Florida's fastest dying suburb (Hialeah, Carol City: to rent, credit card, big house)

[noland123]

I'll go with Yeehaw Junction since the question is kind of vague.

[joelibyan]

Originally Posted by planetsurf

In terms of dying towns? I don't think most of SoFla has it that bad. I'd be more suspect of some of the overpriced, created "towns" north of Vero or around Ft Myers. The retirees nest eggs to pay to get into these places just isn't there anymore. And since there is no base population (or very small) existing, no $$ flowing. Builders built using certain $ assumptions (say $300k per unit) and the homes up north that needed to be sold to pay for these dropped 30% in value. Now grandma & grandpa don't have enough booty to retire there anymore so the builder is left holding the bag (or dumping the whole thing).
People that are working are still working (even if struggling). The people who are rich have less, but still have $$. It's the folks JUST getting ready to retire (first of the baby boomers) who are suffering the most. The communities planned for them will suffer the most.

Good call. I forgot about those places. It's the same in Pasco county, north of Tampa, where huge swaths of land were set aside for rows and rows of houses. Now? Thousands of houses and no jobs within 50 miles. City names, strip malls and zip codes were created for towns that didn't exist 10 years ago, and don't look like they're going to last another 5.

[Chelsa1075]

I'm not sure that will necessarily happen. Reason being, taxes for the area will still be on the higher side. I am definitely middle class, but would obviously love to pay 200k for a home versus 300k. I think the people that may bring a neighborhood down, probably can't afford the 200k either.

[CLTKing]

Originally Posted by crisp444

I specifically stated "above SW 152nd Street and west of the Turnpike." . Few people know that the median household income in this country is just $48,000.

Below are the median household incomes in several areas of West Miami-Dade.

The Hammocks: $54,444
Kendale Lakes: $44,156
The Crossings: $55,517
Tamiami: $47,503
Country Walk: $63,689
Three Lakes: $54,830

The numbers show that these areas are solidly middle class.

I don't know of any household making mid $50K a year as a middle class. With that income they can't even afford to pay their taxes annually. My household income was near $100K and I considered myself lower middle class.

[Chelsa1075]

That would be because you and I live in the real world. I live in NYC and with my husband have a combined income of about 170k and I am lower middle class at best, but people see that number and are like why don't you own your own home and on and on. But just to live an average life ie, movies, dinner 2x a month, museum, kids sports, is difficult - never mind adding on a 4k dollar mortgage (ny prices), it is all very difficult. I think the people who do these census' on median incomes live in a fantasy world.

[crisp444]

Not to offend anyone, but whoever thinks that $100,000-$170,000 is "lower middle class" is grossly out of touch with reality, even in New York City. An income like that places one solidly within the ranks of the upper middle class, and beyond that is where upper class begins. I don't understand why many Americans have such an aversion to admitting their wealth. I guess it's all that "everyone is middle class in this country! We're all equal!" BS we are fed no matter if our families our earning $20,000 or $500,000 per year.

Whether you "feel" lower middle class really doesn't affect the actual numbers:
- In 2005, less than 16% of American households had earnings $100,000 or more. (The median number of wage earners in these households was 2).
- Earnings of $157,176 placed you in the top 5% of American households. (Again, the median number of wage earners in these households was 2).
*Notice that these numbers are for households and not for individuals. Two married people making $80,000 each would form a household that would be in the top 5% when measuring for annual earnings.

You asked for the "real world," Chelsa, so there ya go. Most people in the "real world" can only dream of being able to afford a $4,000/month mortgage payment.

Source: US Census Bureau

[TriMT7]

Originally Posted by Chelsa1075

That would be because you and I live in the real world. I live in NYC and with my husband have a combined income of about 170k and I am lower middle class at best, but people see that number and are like why don't you own your own home and on and on. But just to live an average life ie, movies, dinner 2x a month, museum, kids sports, is difficult - never mind adding on a 4k dollar mortgage (ny prices), it is all very difficult. I think the people who do these census' on median incomes live in a fantasy world.

No way! Lower middle class are families making 25k year, not 170k!!! At 170k you can afford a $4000/month mortgage and be fine, especially if you don't add luxury car payments, etc. on top of it. 170k/year is 14k gross... even at 35% taxes, that's 9k take home.

[joelibyan]

Originally Posted by Chelsa1075

That would be because you and I live in the real world. I live in NYC and with my husband have a combined income of about 170k and I am lower middle class at best, but people see that number and are like why don't you own your own home and on and on. But just to live an average life ie, movies, dinner 2x a month, museum, kids sports, BMW, first class air travel, daily visits to the organic farmers market, yankees box seat season tickets, is difficult - never mind adding on a 4k dollar mortgage (ny prices), it is all very difficult. I think the people who do these census' on median incomes live in a fantasy world.

Fixed.

[♥♥PRINC3Ss♥♥]

Just because some homes are small it doesn't mean that they are not desirable. It really depends on the neighborhood.

Ex: Older homes in Carol City and some parts of Hialeah have huge lots and I bet you a lot of people would rather live in a zero lot home in west kendall than in those places. Also many of the newer homes have HOA.

[Wild Style]

Originally Posted by joelibyan

Yeah... Define "close up shop." Are we talking ghost towns a la the American West?
A few things, however...
- A new plaza zoned for NW 137 av @ 836 has been scrapped. Target, Kohls and Lowes all pulled out, according to yesterday's Herald. Stuff like this is happening all over.
- There is talk of the suburbs becoming the new ghettos. Urban life was the norm up until WWII, until the dawn of the era of the suburb during the baby boom. Once the rich and middle class urbanites left, the vacuum was filled with lower income residents. There is talk now of the trend reversing, thus leaving the empty suburban homes for lower incomes. You can see it now in west Dade. Give it some more time.

If any of you get a chance watch a documentary called "The End of Suburbia". I think it will scare the hell out of you. Especially when you realize it happened before all this stuff now started, yet a almost everything it says is playing out :S