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

While I don't disagree with your basic point, I'd be careful with FACTS.
Let's compare crime statistics for Santa Monica vs Coral Gables -- VERY central location in Miami.

CGables has a slightly above national average Crime Index of 299, S Monica a 376!

Yes, after I posted that, I realized that Santa Monica was probably the weakest evidence that I presented. I will say that much of that crime is concentrated in the Pico neighborhood, which has gangs at war with others outside of the city. The rest includes a lot of homeless vs. homeless crime. Most of the city is very safe, especially North of Montana and North of Wilshire, including downtown to some extent. You can have one neighborhood that is dangerous and another that is probably the safest in the L.A. Basin (North of Montana) within one mile of each other. Coconut Grove is similar, but even the best parts are nowhere near as safe as North of Montana.

[slough]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

Key Biscayne - 142 VS Beveryl Hills - 260

You can find examples that go the other way, but I think I made the point that Miami isn't THAT different.

Haha, well you have a point but Key Biscayne is pretty isolated and it has a pop <10,000 with only one road in and out. Same thing could be said for Star Island! Or Sanibel Island next to Ft. Myers.

The reality is that >99% of Dade County residents do not live on a small, "isolated" island like that. On the other hand, there has to be 100,000s living in the areas that I mentioned in L.A.

[big mean bear]

Originally Posted by DCkid

Follow by this rule.

Identify 27th Avenue. Call it the redzone. As you move further from 27th Avenue, in either direction (east or west), the neighborhoods become safer.

Interesting. I'll have to think about that.

[planetsurf]

Originally Posted by slough

Haha, well you have a point but Key Biscayne is pretty isolated and it has a pop <10,000 with only one road in and out. Same thing could be said for Star Island! Or Sanibel Island next to Ft. Myers.

The reality is that >99% of Dade County residents do not live on a small, "isolated" island like that. On the other hand, there has to be 100,000s living in the areas that I mentioned in L.A.

You're right -- how about West Miami (far from an island)? It has a lower number than Beverly Hills!
How about Malibu -- much more isolated and a better comparison to Key Biscayne - 174.

My point isn't to quibble about numbers. Just to point out that generally, by the numbers, Miami and LA are pretty darn similar no matter how it "feels."

[slough]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

You're right -- how about West Miami (far from an island)? It has a lower number than Beverly Hills!
How about Malibu -- much more isolated and a better comparison to Key Biscayne - 174.

My point isn't to quibble about numbers. Just to point out that generally, by the numbers, Miami and LA are pretty darn similar no matter how it "feels."

You can't compare Beverly Hills to West Miami. West Miami has a population around 5,000 and it's very residential while Beverly Hills has a large commercial district and attracts at least twice as many tourists from L.A. and beyond each day. I'd say it's daily population is around 100,000 even though it is listed at ~30,000, which means you should probably divide its total crime index by three to get the true number. Regardless of the crime data on this site, Beverly Hills is much safer than West Miami. I've lived in or near both places.

Besides, I'm not trying to argue whether one place is safer than the other. What I am arguing is that crime in Miami tends to fade in and out slowly as you go across the map but is generally present in a significant amount throughout all communities. In L.A., this is not so. There are much sharper contrasts here between the really bad and the really good, which may not be a good thing by the way.